Thanks_Tom RR Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 Delete · Lock 20 Jan knapplcObama is officially out of office. Everyone still got their guns? Hide Comments 20 Jan Delete TAKODABig black SUV pulled up this morning in front of my house. I went out to see who they were and noticed they had my grandchilds orange plastic squirt gun in a lock box. So, were missing 1. �� 20 Jan Delete TAKODA^ I jest! Relax all. 20 Jan Delete dudeguyyAccording to an article I read on LibNews.net, I actually heard he's implementing the martial law as soon as he touches down back in Kenya. He'll be ruling by proxy from there. The Trump thing is just an elaborate ruse.I believe they'll be starting the gun repo movement right after Trump's taxes are released. 20 Jan Delete Thanks_Tom RRThe real question is how many of you have more guns now than before Obama got into office? Or how many got your first gun in the last 8 yrs?NRA, FOX, Rep, and several special interest groups really have sold a lie to the American public. 20 Jan Delete Thanks_Tom RRLook at the frequency of public, mass shootings (especially in our schools) over the past 30 yrs (or the past 15 yrs or past 5 yrs) compared to any other time in our nations history. We need gun reform. Not to take guns away from our citizens, but to limit the accessibility of guns to killers of our children.If you have a gun for home protection, sport, or as a collection, you should have as many guns as you like. If you plan to do harm with that gun, you should not have one. Refo... 20 Jan Delete The DudeThe amount of guns I have typically increases every time I receive a tax return. 20 Jan Delete BIGREDIOWANI like The Dude's plan.....lol 20 Jan Delete Thanks_Tom RRI am not worried about people like The Dude or BRI having guns. I use guns for hunting and recreation. Many of my neighbors, co-workers, friends, and family members have guns. If you look at the mass shooting frequency in our nation the last 30 yrs, there has been a fundamental shift in how guns are being used to perpetrate demented acts. Reform should happen to restrict has to those that intend to do harm to your families and mine. 20 Jan Delete Thanks_Tom RRIt is not unconstitutional to say, "if you plan to kill someone with a gun, you should not have access to one". 20 Jan Delete knapplcI really like guns. Never shot a handgun. Would really like to, though. 20 Jan Delete MLB 51I shot my hand gun right after he was sworn in. It was quite fun. 20 Jan Delete Thanks_Tom RRSure, MLB. Anyway, everyone has their guns, right?! So, you were lied to about Obama and Dems taking them. Now, can we get down to business of making our children safe? 20 Jan Delete BIGREDIOWANThere are obviously several different opinions on how to go about making them safer Tom, but I'm all for making our children safer. 20 Jan Delete Thanks_Tom RRI know you do, BRI. I believe you completely. However, this is political rhetoric, or as Trump says "just words". Not trying to put anything on you, BRI. You just happen to be the one who responded.Sincerely, look at the school shooting numbers per year. Not until the 90's never more than 5, not until the 2000's never more than 10, and now, we have 15 to nearly 50 annually. 20 Jan Delete Thanks_Tom RRThink about those numbers and the historical shift we are seeing in gun use in our society. We do not live in the same times that we did 30 years ago or even 15 years ago. Gun laws need to change to deal with the changes in our society. 21 Jan Delete funhuskerI have thought about to converting to Islam....The Mosque seemed more welcoming than my Church... 21 Jan Delete Thanks_Tom RRfunhusker, your comment means nothing to this conversation. I would appreciate you not derailing it. 21 Jan Delete Savage HuskerIt's funny to joke around about it, but to act like that's not an agenda for far left liberals is naive. 21 Jan Delete Thanks_Tom RRJoke around about what? We have a responsibility as citizens and our politicians have a responsibility as our representatives to safeguard our country. There is a clear shift in the perpetuation of gun violence in our society over the last 30 years. It should be our goal to reverse that deathly trend. Keep guns in civilians' hands of course, but do not turn a blind eye to reality and the need for reform. 21 Jan Delete HuskermanMikeInteresting stuff Thanks Tom, what my question to you is this, take away bad peoples guns but they still get them? Put all the laws you want on them, ppl still find ways to get a hold of them. How would you respond to that? 21 Jan Delete Savage HuskerThe OP, Tom. The comment was to poke fun at or it was to troll gun rights enthusiasts. My point is outside of articles, social media, my childhood friends and college buddies who want guns to be outlawed entirely. 21 Jan Delete dudeguyyThe problems are twofold:1) The NRA is one of the most powerful lobbies in Washington.2) People have been conditioned to reflexively screech anytime the subject of gun control is brought up.I wish there was more room for nuance in this conversation. But it's almost always had in absolutes. 21 Jan Delete JJHusker1I had to hock mine to help pay my healthcare bills and taxes. 21 Jan Delete Thanks_Tom RR@HuskermanMike, what kind of current laws are 100% deterrents right now? Are you asking for a repeal on all laws that are not 100% enforceable? No, those are not realistic expectations.What we should be asking is why have school shootings gone up? My concern is that the culture around gun violence has significantly changed over the last 3 decades, but no reform has happened to keep guns out of the hands of violent actors. 21 Jan Delete man eating mastodonTTRR as of now it's sadly impossible to do that.way to many guns on the streets 21 Jan Delete Thanks_Tom RRMany of the guns used in school shootings come from home. Thus, the onus of restricting access to guns for minors (particularly those that have behavioral problems or mental health issues) is on the gun owner/guardian. Laws could require proper storage to restrict access. Laws could also require gun owners to take more safety training, which could highlight the risks of making guns accessible to at-risk minors. You do not have to go door-to-door to make sure these things are being done. 21 Jan Delete Thanks_Tom RRSometimes, education is a powerful tool to prevent a crisis. Also, this would create more liability on the gun owner if a minor uses it to commit a violent act. 21 Jan Delete Thanks_Tom RRAlso, reform is not limited to gun laws. We need more money and support to help children with behavioral problems and mental health issue, especially when they pose a risk to themselves or others. 21 Jan Delete man eating mastodonWell said.one would think that with gun violence being what it has been the last 15 years we would have a better system 21 Jan Delete ColoNoCoHuskerFor some reason, it's easier for everyone to blame the family/community/local schools/etc than to actually do anything to identify/treat the root cause... Sad 21 Jan Delete Thanks_Tom RRColoNoCoHusker, what is the root cause in your opinion? 21 Jan Delete Thanks_Tom RRIf you are going to say the children that perpetrate the violent acts, I would not disagree with you. However, I would ask if those children are rather the source of such violence but the cause of the behavior is (1) underlying behavioral problems or mental health issues which go undetected or untreated due to an under-funded and under-supported system, (2) insufficient gun laws to limit access to such people, and (3) misdirected narratives driven by special interest for profit or power. Link to comment
ColoNoCoHusker Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 I posted in the comments while you were creating the thread... I more or less agree with your last comment TTRR and I wish I had a better answer overall. I think mental illness is poorly treated/accepted/identified in this country and is way behind physical medicine. Beyond that, I think it is a complex intersection of issues. Anyone that tries to dig deeper gets caught in a political fog. At a minimum there are sociological, psychological, physiological, and technological components. I think it is to our society's everlasting discredit that we do not expend more effort to actually remedy these types of situations. I have two neighbors that were staff at Columbine when that situation occurred. When I speak with them, I realize how little we have progressed since then. From the outside looking in, there is a stigma attached to many of the faculty/staff victims and community that is unwarranted. Thus my comments about blaming the local area rather than recognize this is a systemic and at least national issue... 1 Link to comment
ColoNoCoHusker Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 While not a school shooting, the Aurora theater shooting involving the CU student is an interesting case. This person confided in psych staff/counselors with CU Medical School about some of his demented thoughts. He was kicked out of school and was identified as a direct threat to himself & the community. The school failed to properly warn authorities as was their legal obligation. Yet somehow, CU has escaped accountability while the theater has undergone numerous lawsuits. How CU Medical staff have not lost their license and CU Medical School has not been found criminally negligent is beyond me... 1 Link to comment
Landlord Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 You'll never stop all crime, and that's never the goal. The goal is to make it as difficult as possible to commit crimes while also ensuring people's freedom. To this end, there is much we can be doing to do better. We must do better. We have to. Link to comment
cornstar Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 Didn't some of the worst "gun crimes " in our Nation's history come under Obama? Doesn't his alleged home city have one of the highest murder rates? Yeah..... Link to comment
zoogs Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 Didn't some of the worst "gun crimes " in our Nation's history come under Obama? Doesn't his alleged home city have one of the highest murder rates? Yeah..... What's the argument being made here? Link to comment
DrunkOffPunch Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 Didn't some of the worst "gun crimes " in our Nation's history come under Obama? Doesn't his alleged home city have one of the highest murder rates? Yeah..... I don't get what you're saying. That it's Obama's fault? What? Link to comment
Moiraine Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 Didn't some of the worst "gun crimes " in our Nation's history come under Obama? Doesn't his alleged home city have one of the highest murder rates? Yeah..... What's the argument being made here? It's one I've heard a lot. "But his hometown!!!111" Link to comment
NM11046 Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 "Allegedy" his hometown. Cornstar you are really something special. Link to comment
BIGREDIOWAN Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 My personal opinion on this matter falls somewhere along the line of what Colo mentioned above. I think we need to take a long hard look at mental health care in this country to start with. It's really in a sad state of affairs and needs to be addressed. I'm not for taking guns away, but I don't think anyone really thinks that is THE answer to this problem. I am for more/deeper background checks with weapons and think it's something that needs to be re-occuring say annually or semi-annually in reference to ownership of weapons. The thing you still have to be careful of is access to weapons by mentally unstable folks. So is it something where if there is a mentally unstable person living in your household you aren't allowed to own guns because of that? I'm not sure what the answer is here, it's so complex and so large it's hard to figure out which angle to take and which angle is the right one. I suppose any angle will start chipping away at the problem though. Of course you run into "infringing on people's rights" possibly as well. 2 Link to comment
Landlord Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 My personal opinion on this matter falls somewhere along the line of what Colo mentioned above. I think we need to take a long hard look at mental health care in this country to start with. It's really in a sad state of affairs and needs to be addressed. I'm not for taking guns away, but I don't think anyone really thinks that is THE answer to this problem. I am for more/deeper background checks with weapons and think it's something that needs to be re-occuring say annually or semi-annually in reference to ownership of weapons. So in essence, you agree entirely with the Democratic gun control platform, then. 2 Link to comment
Thanks_Tom RR Posted January 22, 2017 Author Share Posted January 22, 2017 My personal opinion on this matter falls somewhere along the line of what Colo mentioned above. I think we need to take a long hard look at mental health care in this country to start with. It's really in a sad state of affairs and needs to be addressed. I'm not for taking guns away, but I don't think anyone really thinks that is THE answer to this problem. I am for more/deeper background checks with weapons and think it's something that needs to be re-occuring say annually or semi-annually in reference to ownership of weapons. The thing you still have to be careful of is access to weapons by mentally unstable folks. So is it something where if there is a mentally unstable person living in your household you aren't allowed to own guns because of that? I'm not sure what the answer is here, it's so complex and so large it's hard to figure out which angle to take and which angle is the right one. I suppose any angle will start chipping away at the problem though. Of course you run into "infringing on people's rights" possibly as well. I would say this is as rationale a reform proposal as any, getting to the root of the issue. As for the issue of guns being in the homes of those with behavioral problems or mental health disorders, I would propose requiring restricted access of those guns to such individuals through measures that security the weapon. This would put more liability on the gun owner, if a minor uses it to commit a violent act. 2 Link to comment
cornstar Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 "Allegedy" his hometown. Cornstar you are really something special. Is Obama a Chicago native? Yet he considers it his home town. Link to comment
HuskermanMike Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 What about teachers having guns? I would say they should have them in the school but in the basement or stashed away. This is where I think this gets really complicated, if teachers get guns or only get them on certain days for instance-what do they do if someone breaks into the school? I am not for it entirely, but schools should have guns for the safety of the children. Maybe have a trained security guard or administrator handle the guns that are hidden from faculty and students, have teachers lock the doors, so they could get the suspect and not have to worry about kids asking the teachers about a gun in their drawer. (Or getting a hold of it for that matter) It's sad to see gun violence, but some of it is on parenting and sometimes it is on the kid hiding something from them. Such as a disability or a thought of revenge on another student. Instead of having the state of mind to ask for help, they simply act to get attention/revenge etc. How do they get the guns is also another thing that needs to be looked at. In general, I think people get a hold of guns by offering large amounts of money for them. They also get them because the seller doesn't care about the state of mind of the person, rather the person wants money. That's just my take on it, basically if someone wants a gun they will find a way to get their hands on it, but the best the government can do is background checks and prevent unstable people from getting their hands on guns. Link to comment
NM11046 Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 What about teachers having guns? I would say they should have them in the school but in the basement or stashed away. This is where I think this gets really complicated, if teachers get guns or only get them on certain days for instance-what do they do if someone breaks into the school? I am not for it entirely, but schools should have guns for the safety of the children. Maybe have a trained security guard or administrator handle the guns that are hidden from faculty and students, have teachers lock the doors, so they could get the suspect and not have to worry about kids asking the teachers about a gun in their drawer. (Or getting a hold of it for that matter) It's sad to see gun violence, but some of it is on parenting and sometimes it is on the kid hiding something from them. Such as a disability or a thought of revenge on another student. Instead of having the state of mind to ask for help, they simply act to get attention/revenge etc. How do they get the guns is also another thing that needs to be looked at. In general, I think people get a hold of guns by offering large amounts of money for them. They also get them because the seller doesn't care about the state of mind of the person, rather the person wants money. That's just my take on it, basically if someone wants a gun they will find a way to get their hands on it, but the best the government can do is background checks and prevent unstable people from getting their hands on guns. I strongly disagree with (your first paragraph) this Huskerman. I'm off to work right now and don't have time to post the data but there is very good information showing how often a "regular joe" or carrying person is able to stop an attack, and that more often times than not they increase the risk of confusion on site and danger to all. (all those hero stories on Fox are not the norm) There's also a lot of info out there on exactly how beneficial it is to have hourly paid "security" at schools if something like this happens. For the most part these are the same guys who are trained to drive around suburbs and shopping malls at night - not strategic military or police. If you were making $10 an hour or less would you stay and shoot? Training recently has included more specific "Run, Hide, Fight Back" and there is more consistent repetition and drills now. The risk of having any gun in schools increases the odds that some kid upset by his girlfriend saying no to prom or being bullied would use that weapon for no good. Hidden or not. Link to comment
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