The Ron Brown Religion & Persecution Thread

[tschu]

bham,

 

[bhamHusker]

It's awesome when people interject at the end of a thread without reading the whole thing. It's also awesome when random internet posters dismiss "magical" people they know f#*k all about. I have no need to make this up, because (as I stated before) I really don't care. I stated my opinion on the matter already. If you read the f'ing thread, try here and here, you'd see why this particular rabbit trail was started. And it seems Tschu and I agree on the surface. There' is no magical "gay switch." Which is why I asked in the first place.

 

Enough with this sh#t. I'm tired, and going to bed.

 

I've read the entire thread. I've posted several times in it - maybe YOU should read it. This particular tangent is essentially the same conversation we all had a few months ago in the "gay players yes/no/hell no" poll & ensuing discussion. Maybe you should take a look at that one too, since it covers much of the same ground, not that I expect any of the points made in that thread to change your thoroughly cemented opinions on gay issues.

[Saunders]

It's awesome when people interject at the end of a thread without reading the whole thing. It's also awesome when random internet posters dismiss "magical" people they know f#*k all about. I have no need to make this up, because (as I stated before) I really don't care. I stated my opinion on the matter already. If you read the f'ing thread, try here and here, you'd see why this particular rabbit trail was started. And it seems Tschu and I agree on the surface. There' is no magical "gay switch." Which is why I asked in the first place.

 

Enough with this sh#t. I'm tired, and going to bed.

 

I've read the entire thread. I've posted several times in it - maybe YOU should read it. It's essentially the same conversation we all had a few months ago in the "gay players yes/no/hell no" poll & ensuing discussion. Maybe you should take a look at that one too, since it covers much of the ground, not that I expect any of the points made in that thread to change your thoroughly cemented opinions on gay issues.

Sorry from not reading a thread from months ago. I was specifically discussing what happened in this thread, in regard to this particular chain of responses. I don't hang out on this board, because it's normally a sh#tstorm. It got moved from the main board, and it's my fault for even coming over here.

 

I do find it amusing that you think you know my "thoroughly cemented opinions" on gay issues. If you know me so well, list them, and I'll respond tomorrow.

[scarletNcream]

Let it be known that I believe the majority of us could care less if someone is gay or lesbian. My concern is NOT that coach Brown came to Omaha and address the council about a bill that common sense tells us should not be needed. The only reason this was of any news was because of who he is. Now, I did not see him with a N cap on or a coaches shirt, he came as a citizen of Nebraska and therefore should be allowed to speak his mind at a public meeting of the city council. It is the law. My concern is the discrimination of him because of his religion. Are we not guilty of this if we crush his voice and his voice only? I don't remember him stating "HI, I'm coach Ron Brown of the University of Nebraska Lincoln and I and the University feel this law is wrong because of God teachings". Here's a portion of the article:

 

Barbara Baier, a member of the Lincoln Board of Education, wrote to university administrators to request Brown's firing in the wake of his testimony. She noted the university-wide policy not to discriminate based on, among other things, sexual orientation.

 

I think she forgot the part about the University-wide policy about discrimination based on religion. Most of you are right, if he starts an anti gay group on campus, we have a problem but to state that he is representing the university and their beliefs is ludicrist. In comparison to President Obama's light heart comment about the Secret Service agents caught up in Columbian affair, just a bunch of "knuckleheads". He must think spending taxpayer money on hookers and coke is OK because they are just knuckleheads, something most of us called our kids when they did something silly-stupid.

[bhamHusker]

Sorry from not reading a thread from months ago. I was specifically discussing what happened in this thread, in regard to this particular chain of responses. I don't hang out on this board, because it's normally a sh#tstorm. It got moved from the main board, and it's my fault for even coming over here.

 

I do find it amusing that you think you know my "thoroughly cemented opinions" on gay issues. If you know me so well, list them, and I'll respond tomorrow.

I was specifically discussing this thread, too. I don't remember you posting in the other one, I just mentioned it because it covers a lot of the same ground that this particular line of discussion is covering so I thought it was relevant.

 

I don't claim to know what all of your opinions on the subject are. But from your arguments here, I'd say that you're very sure of your position and not in any danger of changing it. Now, if I had to guess, based entirely off of your posts in this thread I would say that you believe that people choose whether to play on the hetero or homo team. You don't seem particularly hostile to gays, but you probably don't think they deserve any "special rights" or what I would call the same rights we straights have. You're not likely to get involved in the gay rights movement because it's not a personal issue for you, but you probably won't be that upset if marriage equality and other guarantees of equal protection were extended to gays.

 

Am I close?

 

Let me be real clear about this - I don't think you're a rampaging homophobe, and if I've given that impression, let me apologize. I just think that your beliefs regarding homosexuality being a choice are seriously off base, and you seem to be rather closed-minded when it comes to any opinion to the contrary. My own personal opinions on the subject were formed based on my gay friends and acquaintances. I have a gay friend that committed suicide in large part due to the struggles he had with his sexuality. Another friend was married, served in the Air Force and has a kid, but realized that he was living in denial. A female friend and former coworker that was married and in denial before finally coming to terms with her sexuality and deciding to not live a lie anymore. A close friend came very close to getting married before getting to a point in his life where he accepted himself for what he was - he's a different, better / happier, person from when he was living a lie. A very good friend in high school was gay, and was murdered over 20 years ago. His murder remains unsolved, but I've always suspected that what happened to him was due to his sexual preference. I can match you gay buddy for gay buddy - probably 10 times over - and I have never seen anything to convince me that that there's not a heck of a lot more to it than just waking up one day and deciding you're going to be gay from now on. I don't claim to know what it is, but I believe it's a combination of genetic predisposition and environmental influences. I'm pretty confident that research into the subject will ultimately prove this to be the case.

 

Again, I don't think you're a bad guy (frankly, I don't know enough about you to know whether you are or not), I just strongly disagree with your stance on this point. Here's a link to one of my posts in the other / old thread that covers the topic. http://www.huskerboa...post__p__778492

[JJ Husker]

You do remember the "back of the bus", business not serving or allowing blacks, etc.? Please show me evidence of similar, current, bigotry perpetrated on members of the GLBT community.

Most states don't allow gay people to marry. That's at least as bad as what you're describing here.

 

Ok. Thank you. You are correct that is similar and arguably worse than some of the pre-civil rights atrocities committed in this country. But I still fail to see how the issue in Omaha that Brown spoke against would address the issue of gay marriage. I was hoping for an example of a real problem that might be solved by it.

[huskerjack23]

Let it be known that I believe the majority of us could care less if someone is gay or lesbian. My concern is NOT that coach Brown came to Omaha and address the council about a bill that common sense tells us should not be needed. The only reason this was of any news was because of who he is. Now, I did not see him with a N cap on or a coaches shirt, he came as a citizen of Nebraska and therefore should be allowed to speak his mind at a public meeting of the city council. It is the law. My concern is the discrimination of him because of his religion. Are we not guilty of this if we crush his voice and his voice only? I don't remember him stating "HI, I'm coach Ron Brown of the University of Nebraska Lincoln and I and the University feel this law is wrong because of God teachings". Here's a portion of the article:

 

Barbara Baier, a member of the Lincoln Board of Education, wrote to university administrators to request Brown's firing in the wake of his testimony. She noted the university-wide policy not to discriminate based on, among other things, sexual orientation.

 

I think she forgot the part about the University-wide policy about discrimination based on religion. Most of you are right, if he starts an anti gay group on campus, we have a problem but to state that he is representing the university and their beliefs is ludicrist. In comparison to President Obama's light heart comment about the Secret Service agents caught up in Columbian affair, just a bunch of "knuckleheads". He must think spending taxpayer money on hookers and coke is OK because they are just knuckleheads, something most of us called our kids when they did something silly-stupid.

Discrimination based on religion doesn't protect hate speech.

 

If I were to go around saying people were sinners, were going to hell, and were going to answer to the Father in heaven because they were working on the Sabbath, eating pork or shellfish, or letting woman be in authority, I would be fired without a second thought. Would I have a case for discrimination? I truly believe these things!

 

DOWN WITH WOMAN'S SUFFRAGE AND LOBSTER TAILS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Landlord]

[Saunders]

Sorry from not reading a thread from months ago. I was specifically discussing what happened in this thread, in regard to this particular chain of responses. I don't hang out on this board, because it's normally a sh#tstorm. It got moved from the main board, and it's my fault for even coming over here.

 

I do find it amusing that you think you know my "thoroughly cemented opinions" on gay issues. If you know me so well, list them, and I'll respond tomorrow.

I was specifically discussing this thread, too. I don't remember you posting in the other one, I just mentioned it because it covers a lot of the same ground that this particular line of discussion is covering so I thought it was relevant.

 

I don't claim to know what all of your opinions on the subject are. But from your arguments here, I'd say that you're very sure of your position and not in any danger of changing it. Now, if I had to guess, based entirely off of your posts in this thread I would say that you believe that people choose whether to play on the hetero or homo team. You don't seem particularly hostile to gays, but you probably don't think they deserve any "special rights" or what I would call the same rights we straights have. You're not likely to get involved in the gay rights movement because it's not a personal issue for you, but you probably won't be that upset if marriage equality and other guarantees of equal protection were extended to gays.

 

Am I close?

 

Let me be real clear about this - I don't think you're a rampaging homophobe, and if I've given that impression, let me apologize. I just think that your beliefs regarding homosexuality being a choice are seriously off base, and you seem to be rather closed-minded when it comes to any opinion to the contrary. My own personal opinions on the subject were formed based on my gay friends and acquaintances. I have a gay friend that committed suicide in large part due to the struggles he had with his sexuality. Another friend was married, served in the Air Force and has a kid, but realized that he was living in denial. A female friend and former coworker that was married and in denial before finally coming to terms with her sexuality and deciding to not live a lie anymore. A close friend came very close to getting married before getting to a point in his life where he accepted himself for what he was - he's a different, better / happier, person from when he was living a lie. A very good friend in high school was gay, and was murdered over 20 years ago. His murder remains unsolved, but I've always suspected that what happened to him was due to his sexual preference. I can match you gay buddy for gay buddy - probably 10 times over - and I have never seen anything to convince me that that there's not a heck of a lot more to it than just waking up one day and deciding you're going to be gay from now on. I don't claim to know what it is, but I believe it's a combination of genetic predisposition and environmental influences. I'm pretty confident that research into the subject will ultimately prove this to be the case.

 

Again, I don't think you're a bad guy (frankly, I don't know enough about you to know whether you are or not), I just strongly disagree with your stance on this point. Here's a link to one of my posts in the other / old thread that covers the topic. http://www.huskerboa...post__p__778492

Thanks for the response. I don't want to drag this out, so I'm going to leave with this. I'm entirely indifferent to the entire issue. As for why someone is gay, I really don't care either. What I have to base my opinions on, is the first hand account of two individuals. Both told me a similar story. Married for a time, had kids, after a while of being married, lost attraction to the opposite sex and their partner, and ended the relationship. They started exploring same sex relationships, and now consider themselves homosexuals. Neither said they felt they were in "denial" for 40+ years. That's the real world knowledge that I based my opinion on. Being told by others that my opinions are closed-minded because I wouldn't listen to another opinion is hypocritical, especially when my opinion was initially dismissed as impossible, evidence to the contrary. There are obviously a bunch of variables. Nobody knows for sure. There are theories and hypothesis, but I've yet to see something listed as undeniable fact. Is choice applicable in every case? Probably not..

 

That said, I'm done with that particular rabbit trail. In the end, it doesn't really matter, because what we think about choice/environment/genes is irrelevant to the discussion. Hell, this being about gay rights is irrelevant. The only question is, did RB properly identify himself as a private citizen. I think RB is free to speak his mind, and the only mistake he made, was listing his address as Memorial stadium.

[Wolvie3758]

Very dissapointed and angered by the remarks of your football coach and his anti-gay homophobic remarks....This is

the Big 10...its 2012....This kind of blatant open discrimination and hatred is NOT what Big Ten Universities are all about.

 

Get rid of him..the sooner the better it negative PR will only mount and grow worse...

[tschu]

That's right, you're giving opinions and spouting uninformed things about how genetics works. I spent 4 1/2 years getting a degree in biology and doing genetics research. At this point I'm not really sure how to get my point across. I linked to a wikipedia article earlier that should help you understand what I'm saying a little better (yes, wikipedia is actually great for general bio knowledge).

[Joe_5700]

[Lyons in the Sea of Red.]

coolstorybro

[HuskerShark]

Very dissapointed and angered by the remarks of your football coach and his anti-gay homophobic remarks....This is

the Big 10...its 2012....This kind of blatant open discrimination and hatred is NOT what Big Ten Universities are all about.

 

Get rid of him..the sooner the better it negative PR will only mount and grow worse...

 

Worry bout your own team, buddy. Thanks.

[T_O_Bull]

Very dissapointed and angered by the remarks of your football coach and his anti-gay homophobic remarks....This is

the Big 10...its 2012....This kind of blatant open discrimination and hatred is NOT what Big Ten Universities are all about.

 

Get rid of him..the sooner the better it negative PR will only mount and grow worse...

 

Mind your own business and stop acting like the B1G lives on a higher plane. Ron Brown is a class act and certainly not above making a mistake but he has also been the moral anchor for hundreds of Husker players for many years.

T_O_B

G>B>R