Kiyoat Husker Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 I think the general message here is that being forced to rely on walk-ons is a statement to poor recruiting. But, efficiently using walk-ons, as TO did and Wisconsin does, is a smart way to overcome recruiting disadvantages. Wisconsin, Michigan State and Oregon are three programs that have consistently outperformed their recruiting rankings in recent years. Wisconsin does it with System and walk-ons Michigan State does it with Superior Coaching and Defensive System Oregon does it with Offensive System and Nike So how can Nebraska do it under Riley? - Hopefully better coaching and recruiting. We have to be better than Bo's 29th for that to improve 1 Quote Link to comment
84HuskerLaw Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 There is nothing wrong with walk ons and they can certainly help a program build and remain strong as they create numbers allowing for more practice teams, etc. You need to be able to practice against people comparable to those you will play against in games. TO used walks on primarily for practice players but some walk ons became starters. The Macovicka boys were shining examples. Small town Nebraska guys that grew up big time husker fans in a husker family. They were also great athletes who didn't want to go anywhere else and because they came from such small schools, were not going to be recruited for scholarships anywhere major. It doesn't matter if walk on or scholie, the player should play and travel, etc. based on merit as a player. You don't reward those you gave a scholarship to by giving them playing time too. They earn it. All players should have equal shot at all aspects of team participation. You don't guarantee playing time to get a player unless you intend to back that guaranty up with playing time. And, of course, that is very risky and foolish. They player may not be the player you had wanted or expected. Never make promises you will regret. That is the danger of the Big Ten's new guaranteed scholarships for 4 years to athletes. Athletes need the incentive to perform while in school. Quote Link to comment
Moiraine Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 You're also lying with statistics, but... "Let's take the number of walk-ons Wisconsin played when they were up by 58 points and compare that to the number of walk-ons Nebraska brought to their biggest non-con away game where they were an underdog. See, they're equal. " So you're saying that Wisconsin will play walkons ahead of scholarship athletes? That sounds like a good strategy for recruiting. smh They played a total of 46 scholarship players and 18 former walkons in a blowout home game. The Huskers played 41 scholarship players and 10 former walkons in a close away game. What is your takeaway from this? They look awfully similar to me. Way too similar to justify all the chicken little posts about 24/79 yesterday. Go ahead and do some of your own analaysis on a close Wisconsin road game. Or just whine about numbers that don't fit your agenda. They're not similar. You are not going to get this published. On a serious note, if you're trying to prove those people wrong, it's your responsibility to provide the data. Good data, not data on two completely different types of games. 2 Quote Link to comment
GBRedneck Posted September 22, 2015 Author Share Posted September 22, 2015 You're also lying with statistics, but... "Let's take the number of walk-ons Wisconsin played when they were up by 58 points and compare that to the number of walk-ons Nebraska brought to their biggest non-con away game where they were an underdog. See, they're equal. " So you're saying that Wisconsin will play walkons ahead of scholarship athletes? That sounds like a good strategy for recruiting. smh They played a total of 46 scholarship players and 18 former walkons in a blowout home game. The Huskers played 41 scholarship players and 10 former walkons in a close away game. What is your takeaway from this? They look awfully similar to me. Way too similar to justify all the chicken little posts about 24/79 yesterday. Go ahead and do some of your own analaysis on a close Wisconsin road game. Or just whine about numbers that don't fit your agenda. They're not similar. You are not going to get this published. On a serious note, if you're trying to prove those people wrong, it's your responsibility to provide the data. Good data, not data on two completely different types of games. Maybe you didn't read the whole thread. In Wisconsin's road game (neutral field) against Bama (where they trailed 28-10 after three quarters), Wisconsin played 50 total players. 12 of them were former walkons. In Nebraska's road game against Miami (where they trailed 30-10 after three quarters), Nebraska played 51 total players. 10 of them were former walkons. Is that similar enough for ya? Quote Link to comment
StPaulHusker Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 You're also lying with statistics, but... "Let's take the number of walk-ons Wisconsin played when they were up by 58 points and compare that to the number of walk-ons Nebraska brought to their biggest non-con away game where they were an underdog. See, they're equal. " So you're saying that Wisconsin will play walkons ahead of scholarship athletes? That sounds like a good strategy for recruiting. smh They played a total of 46 scholarship players and 18 former walkons in a blowout home game. The Huskers played 41 scholarship players and 10 former walkons in a close away game. What is your takeaway from this? They look awfully similar to me. Way too similar to justify all the chicken little posts about 24/79 yesterday. Go ahead and do some of your own analaysis on a close Wisconsin road game. Or just whine about numbers that don't fit your agenda. They're not similar. You are not going to get this published. On a serious note, if you're trying to prove those people wrong, it's your responsibility to provide the data. Good data, not data on two completely different types of games. Maybe you didn't read the whole thread. In Wisconsin's road game (neutral field) against Bama (where they trailed 28-10 after three quarters), Wisconsin played 50 total players. 12 of them were former walkons. In Nebraska's road game against Miami (where they trailed 30-10 after three quarters), Nebraska played 51 total players. 10 of them were former walkons. Is that similar enough for ya? Both teams lost. So I am not sure what point you are trying to prove. 3 Quote Link to comment
GBRedneck Posted September 22, 2015 Author Share Posted September 22, 2015 You're also lying with statistics, but... "Let's take the number of walk-ons Wisconsin played when they were up by 58 points and compare that to the number of walk-ons Nebraska brought to their biggest non-con away game where they were an underdog. See, they're equal. " So you're saying that Wisconsin will play walkons ahead of scholarship athletes? That sounds like a good strategy for recruiting. smh They played a total of 46 scholarship players and 18 former walkons in a blowout home game. The Huskers played 41 scholarship players and 10 former walkons in a close away game. What is your takeaway from this? They look awfully similar to me. Way too similar to justify all the chicken little posts about 24/79 yesterday. Go ahead and do some of your own analaysis on a close Wisconsin road game. Or just whine about numbers that don't fit your agenda. They're not similar. You are not going to get this published. On a serious note, if you're trying to prove those people wrong, it's your responsibility to provide the data. Good data, not data on two completely different types of games. Maybe you didn't read the whole thread. In Wisconsin's road game (neutral field) against Bama (where they trailed 28-10 after three quarters), Wisconsin played 50 total players. 12 of them were former walkons. In Nebraska's road game against Miami (where they trailed 30-10 after three quarters), Nebraska played 51 total players. 10 of them were former walkons. Is that similar enough for ya? Both teams lost. So I am not sure what point you are trying to prove. sigh Read the title of the thread. Read the OP. People were freaking out about the scholie vs walkon ration on the travel roster for the Miami game. Turns out with a little digging, we find out the ratio is right in line with our division nemesis, Wisconsin. HTH Quote Link to comment
commando Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 the point fo the thread seems to be that all schools (except apparently alabama) are very reliant on the walk on programs. Quote Link to comment
DomiNUs Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 This thread actually turned into something that is quite interesting. Which teams play more walkons, and at what point do they play? It would be interesting to find out which teams are doing more with less (Wisconsin) and which teams are just doing more with more (Alabama). At least on a larger scale than what has already been done here. Quote Link to comment
knapplc Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Walkons should be used to augment a roster, not as a necessity when recruiting fails. 1 Quote Link to comment
StPaulHusker Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 You're also lying with statistics, but... "Let's take the number of walk-ons Wisconsin played when they were up by 58 points and compare that to the number of walk-ons Nebraska brought to their biggest non-con away game where they were an underdog. See, they're equal. " So you're saying that Wisconsin will play walkons ahead of scholarship athletes? That sounds like a good strategy for recruiting. smh They played a total of 46 scholarship players and 18 former walkons in a blowout home game. The Huskers played 41 scholarship players and 10 former walkons in a close away game. What is your takeaway from this? They look awfully similar to me. Way too similar to justify all the chicken little posts about 24/79 yesterday. Go ahead and do some of your own analaysis on a close Wisconsin road game. Or just whine about numbers that don't fit your agenda. They're not similar. You are not going to get this published. On a serious note, if you're trying to prove those people wrong, it's your responsibility to provide the data. Good data, not data on two completely different types of games. Maybe you didn't read the whole thread. In Wisconsin's road game (neutral field) against Bama (where they trailed 28-10 after three quarters), Wisconsin played 50 total players. 12 of them were former walkons. In Nebraska's road game against Miami (where they trailed 30-10 after three quarters), Nebraska played 51 total players. 10 of them were former walkons. Is that similar enough for ya? Both teams lost. So I am not sure what point you are trying to prove. sigh Read the title of the thread. Read the OP. People were freaking out about the scholie vs walkon ration on the travel roster for the Miami game. Turns out with a little digging, we find out the ratio is right in line with our division nemesis, Wisconsin. HTH Well. As long as Wisconsin does it. I guess it's okay. Quote Link to comment
GBRedneck Posted September 23, 2015 Author Share Posted September 23, 2015 I don't have time to do Alabama's entire roster. I looked at their starters against Wisconsin, and none of them were walk-ons. They all had a ridiculous number of stars and were "the best player in X state" bap bap bap. Here's their participation list from the Wisconsin game. If someone wants to do the non-starters, they're welcome to join the fun. Offense Pos ## Offense LT 74 Robinson, Cam LG 71 Pierschbacher C 70 Kelly, Ryan RG 50 Taylor, A. RT 76 Jackson, D. TE 88 Howard, O.J. QB 14 Coker, Jake RB 17 Drake, Kenyan RB 2 Henry, Derrick WR 8 Foster, Robert WR 13 Stewart, A. Defense Pos ## Defense DE 86 Robinson, A. NG 95 Lake, Darren DE 90 Reed, Jarran SLB 25 Lee, Dillon MLB 19 Ragland, Reggie WLB 20 Hamilton, S. JLB 30 Devall, Denzel CB 5 Jones, Cyrus SS 4 Jackson, Eddie FS 24 Matias-Smith, G CB 26 Humphrey, M. Other participants: 1-Black, Chris, 1B-Harrison, R., 3A-Ridley, Calvin, 3B-Miller, C., 3-Sylve, Bradley, 6-Jones, Hootie, 7A-Sims, Cam, 7-Brown, Tony, 9B-Payne, Daron, 9-Hand, Da'Shawn, 10-Foster, Reuben, 11-Morris, Alec, 15-Scott, JK, 16-Mullaney, R., 18-Bateman, Cooper, 21-Smith, Maurice, 22-Anderson, Ryan, 27-Burgess-Becker, 29-Fitzpatrick, M., 32-Evans, Rashaan, 34-Harris, Damien, 42-Holcombe, Keith, 46-Nysewander, M., 54-Tomlinson, D., 55-Mazza, Cole, 56-Williams, Tim, 57-Pettway, D.J., 58-Greene, Brandon, 59-Warmack, Dallas, 63-Hassenauer, J., 66-Cotton, Lester, 69-Frazier, Joshua, 75-Bozeman, B., 83-Flournoy-Smith, 84-Hentges, Hale, 87-Barrineau, P., 93-Allen, Jonathan, 94-Ball, Dakota, 99-Griffith, Adam. So, Wisconsin played 12 former walkons against Bama, Nebraska played 10 former walkons against Miami, and Bama played 6 former walkons against Wisconsin: Allen, Jonathan, 13 Anderson, Ryan, 12 Ball, Dakota, W Barrineau, P., W Bateman, Cooper, 13 Black, Chris, W Bozeman, B., 13 Brown, Tony, 14 Burgess-Becker, 15 Cotton, Lester, 15 Evans, Rashaan, 14 Fitzpatrick, M., 15 Flournoy-Smith, 14 Foster, Reuben, 13 Frazier, Joshua, 14 Greene, Brandon, 12 Griffith, Adam. 12 Hand, Da'Shawn, 14 Harris, Damien, 15 Harrison, R., 15 Hassenauer, J., 14 Hentges, Hale, 15 Holcombe, Keith, 14 Jones, Hootie, W Mazza, Cole, 13 Miller, C., 14 Morris, Alec, 12 Mullaney, R., W Nysewander, M., W Payne, Daron, 15 Pettway, D.J., 14 Ridley, Calvin, 15 Scott, JK, 14 Sims, Cam, 14 Smith, Maurice, 13 Sylve, Bradley, 11 Tomlinson, D., 12 Warmack, Dallas, 15 Williams, Tim, 13 1 Quote Link to comment
Lyons in the Sea of Red. Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 And overall, who cares. Our recruiting is not that of Bamas nor will it ever be. Just win. Quote Link to comment
RADAR Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 I saw a lot of references to the 24 of 79 players on the Husker travel roster being walkons. ("Oh the horror!!!") I asked several times for the same stats from other teams, because as a standalone number, 24/79 is pretty meaningless. Anyway, I got tired of waiting so I went to compile some numbers on my own. I looked at Wisconsin. Since I couldn't find any travel rosters, I figured I would find a blowout game where a lot of players saw the field and maybe the game participation report would have a similar number of players to the Husker travel roster. The Sept 12 game against Miami(OH) was a 58-0 blowout, and sure enough, they had 64 players that saw the field. I cross referenced that list with their recruiting classes from 2011 - 2015 to include 5th year seniors through true freshman. The results were very similar to the Huskers. Out of 64 who saw the field, 18 were walkons. 18/64 = 28% walkons. Remember, that is the guys that actually played. Our numbers for Miami were 24/79 = 30% walkons, but that is just those who traveled, not necessarily played. So I also checked the Huskers participation report against Miami. The Huskers played 51 total, 10 were walkons. 10/51 = 19.6% So either Wisconsin is in big trouble talent wise, or Riley has a bunch of supporters who are experts in "How to Lie with Statistics". Here are the Wisconsin players marked with either W for walkon, or the year of their recruiting class. Biegel, Hayden 13 Biegel, Vince 12 Brookins, K. 13 Caputo, Michael 11 Cichy, Jack W Connelly, Ryan W Connors, Brett W Deal, Taiwan 14 Deiter, Michael 14 Dixon, D'Cota 14 Dooley, Garret 13 Edwards, TJ 14 Endicott, Andre W Erickson, Alex W Farrar, A. 15 Ferguson, Joe W Figaro, Lubern 14 Fredrick, J. 11 Gaglianone, R. 14 Goldberg, A. 12 Hayes, Jesse 11 Hillary, Darius 11 Hirschfeld, B. 14 Houston, Bart 12 Jacobs, Leon 13 Jamerson, N. 14 James, Alec 13 Jones, Kellen W Jordan, AJ 11 Kapoi, Micah 14 Keefer, Jake 11 Kinlaw, Caleb 14 Love, Reggie 12 Marz, Tyler 11 Maxwell, Jacob 14 McEvoy, Tanner 13 Meyer, Drew W Musso, Leo 12 Neuville, Z. W Obasih, Chikwe 13 Ogunbowale, D. W Orr, Chris 15 Panos, George 14 Peavy, Jazz 13 Rosowski, PJ W Rushing, George 14 Russell, Jack W Saari, Mark W Sagapolu, Olive 15 Schmidt, Logan W Schobert, Joe W Sheehy, Conor 14 Shelton, S. 13 Stave, Joel W Steffes, Eric 11 Straus, Derek W Tindal, Derrick 14 Traylor, Austin 11 Udelhoven, C. W Voltz, Dan 12 Watt, Derek 11 Watt, TJ 13 Wheelwright, R. 13 Williams, W. 1 A crap post, the only thing Nebraska and Wisconsin have in common right now is they are both unranked with average talent. Damon Benning said today on the subject, that if this continued to be case in 2 years, Nebraska is in real trouble. (hense, Nebraska is in real trouble NOW) Quote Link to comment
teachercd Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 With a top notch recruiting staff...I think NU could count on rankings (on a consistent basis) in the top 20...with a lot of top 15's. Quote Link to comment
RADAR Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Walkons should be used to augment a roster, not as a necessity when recruiting fails. True dat! 408 failed the program, Riley is left to fix it. Quote Link to comment
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