The General Election

[TAKODA]

 

 

I have a hard time believing Comey would have thrown this last nugget out to the masses "if there wasn't something found that is seriously wrong" regarding HC's e-mail issues.

They won't even review these emails before the election. Clinton is not going to be charged with anything related to these emails before Election Day. It doesn't even sound like Hillary is directly involved with the emails at all. It's complete bunk created by the Republicans out of desperation because they're going to lose the election.

I have sympathy for Comey's position here. Let's remember that he didn't send this out to the masses, he addressed it to Congress. For the political desperation that followed, we can thank Rep. Chaffetz, who packaged and distributed the product.Rep. Chaffetz, of Utah, last seen here being praised (including by me) for being among the first to say "I'm out" after Trump's tape casually propping sexual assault came out.Rep. Chaffetz, who last week clarified he'll still vote for Trump even without an endorsement.Rep. Chaffetz, a man who appears to be in need of a replacement spine.

Sorry Zoogs, Masses may be the wrong term here but my meaning was "out in the open" rather than conversations behind closed doors!

 

What presssures came to bare that would have caused him to change his stance, when he knows full well the quagmire we are already in within this election? He could have just continued his investigation behind the scenes and brought it to light later. If there was something found that was punishable, he could have brought it to light and impeachment procedures could have begun?

 

I guess from my vantage point and if I was in his shoes, I would not ruin my career based on some fictitious attempt by a senator or congressmans witch hunt.

[Red Five]

[TAKODA]

 

 

 

I have a hard time believing Comey would have thrown this last nugget out to the masses "if there wasn't something found that is seriously wrong" regarding HC's e-mail issues.

They won't even review these emails before the election. Clinton is not going to be charged with anything related to these emails before Election Day. It doesn't even sound like Hillary is directly involved with the emails at all. It's complete bunk created by the Republicans out of desperation because they're going to lose the election.

Knapp, you say this but do you honestly believe Comey would do something so unprecedented without knowing "something is wrong " for certain? I would think the pressure and scrutinty he is dealing with right now was calculated (Pro/Con)? We all know that his prior recommendation was done and over with. Why bring this up now and subject himself to whatever the fall out might be, knowing that DT isn't even the peoples choice????

Comey didn't do anything other than issue a tremendously bland statement to the committee out of an abundance of caution.Everything else - EVERYTHING ELSE - is manufactured by the Republicans.As zoogs pointed out, you have Rep. Chaffetz to thank for how this has been construed.

Knapp, you use the words "out of abundance of caution"

 

What changed from the time they addressed this previously to this past Friday? Was he not acting previously "out of abundance of caution"? Weren't we already aware that they were continuing their investigation and that the cloud of potential wrong doing could come to light? (Minuscule as it might be)

[zoogs]

IMO,

 

He could have just continued his investigation behind the scenes and brought it to light later

The Republicans sponsoring the witch hunt, which is to say the Republicans, wouldn't have gone for that. And it would have come off as more collusion.

 

I think Comey was aware of the poor quality of his options no matter what he did. I don't think his hands are totally clean, but I don't think he's trying to save Republicans down ballot either, so much as attempting to do his job of being a political pinball in this time of Stupid Endless Investigation.

[teachercd]

Seriously...this election won't even be close.

[TAKODA]

IMO,

He could have just continued his investigation behind the scenes and brought it to light later

The Republicans sponsoring the witch hunt, which is to say the Republicans, wouldn't have gone for that. And it would have come off as more collusion.I think Comey was aware of the poor quality of his options no matter what he did. I don't think his hands are totally clean, but I don't think he's trying to save Republicans down ballot either, so much as attempting to do his job of being a political pinball in this time of Stupid Endless Investigation.

Republicans wouldn't have gone for that?

 

To me, it had already been decided (by the powers) that the investigation provided no proof of wrong doing when this sh*t hit the fan previously, however they were continuing their investigation going forward.

 

You mention collusion: Many Reps, were feeling that the collusion was siding with Hillary because they believed that if any other person would have done the same as Hillary had done (e-mail confidentiality), they would have gone to prison.

 

To me, Comey bringing this up now is career suicide for him and reinforces my stance that neither of these candidate are worthy of the gas I have to use, to go to the polls to vote.

 

Edit: Can't wait until this sh*t show is done and over with. Maybe my political science professors were right when they stated to our class "You would have to eliminate 10 generations of politicians to get back to honest and ethical standards being implemented in our government". <-- Scary words coming from a University Educator. He is probably worm bait by now!

[zoogs]

There you go. Imagine if Comey had waited until after the election.

 

He's in a difficult spot.

 

It's disappointing that partisan demands might determine the future of his career.

 

If you ask me, all you need to know is that it's another manufactured GOP scandal to know that it's much ado about nothing.

[knapplc]

The Clinton Email Investigation, per se, is done. Comey refers to another, "unrelated" case. The presumption is it's the Anthony Weiner case, but who knows.

Comey's exact words were "...the FBI has learned of the existence of emails that appear to be pertinent to the investigation. I am writing to inform you that the investigative team briefed me on this yesterday, and I agreed that the FBI should take appropriate investigative steps designed to allow investigators to review these emails to determine whether they contain classified information, as well as to assess their importance to our investigation."

Unpacking this, we can answer a couple of questions:

What changed between the end of the Clinton Email Investigation and today that prompted Comey's letter: "the investigative team briefed me on this yesterday" That raises the question of which investigative team, but since the Clinton Email Investigation is not currently active, it's safe to presume this is the team from the other, unrelated to Clinton, currently active investigation.

Is this evidence against Hillary Clinton: "Although the FBI cannot yet assess whether or not this material may be significant" So, they don't even know if this is significant. They haven't assessed it yet, and even if/when they do, it may turn out to be nothing at all. Fairly, it could turn out to be the clinching evidence that puts Hillary behind bars, but that's pure speculation at this point.

 

What's happening now: "the FBI should take appropriate investigative steps designed to allow investigators to review these emails" The review process can begin, presumably (although this is, again, speculation) by allowing the agents involved in the Clinton Email Investigation access to these emails.

 

Are these new emails: Nothing in Comey's letter says they're new.

 

Are these emails from Hillary Clinton: Nothing in Comey's letter says they're from Hillary Clinton.

Does the FBI have possession of these emails: Actually, Comey doesn't say they do. He says "the FBI has learned of the existence of emails" It's possible (although personally I think it unlikely) that they found evidence of emails being sent/received but don't have the actual emails themselves. That could be what Comey is saying with the line "the FBI should take appropriate investigative steps designed to allow investigators to review these emails" This could involve a subpoena if the FBI isn't currently holding these emails. Subpoenas take time, which could possibly be why Comey isn't speculating on when the review will even take place.

 

Why did Comey send this letter at all: "I believe it is important to update your Committees about our efforts in light of my previous testimony." The line about his previous testimony is key here - in July, Comey exonerated Clinton in what was rightly considered a bombshell announcement. After making such an unusually bold statement, it could be a career-killer if anything, at all, comes out in the future and Comey isn't on top of it. Based on that exoneration, it's likely Comey is trying to stay out in front of any story that may come out from this. In short, Comey is trying to save his job.

 

Oddly, this bizarre and unprecedented move may be what costs him his job. But a man who would so rashly exonerate Clinton and, a few months later, throw such a huge wrench into the election, may not be the person we want running the FBI anyway.

[TAKODA]

There you go. Imagine if Comey had waited until after the election.He's in a difficult spot.It's disappointing that partisan demands might determine the future of his career.If you ask me, all you need to know is that it's another manufactured GOP scandal to know that it's much ado about nothing.

Not sure that I at this point, wouldn't favor them finding something to charge her with, allowing Obama to suspend this election in favor of getting someone else in the mix! But then again, how much more time, money, effort and corruption within the election process do we really want to see and hear?

[Danny Bateman]

 

 

 

I have a hard time believing Comey would have thrown this last nugget out to the masses "if there wasn't something found that is seriously wrong" regarding HC's e-mail issues.

They won't even review these emails before the election. Clinton is not going to be charged with anything related to these emails before Election Day. It doesn't even sound like Hillary is directly involved with the emails at all. It's complete bunk created by the Republicans out of desperation because they're going to lose the election.

I have sympathy for Comey's position here. Let's remember that he didn't send this out to the masses, he addressed it to Congress. For the political desperation that followed, we can thank Rep. Chaffetz, who packaged and distributed the product.Rep. Chaffetz, of Utah, last seen here being praised (including by me) for being among the first to say "I'm out" after Trump's tape casually propping sexual assault came out.Rep. Chaffetz, who last week clarified he'll still vote for Trump even without an endorsement.Rep. Chaffetz, a man who appears to be in need of a replacement spine.

Sorry Zoogs, Masses may be the wrong term here but my meaning was "out in the open" rather than conversations behind closed doors!

 

What presssures came to bare that would have caused him to change his stance, when he knows full well the quagmire we are already in within this election? He could have just continued his investigation behind the scenes and brought it to light later. If there was something found that was punishable, he could have brought it to light and impeachment procedures could have begun?

 

I guess from my vantage point and if I was in his shoes, I would not ruin my career based on some fictitious attempt by a senator or congressmans witch hunt.

 

 

What Zoogs is detailed is exactly why Comey felt the need to inject himself into this again in such an unprecedented way.

 

I think that he feared people like Rep. Chaffetz and his buddies coming after him with a vengeance if this type of news leaked out AFTER the election. I'm also sure there are dyed in the wool partisan Republicans inside the FBI who wanted to see Clinton nailed a few months ago and are angry at the outcome.

 

We've already seen Congressional Republicans and Trumpkins alike come dangerously close to asserting the FBI is corrupt/bought off/incompetent based on the outcome of that singular decision. I think Comey waiting until after the election would've turned up the knob for that sentiment to 10 and broken it off. These are the same people that stretched Benghazi into 8 separate Congressional investigations.

 

It was either face backlash now from the left (rightfully so) now, or face it later from the right.

 

But let's be careful, here. Knapp laid bare the fact there's no reason to believe that Comey did this because he knows there is some sure-fire smoking gun in there. Our biases are what could lead us to believe that line of reasoning... if we want it to be true.

[TAKODA]

Well I guess I am the odd man out but this election has done nothing but push me further away from our process.

 

The establishment repeatedly wants me to vote for the lesser of two evils because the other side is so much worse. I call BS, this is what has gotten us to where we are today. I will not support those that do not represent me. In my heart, I can only support candidates that have values, ethics and a voting/trac record that I believe in. I can not and will not support puppets of the oligarchy that have turned our democracy into a plutocracy, and well, for those that do, IMO, they are blind to the way things really are. Our citizens have been lured into the deception by Faux News and the Clinton News Network, (MSM). They have created a climate where it is red against blue rather than documenting and relaying honest and unadulterated details regarding the positions each candidate represent and what the driving force is behind each candidate (interest groups +). Evil is evil, no matter what the degree. The only moral choice is not to vote for evil. What has happened to our society where people have become so convinced, that they feel their only choice is to elect our leaders contingent on which candidate is the least malevolent.

 

I am so tired of this sh*t I could scream. I have scoured and scoured over articles and publications untill my eyeballs feel as if they were going to explode. I can't find the answers I am looking for and for that reason, I am sitting this one out. Neither (none) of these candidate cut the mustard for me.

 

Done with Rant!

[TGHusker]

The Clinton Email Investigation, per se, is done. Comey refers to another, "unrelated" case. The presumption is it's the Anthony Weiner case, but who knows.

 

Comey's exact words were "...the FBI has learned of the existence of emails that appear to be pertinent to the investigation. I am writing to inform you that the investigative team briefed me on this yesterday, and I agreed that the FBI should take appropriate investigative steps designed to allow investigators to review these emails to determine whether they contain classified information, as well as to assess their importance to our investigation."

 

Unpacking this, we can answer a couple of questions:

 

What changed between the end of the Clinton Email Investigation and today that prompted Comey's letter: "the investigative team briefed me on this yesterday" That raises the question of which investigative team, but since the Clinton Email Investigation is not currently active, it's safe to presume this is the team from the other, unrelated to Clinton, currently active investigation.

 

Is this evidence against Hillary Clinton: "Although the FBI cannot yet assess whether or not this material may be significant" So, they don't even know if this is significant. They haven't assessed it yet, and even if/when they do, it may turn out to be nothing at all. Fairly, it could turn out to be the clinching evidence that puts Hillary behind bars, but that's pure speculation at this point.

 

What's happening now: "the FBI should take appropriate investigative steps designed to allow investigators to review these emails" The review process can begin, presumably (although this is, again, speculation) by allowing the agents involved in the Clinton Email Investigation access to these emails.

 

Are these new emails: Nothing in Comey's letter says they're new.

 

Are these emails from Hillary Clinton: Nothing in Comey's letter says they're from Hillary Clinton.

 

Does the FBI have possession of these emails: Actually, Comey doesn't say they do. He says "the FBI has learned of the existence of emails" It's possible (although personally I think it unlikely) that they found evidence of emails being sent/received but don't have the actual emails themselves. That could be what Comey is saying with the line "the FBI should take appropriate investigative steps designed to allow investigators to review these emails" This could involve a subpoena if the FBI isn't currently holding these emails. Subpoenas take time, which could possibly be why Comey isn't speculating on when the review will even take place.

 

Why did Comey send this letter at all: "I believe it is important to update your Committees about our efforts in light of my previous testimony." The line about his previous testimony is key here - in July, Comey exonerated Clinton in what was rightly considered a bombshell announcement. After making such an unusually bold statement, it could be a career-killer if anything, at all, comes out in the future and Comey isn't on top of it. Based on that exoneration, it's likely Comey is trying to stay out in front of any story that may come out from this. In short, Comey is trying to save his job.

 

Oddly, this bizarre and unprecedented move may be what costs him his job. But a man who would so rashly exonerate Clinton and, a few months later, throw such a huge wrench into the election, may not be the person we want running the FBI anyway.

Knapp, good thoughtful, logical presentation. But I'm not commenting on the comments specifically as I said I am tired of discussing the eml stuff until after the election per our agreement on the other thread. Though we might disagree at points, I can still praise you for the way you lay out your argument and your thought process. I have too much ADHD going on to lay it out that distinctly. Good Job. I respect you for it.

If I could slow myself down and think it through like this, we'd probably be in agreement more times than not (anyway that is what my wife tells me).

[Moiraine]

If Clinton loses NC and FL we're gonna have to wait for Colorado and Nevada to find out who won. Gonna be a long night.

[TGHusker]

Yes, and Trump is said to be campaigning in blue states. Maybe to draw Hillary out of the closer battle ground states. It will be a long night. It will be interesting see how PA, NH go early. Might set the tone.

 

Thinking back to 1980 - the election was called by 8 am eastern - about the time the western panhandle of Florida had closed their polls. Everyone thought it was going to be close and many in the media thought Carter would win. Then John Chancellor announced it was a landslide for Reagan. 1984 was similar. That won't occur this time.

[TGHusker]

https://www.yahoo.com/gma/trump-leads-clinton-1-point-poll-enthusiasm-declines-110621705--abc-news-topstories.html

 

As the video/reporter says in this story, Trump will need to run the table on the 'to close to call' states plus flip a blue state like PA. I don't think it will happen. While the enthusiasm #s are up for him and Hillary's #s are going down, there are far more Dems registered and Trump's shortcomings are too many to lure enough independents to his side to win IMHO. Early voting favored Hillary. She has a stronger get out the vote machine than he does as well.