Trayvon Martin and "Stand Your Ground" in FL

[Huskerzoo]

I think people are losing sight of what this trial was about. In the grand scheme of things, it would seem as though Zimmerman is responsible for the events that led up to Martins death. However, the trial was a murder trial by my understanding.

 

A guy on reddit summarized these facts as to why the jury acquitted Zimmerman.

 

• Because he was the defendant, the jury needed to find his guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. That means they need to be 95%+ sure that Zimmerman: (A) shot Martin; and (B) did not shoot Martin in self-defense.
  

 

I.e., the state has the burden of proving beyond a reasonable doubt that there was no valid self defense.

• 
   
  Zimmerman claimed that while he was walking on the property, Martin jumped him, knocked him down, was beating him up, and tried to take his gun, at which point Zimmerman shot him.
  
• 
   
  The witness with the best view of the fight saw one person on top of another, beating him. He believed that the person on the bottom was wearing a red shirt. Zimmerman was wearing a red shirt (or jacket or sweatshirt).
  
• 
   
  Zimmerman had cuts on the back of his head that are consistent with it being hit against a sidewalk while he was on his back.
  
• 
   
  The coroner testified that the gunshot wound was consistent with Martin being shot while bending over someone.
  

 

That's pretty much the clearest and best evidence we have. There is a lot we don't know - like how the altercation between Martin and Zimmerman actually started, or whether Martin was actually "going for" Zimmerman's gun.

 

There is also a lot of discussion around the case that is not relevant to Zimmerman's guilt or innocence: Zimmerman was not required to obey the police dispatcher, and Zimmerman was allowed to approach Martin at the apartment. He wouldn't be able to start a fight with Martin and then claim self defense...but there's no evidence that the did.

 

But if we look at the evidence, the best evidence tends to support Zimmerman's version, and there isn't much good evidence to support Martin's version

 

 

If these facts are true, it would seem as though Zimmerman is not guilty of murder. However it would seem as though he provoked the issue, antagonized Martin by following he around, and could have avoided a physical altercation. I do not condone his actions, I do not think he's "in the right" but the things above being true it would seem like a murder charge wouldn't be the right charge.

[krc1995]

I'm surprised people are surprised by the verdict. His arrest was railroaded by public outcry in the first place, and the prosecution never really had much of a case.

+1, this is exactly true. It would have been really easy to convict GZ because he is a putz and looked like an easy target for media and civil rights groups begging for attention.

[Junior]

Good article on the topic:

Zimmerman's Not Guilty. But Florida Sure Is.

 

 

Blame the state’s bad laws for Trayvon Martin’s death.

 

http://www.slate.com...in_s_death.html

[krc1995]

I think people are losing sight of what this trial was about. In the grand scheme of things, it would seem as though Zimmerman is responsible for the events that led up to Martins death. However, the trial was a murder trial by my understanding.

 

A guy on reddit summarized these facts as to why the jury acquitted Zimmerman.

 

• Because he was the defendant, the jury needed to find his guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. That means they need to be 95%+ sure that Zimmerman: (A) shot Martin; and (B) did not shoot Martin in self-defense.
  

I.e., the state has the burden of proving beyond a reasonable doubt that there was no valid self defense.

• 
   
   
  Zimmerman claimed that while he was walking on the property, Martin jumped him, knocked him down, was beating him up, and tried to take his gun, at which point Zimmerman shot him.
  
• 
   
   
  The witness with the best view of the fight saw one person on top of another, beating him. He believed that the person on the bottom was wearing a red shirt. Zimmerman was wearing a red shirt (or jacket or sweatshirt).
  
• 
   
   
  Zimmerman had cuts on the back of his head that are consistent with it being hit against a sidewalk while he was on his back.
  
• 
   
   
  The coroner testified that the gunshot wound was consistent with Martin being shot while bending over someone.
  

That's pretty much the clearest and best evidence we have. There is a lot we don't know - like how the altercation between Martin and Zimmerman actually started, or whether Martin was actually "going for" Zimmerman's gun.

 

There is also a lot of discussion around the case that is not relevant to Zimmerman's guilt or innocence: Zimmerman was not required to obey the police dispatcher, and Zimmerman was allowed to approach Martin at the apartment. He wouldn't be able to start a fight with Martin and then claim self defense...but there's no evidence that the did.

 

But if we look at the evidence, the best evidence tends to support Zimmerman's version, and there isn't much good evidence to support Martin's version

 

 

If these facts are true, it would seem as though Zimmerman is not guilty of murder. However it would seem as though he provoked the issue, antagonized Martin by following he around, and could have avoided a physical altercation. I do not condone his actions, I do not think he's "in the right" but the things above being true it would seem like a murder charge wouldn't be the right charge.

 

In the end it was about 20 bad decisions by both parties that ended up with one of the parties being dead. Either person could have ended the chain reaction but didn't. It's time to move on and not buy into the media frenzy of racial prejudice.

[Junior]

In the end it was about 20 bad decisions by both parties that ended up with one of the parties being dead. Either person could have ended the chain reaction but didn't.

 

That's a bold statement, considering you only know Zimmerman's story. Pretty much the only facts we know: Unarmed kid followed by guy with a gun, unarmed kid ends up dead. But the unarmed kid should have ended the chain reaction?

[Junior]

I think people are losing sight of what this trial was about. In the grand scheme of things, it would seem as though Zimmerman is responsible for the events that led up to Martins death. However, the trial was a murder trial by my understanding.

 

A guy on reddit summarized these facts as to why the jury acquitted Zimmerman.

 

• Because he was the defendant, the jury needed to find his guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. That means they need to be 95%+ sure that Zimmerman: (A) shot Martin; and (B) did not shoot Martin in self-defense.
  

I.e., the state has the burden of proving beyond a reasonable doubt that there was no valid self defense.

• 
   
   
  Zimmerman claimed that while he was walking on the property, Martin jumped him, knocked him down, was beating him up, and tried to take his gun, at which point Zimmerman shot him.
  
• 
   
   
  The witness with the best view of the fight saw one person on top of another, beating him. He believed that the person on the bottom was wearing a red shirt. Zimmerman was wearing a red shirt (or jacket or sweatshirt).
  
• 
   
   
  Zimmerman had cuts on the back of his head that are consistent with it being hit against a sidewalk while he was on his back.
  
• 
   
   
  The coroner testified that the gunshot wound was consistent with Martin being shot while bending over someone.
  

That's pretty much the clearest and best evidence we have. There is a lot we don't know - like how the altercation between Martin and Zimmerman actually started, or whether Martin was actually "going for" Zimmerman's gun.

 

There is also a lot of discussion around the case that is not relevant to Zimmerman's guilt or innocence: Zimmerman was not required to obey the police dispatcher, and Zimmerman was allowed to approach Martin at the apartment. He wouldn't be able to start a fight with Martin and then claim self defense...but there's no evidence that the did.

 

But if we look at the evidence, the best evidence tends to support Zimmerman's version, and there isn't much good evidence to support Martin's version

 

 

If these facts are true, it would seem as though Zimmerman is not guilty of murder. However it would seem as though he provoked the issue, antagonized Martin by following he around, and could have avoided a physical altercation. I do not condone his actions, I do not think he's "in the right" but the things above being true it would seem like a murder charge wouldn't be the right charge.

 

 

I think a few facts are left out of that. Like how despite Martin supposedly being on top of Zimmerman when shot, none of Martin's blood ended up on Zimmerman or on Zimmerman's gun. That's a pretty striking piece of information.

[Landlord]

In the end it was about 20 bad decisions by both parties that ended up with one of the parties being dead. Either person could have ended the chain reaction but didn't. It's time to move on and not buy into the media frenzy of racial prejudice.

 

 

A kid goes to by skittles and tea at a gas station and "approaches" someone suspiciously following him and it's 20 bad decisions?

 

 

Zimmerman might not be guilty of murder but a kid's life has ended as a direct result of his actions.

[Junior]

In the end it was about 20 bad decisions by both parties that ended up with one of the parties being dead. Either person could have ended the chain reaction but didn't. It's time to move on and not buy into the media frenzy of racial prejudice.

 

 

A kid goes to by skittles and tea at a gas station and "approaches" someone suspiciously following him and it's 20 bad decisions?

 

 

Zimmerman might not be guilty of murder but a kid's life has ended as a direct result of his actions.

 

Yes, this. +1000000

[Hercules]

I'm allowing myself one post on this topic and then I'm out.

 

1. Of COURSE race is a part of this story. No matter what story you believe, it's clear that George Zimmerman was suspicious of Trayvon Martin before Martin had done anything illegal, and that Martin was suspicious of Zimmerman before Zimmerman had approached him. It's also clear that Martin's family doesn't remotely trust the local police department, and if you don't understand the roots of that sentiment, which go back for decades, go take a history class. If you think that race didn't play a role in this, you're either naive or you're a white guy from Nebraska that has only seen about 20 black people in your entire life.

 

2. I'm fairly certain that the new racism is white people playing the victim, complaining about how unfairly they are being treated by the media - yeah, white males have it sooooo hard. Give me a break.

[Fuzzy]

I've accepted the fact that Zimmerman will be in the news again. He won't change his ways, he will stereotype someone else and will either kill or seriously injure them and find himself back in court once again.

[krc1995]

In the end it was about 20 bad decisions by both parties that ended up with one of the parties being dead. Either person could have ended the chain reaction but didn't.

 

That's a bold statement, considering you only know Zimmerman's story. Pretty much the only facts we know: Unarmed kid followed by guy with a gun, unarmed kid ends up dead. But the unarmed kid should have ended the chain reaction?

he should have went home. He had the choice to go home. If that is bold then so be it

[Junior]

In the end it was about 20 bad decisions by both parties that ended up with one of the parties being dead. Either person could have ended the chain reaction but didn't.

 

That's a bold statement, considering you only know Zimmerman's story. Pretty much the only facts we know: Unarmed kid followed by guy with a gun, unarmed kid ends up dead. But the unarmed kid should have ended the chain reaction?

he should have went home. He had the choice to go home. If that is bold then so be it

 

How dare he go out for skittles.

[HuskerNationNick]

Why didn't we see any of you guys on the stands? Some of you act like you were there to witness what had happened! The media sure has made you believe what they wanted lol.

 

How do you know he only went out for tea and skittles? Did Trayvon Martin tell you this? Did Zimmerman tell you this? A mother who wasn't there, let alone with him told you this.

 

I don't know if Zimmerman is guilty or innocent. I wasn't there, and there is no proof of murder, or self defense. If you can't prove its murder, then how are you going to charge him with it?

 

I wish the media would stay out of sh#t like this.

 

You want to sit here and play the race card? You could also say that was what it was BECAUSE a black kid was shot and killed by someone of a different race and wasn't immediately arrested. It goes both effing ways, but to say Zimmerman got off because he killed a black kit is completely idiotic.

[Moiraine]

In the end it was about 20 bad decisions by both parties that ended up with one of the parties being dead. Either person could have ended the chain reaction but didn't.

 

That's a bold statement, considering you only know Zimmerman's story. Pretty much the only facts we know: Unarmed kid followed by guy with a gun, unarmed kid ends up dead. But the unarmed kid should have ended the chain reaction?

he should have went home. He had the choice to go home. If that is bold then so be it

Um, that's what he WAS doing. Walking home.

[knapplc]

but to say Zimmerman got off because he killed a black kit is completely idiotic.

 

The last 200 or so years of American history notwithstanding.