Zac Lee will be the starter

[Captain K]

Numbers alone don't tell the story. If wins or stats alone were the measure then you could argue that everyone on a 33-0 high school baseball team should get drafted to the pros over a 5 tool player that is on a 5-27 team. Or, a guy with crappy arm strength on a run based team, who throws the ball only when the defense should be looking run and has a 7-2 td to interception ratio is a great qb. As ridiculous as that sounds, your using stats to support Lee is just as bad. You base it on talent. I saw the guy play. We all did. He's not good. We need better to have the kind of year we all hope for. I don't know if we have better. I just hope we do. It is imperative.

 

You're right, your post is ridiculous. The stats aren't lying. Lee was the QB of the team that demolished Arizona. He was a key component in that game, as he was in the Oklahoma game, the Virginia Tech game, the Texas game, the Missouri game, etc. I'm using dispassionate statistics based on mutually identifiable factors like pass efficiency and SOS, and you're using emotion.

 

Sorry, stats trump emotion every time.

What does seeing a guy with no talent to be a good qb have to do with emotion? Who said anything about emotion? You have nothing more than a brilliant way to build the illusion of making stronger arguments. I will from now on refer to you as knappic Copperfield.

[knapplc]

Numbers alone don't tell the story. If wins or stats alone were the measure then you could argue that everyone on a 33-0 high school baseball team should get drafted to the pros over a 5 tool player that is on a 5-27 team. Or, a guy with crappy arm strength on a run based team, who throws the ball only when the defense should be looking run and has a 7-2 td to interception ratio is a great qb. As ridiculous as that sounds, your using stats to support Lee is just as bad. You base it on talent. I saw the guy play. We all did. He's not good. We need better to have the kind of year we all hope for. I don't know if we have better. I just hope we do. It is imperative.

 

You're right, your post is ridiculous. The stats aren't lying. Lee was the QB of the team that demolished Arizona. He was a key component in that game, as he was in the Oklahoma game, the Virginia Tech game, the Texas game, the Missouri game, etc. I'm using dispassionate statistics based on mutually identifiable factors like pass efficiency and SOS, and you're using emotion.

 

Sorry, stats trump emotion every time.

What does seeing a guy with no talent to be a good qb have to do with emotion? Who said anything about emotion? You have nothing more than a brilliant way to build the illusion of making stronger arguments. I will from now on refer to you as knappic Copperfield.

I'm actually reading David Copperfield (the book) right now. How's that for ironic? And I saw the magician David Copperfield at the Orpheum about 22 years ago. His assistant was hot, but the show... not so much. But I digress...

 

You have nothing to base your opinion on other than just that - opinion. That's fine if we're only talking about something unquantifiable, but we're talking about both quantifiable and unquantifiable things:

 

Quantifiable - Zac's stats/record as a starter vs. the competition he faced in the conditions in which he faced them and compared to others in similar situations

Unquantifiable - Zac's level of talent

 

We can draw more definite conclusions from the quantifiable than the unquantifiable, which is why I prefer to use them. Unquantifiable things are based on opinion, and opinions vary but cannot be proven. I am not trying to dissuade you from your opinion, I'm trying to show that what you're basing it on is not factual.

 

 

It's not like we are "stuck" with Zac Lee because we have zero choice. We went out and recruited him with the intent of seeing him lead this offense. We recruited others at the same time to hedge our bet, but bottom line is, Zac Lee isn't a Husker by accident. He isn't a Husker because the guy recruiting him didn't understand quarterbacks. In fact, quite the opposite.

 

 

 

EDIT - so we're clear, the "your post is ridiculous" was supposed to be funny. I didn't mean to come off like I was cracking on you.

[Captain K]

Numbers alone don't tell the story. If wins or stats alone were the measure then you could argue that everyone on a 33-0 high school baseball team should get drafted to the pros over a 5 tool player that is on a 5-27 team. Or, a guy with crappy arm strength on a run based team, who throws the ball only when the defense should be looking run and has a 7-2 td to interception ratio is a great qb. As ridiculous as that sounds, your using stats to support Lee is just as bad. You base it on talent. I saw the guy play. We all did. He's not good. We need better to have the kind of year we all hope for. I don't know if we have better. I just hope we do. It is imperative.

 

You're right, your post is ridiculous. The stats aren't lying. Lee was the QB of the team that demolished Arizona. He was a key component in that game, as he was in the Oklahoma game, the Virginia Tech game, the Texas game, the Missouri game, etc. I'm using dispassionate statistics based on mutually identifiable factors like pass efficiency and SOS, and you're using emotion.

 

Sorry, stats trump emotion every time.

What does seeing a guy with no talent to be a good qb have to do with emotion? Who said anything about emotion? You have nothing more than a brilliant way to build the illusion of making stronger arguments. I will from now on refer to you as knappic Copperfield.

I'm actually reading David Copperfield (the book) right now. How's that for ironic? And I saw the magician David Copperfield at the Orpheum about 22 years ago. His assistant was hot, but the show... not so much. But I digress...

 

You have nothing to base your opinion on other than just that - opinion. That's fine if we're only talking about something unquantifiable, but we're talking about both quantifiable and unquantifiable things:

 

Quantifiable - Zac's stats/record as a starter vs. the competition he faced in the conditions in which he faced them and compared to others in similar situations

Unquantifiable - Zac's level of talent

 

We can draw more definite conclusions from the quantifiable than the unquantifiable, which is why I prefer to use them. Unquantifiable things are based on opinion, and opinions vary but cannot be proven. I am not trying to dissuade you from your opinion, I'm trying to show that what you're basing it on is not factual.

 

 

It's not like we are "stuck" with Zac Lee because we have zero choice. We went out and recruited him with the intent of seeing him lead this offense. We recruited others at the same time to hedge our bet, but bottom line is, Zac Lee isn't a Husker by accident. He isn't a Husker because the guy recruiting him didn't understand quarterbacks. In fact, quite the opposite.

 

 

 

EDIT - so we're clear, the "your post is ridiculous" was supposed to be funny. I didn't mean to come off like I was cracking on you.

Actually, I didn't know you were joking, but no offense taken. I don't think (more opinion) that you can judge a guy by his #'s even when comparing them to other guy's #'s, in, what you call, similar situations.

 

Also, I believe if we would have landed some of our other qb targets, someone else would be leading our team.

 

Enough of this debate. I believe, in the end, that either ZL will not be the starter, or, if he is, he will lose the job.

[bshirt]

If you read my posts, you will not see where I said anyone should start over anyone else. All I've said is Lee sucked eggs last year. I also don't believe the surgery will help him make huge leaps in his progress for this year. I say only that if he starts we will be well below average at qb. Maybe we make it up in other areas, maybe not. I'm going to cheer for whomever they put on the field, but if no one is better than the guy out there last year, most of that cheering will be in vain.

 

P.S. If you are a natural leader, you will exhibit that leadership from the outset. You don't need to develop it, which is not to say that it can't be developed, but the guy didn't show any last year. Maybe he took a summer school class on it.

 

But the facts don't support your argument for "well below average." He was almost exactly average last year, in spite of a myriad of obstacles stacked against him. Look at my stats post in this thread and tell me where he should have done better.

 

 

For 25 years the benchmark of a good Tom Osborne season was nine wins. If nine wins were good enough for T.O., why aren't they good enough for Zac Lee?

 

Because NU won their ten games last year "despite" Lee & the offense. Not because of him.

[knapplc]

Because NU won their ten games last year "despite" Lee & the offense. Not because of him.

 

Show me the games that Lee lost, and show how he lost them.

[bshirt]

I've already posted on this thread how outrageously pathetic our offense was in conference play. Yes, Lee looked great vs the three SunBelt teams. I'll give you that. Whoopie.

 

However, after that, when we started playing BigXII teams he looked confused and incompetent.

 

I don't want to get into a semantics argument with you. I just ask you to use a little common sense. Of course it's impossible to prove any "one" players is totally responsible for losses. But again, an ounce of common sense says that qb is the most critical position for an offense. For the last time I'll simply state our offense stunk to high heaven after the SunBelt teams.

 

Despite a truly superb defense stuffing opponents endlessly and forcing them to punt the ball to us all year long, additionally even playing in the marginal (at best) BigXII North we only averaged 18 pts a game vs BigXII teams. 18 pts a game. Oh, then there's a big 15 pts vs VT too.

 

Our offense was pathetic and so was our qb. End of story.

 

I respect your view, Knapplc. I really do. I also respect Lee for giving his very best. I wish him the best and I'll gladly eat crow if he does excel this year. I very highly doubt it but it would be GREAT if I'm dead wrong. We'll see...

[EZ-E]

Zac Lee will be our starter.

 

1. Zac Lee

2. Cody Green

 

 

 

3. Taylor Martinez

 

Cody Green ran with the 1s in 7-on-7s and Spano did as well ahead of Martinez.

Martinez will be on the field in a role that let's him use his feet to make plays, not as a WR or a RB, as a QB; but he WILL NOT be our starting QB.

 

Zac Lee is fully healed and ready to play. Get over it people. He is our starting QB. Write it down and quote me on it. I will be glad to eat crow if I am wrong but I highly doubt that I will be eating the crow.

[Overland Park Husker]

I agree. It's not even close from what I've been hearing. Martinez will have special packages, like the wildcat, but I doubt much more than that. Would've loved to see what Spano could have done with his time here, but injuries killed his playing career.

[skersfan]

Offense was bad no question.

 

But in honesty what have you seen from the other QB's that would indicate it will improve if they play. Running game with Martinez, if we were go back to ground and pound, but I do not believe that is in the cards.

 

Lee being injured in the second game, not only took away his ability to play the game at a high level physically, but being injured increased his concern for further damage, due to the offensive line. Playing scared is not normally a recipe for success.

 

I was not on the Lee bandwagon last year, but his efforts in the situations he faced last year shows that he will give it his all and even at 70% at best he was better than anyone behind him. That should worry the supporters of the two youngsters.

 

But I do agree that if Zac keeps the job, many reps need to go to the other two as we will be up real creek of poo the following year if things continue as they have the past 3 years.

[kansas husker]

Offense was bad no question.

 

But in honesty what have you seen from the other QB's that would indicate it will improve if they play. Running game with Martinez, if we were go back to ground and pound, but I do not believe that is in the cards.

 

Lee being injured in the second game, not only took away his ability to play the game at a high level physically, but being injured increased his concern for further damage, due to the offensive line. Playing scared is not normally a recipe for success.

 

I was not on the Lee bandwagon last year, but his efforts in the situations he faced last year shows that he will give it his all and even at 70% at best he was better than anyone behind him. That should worry the supporters of the two youngsters.

 

But I do agree that if Zac keeps the job, many reps need to go to the other two as we will be up real creek of poo the following year if things continue as they have the past 3 years.

 

Have you not read bshirt and captin k's posts a torn tendon that requires surgery to repair does not effect your ability to play what so ever. They have told us this and they are much better at evaluating talent than Bo or anyone else on the coaching staff

[skersfan]

Been around many of the same injuries. Never saw an athlete that it did not affect in a major way.

 

My guess is that if Zac had left after his injury last year, we would not be talking a 10-4 season, most likely a losing season. The kid deserves our support until it is proven he is not the answer. We should be thanking him for his efforts and be amazed that he gave them.

[Joe_5700]

I remember hearing the same complaints of Scott Frost during and after the 1996 season. Everyone was singing a different tune after the 1997 season. I'll reserve any judgement of Lee until after the 2010 season.

 

Exactly. I heard many calls for Frankie London to start over Frost in 1996 and the beginning of 1997. It was a complete joke. I have a feeling that Green will be the next London. No offense to Frankie. Remember that dive into the endzone that he had on that messed up extra point kick? Zac Lee will be our starter this year (unless he gets injured) and will be improved over last season with a healthier O-line and a better than 3rd string RB. Niles will also go out with a big senior season.

[admo]

Last year's offense was so inconsistent across the board that each week it was always something. OLine, QB, WR/TE, RBs.. And to me, accountability starts at the top. I'm not bashing playcalling, but I will say the offense had no leadership and demands from anywhere on that side of the ball.

 

If the starter is Lee, then he's got to play a lot better. Same for OL, and backs and recievers.

 

I do think a healthy Lee has earned the spot going into the season. But by the time conference begins, there better not be some concerns at QB. Otherwise they missed the window of opportunity to check out Green and Martinez and Spano. That means we have enough points on the board with a great defense and confidence to try them a few series that is not just handing off the ball. The sched we have is so full of dookie, guys better get some quality reps. I mean, if its such a close race of competition we have no clear cut guy.

[trouble]

Because NU won their ten games last year "despite" Lee & the offense. Not because of him.

 

Show me the games that Lee lost, and show how he lost them.

 

He definitely lost us the VaTech game. You know the game where we got knocked out of FG range because our O-Line had so many penalties?

 

Oh, and the ISU game, Remember all the fumbles that Lee caused? And that one janky interception that rolled around because our WRs couldn't catch that pass?

 

Don't forget the Texas game where Kunalic kicked it out of bounds on the advice of Lee.

 

knapplc how in the world could you forget all of this?

 

Oh and to the guy bagging on Helu, he still had a 1000yd season, even with being injured a lot of the season. he did well against VaTech, OU, KU and had decent stats all the other games. The three where he did not do anything he had less than 10 carries each game.

[knapplc]

knapplc how in the world could you forget all of this?

 

Well, in my defense I drink. A lot.