Mel Tucker Under Investigation

[ColoradoHusk]

1 minute ago, Mavric said:

 

Technically they can switch teams.  But they're not eligible to play until the next season.  Which is perhaps what you were getting at.

Yes, this is what I am getting at.

[VectorVictor]

19 hours ago, ColoradoHusk said:

Don’t know if you are serious, but players can’t switch teams mid-season. 

They can go into the portal mid-season and get picked up. Just can’t play. 

[ColoradoHusk]

1 hour ago, VectorVictor said:

They can go into the portal mid-season and get picked up. Just can’t play. 

It really doesn’t do any good for players to leave a school midseason, if they can’t play until the next. I know the rule, but can you give examples of guys actually doing it?

[nic]

Mel is standing his ground and accusing MSU of a set up. I think he is right that this isn't title IX. So why did MSU investigate a phone call between two adults? This could get interesting. I still think he is a tool though.

 

"I can only conclude that there is an ulterior motive designed to terminate my contract based on some other factor such as a desire to avoid any Nasser taint, or my race or gender," Tucker wrote.

 

https://www.si.com/college/michiganstate/football/mel-tucker-lawyer-releases-statement-calls-allegations-of-sexual-harassment-completely-false-msu-091123

 

[Ulty]

9 hours ago, nic said:

I think he is right that this isn't title IX.

It's in the ballpark, but this is more of a technicality than anything. Let me help. In 2020, the Dept of Ed narrowed the Title IX definition of sexual harassment. In typical harassment cases, the threshold has always been that the unwelcome conduct must be severe OR pervasive. However, in 2020, the Title IX definition changed sexual harassment to severe AND pervasive AND objectively offensive. Quite honestly, that threshold of evidence is almost impossible to reach. So in response to the new Title IX regulations, most schools adopted the Title IX definitions (because they were required to) but also kept the old definitions as a separate policy violation (because otherwise it would be much more difficult to address sexual misconduct on campus). If it sounds confusing, it is. So I would guess that in this particular case, the allegations did not rise to the Title IX definition of harassment (it was probably severe but not pervasive), so the charges would have been under MSU's non-Title IX definition of sexual harassment. It probably still follows the same investigation and hearing process, but they technically do not call it Title IX. It's still sexual harassment. 

 

9 hours ago, nic said:

So why did MSU investigate a phone call between two adults?

Well, she made a harassment complaint...do you think they should not investigate? 

 

9 hours ago, nic said:

"I can only conclude that there is an ulterior motive designed to terminate my contract based on some other factor such as a desire to avoid any Nasser taint, or my race or gender," Tucker wrote.

Hell yes, MSU wants to "avoid any Nasser taint." That's part of what is so baffling: this guy works for MSU, surely knowing damn well the kind of heavy sexual misconduct baggage that exists at that school, and he decides that it will be okay to jerk off on the phone with a sexual assault educator. The "Nasser taint" overshadows anything that happens at that school, and this is one of the dumbest things that someone could possibly do. And further, for him to bring up his own race and gender in a statement like this, is an extraordinary claim that would require some extraordinary evidence.

[nic]

1 hour ago, Ulty said:

It's in the ballpark, but this is more of a technicality than anything. Let me help. In 2020, the Dept of Ed narrowed the Title IX definition of sexual harassment. In typical harassment cases, the threshold has always been that the unwelcome conduct must be severe OR pervasive. However, in 2020, the Title IX definition changed sexual harassment to severe AND pervasive AND objectively offensive. Quite honestly, that threshold of evidence is almost impossible to reach. So in response to the new Title IX regulations, most schools adopted the Title IX definitions (because they were required to) but also kept the old definitions as a separate policy violation (because otherwise it would be much more difficult to address sexual misconduct on campus). If it sounds confusing, it is. So I would guess that in this particular case, the allegations did not rise to the Title IX definition of harassment (it was probably severe but not pervasive), so the charges would have been under MSU's non-Title IX definition of sexual harassment. It probably still follows the same investigation and hearing process, but they technically do not call it Title IX. It's still sexual harassment. 

 

Well, she made a harassment complaint...do you think they should not investigate? 

 

Hell yes, MSU wants to "avoid any Nasser taint." That's part of what is so baffling: this guy works for MSU, surely knowing damn well the kind of heavy sexual misconduct baggage that exists at that school, and he decides that it will be okay to jerk off on the phone with a sexual assault educator. The "Nasser taint" overshadows anything that happens at that school, and this is one of the dumbest things that someone could possibly do. And further, for him to bring up his own race and gender in a statement like this, is an extraordinary claim that would require some extraordinary evidence.

How could someone be that stupid. I heard this morning that there were over 20 calls between the two of them. Not sure if that’s true. Maybe he worked his way up to jerking off over the phone. 

[Ulty]

6 minutes ago, nic said:

I heard this morning that there were over 20 calls between the two of them. Not sure if that’s true.

If that is true, that means there were at least 20 opportunities for him to realize, and act upon the fact that, in his situation at MSU, under NO circumstances, none whatsoever, should he pursue anything sexual, not even flirting, with this person. 

 

I posted a Choose Your Own Adventure scenario in the Michigan State thread. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. 

[nic]

Sounds like Brenda did not want this public, but someone (looking at you MSU) leaked it.

 

[VectorVictor]

16 hours ago, nic said:

Sounds like Brenda did not want this public, but someone (looking at you MSU) leaked it.

 

This…does not bode well for MSU then. Definitely helps Mel Tucker’s case…

[Ulty]

1 hour ago, VectorVictor said:

Definitely helps Mel Tucker’s case…

How does this help Tucker?

[nic]

3 hours ago, Ulty said:

How does this help Tucker?

I do not know that it helps Tuck, but he will certainly try and get as much of that $95M as he can and try and salvage a reputation. If he can prove 20 plus phone calls over a long period of time it might help, but unless he recorded those conversations or has text messages and pictures from her that back his story, he will be out of luck.

[teachercd]

6 hours ago, nic said:

I do not know that it helps Tuck, but he will certainly try and get as much of that $95M as he can and try and salvage a reputation. If he can prove 20 plus phone calls over a long period of time it might help, but unless he recorded those conversations or has text messages and pictures from her that back his story, he will be out of luck.

Do text messages ever really go away?

[nic]

2 hours ago, teachercd said:

Do text messages ever really go away?

No, but it depends on what they say. Maybe it was..."leave me alone you creep."

[teachercd]

9 hours ago, nic said:

No, but it depends on what they say. Maybe it was..."leave me alone you creep."

Nio, I mean, like my Verizon statement shows me all the texts I send/receive, the time/date and the #.

 

So I know that part never goes away BUT does the content of the text go away? 

[Micheal]

9 hours ago, teachercd said:

Nio, I mean, like my Verizon statement shows me all the texts I send/receive, the time/date and the #.

 

So I know that part never goes away BUT does the content of the text go away? 

I think most cell providers would have the content of traditional text messages. But if it is iMessage, iPhone to iPhone, there isn''t a record I believe. Maybe with Apple but not with the provider.