14-year-old girl gang-raped in high school bathroom by illegal immigrants

[zoogs]

I'm struggling to parse what you are saying, Coach. Are you saying they raped her because they were illegal immigrants?

 

What's the "had they not been here" equivalent for rapes that are perpetrated by our own citizens?

 

I certainly agree that this should not be used to push a political agenda. The WH's actions are disgraceful in this regard. Selectively trumpeting crimes of certain categories of people at every opportunity would be reckless if it weren't so intentional.

[Moiraine]

Had they not been here they likely would have raped a Mexican girl. I don't see that as less bad than raping an American girl. It wasn't the move that turned them into rapists.

[Scratchtown]

I'm struggling to parse what you are saying, Coach. Are you saying they raped her because they were illegal immigrants?

 

What's the "had they not been here" equivalent for rapes that are perpetrated by our own citizens?

 

I certainly agree that this should not be used to push a political agenda. The WH's actions are disgraceful in this regard. Selectively trumpeting crimes of certain categories of people at every opportunity would be reckless if it weren't so intentional.

 

I said if you re-read. That she was NOT raped BECAUSE of them being here "illegally" but because they were here "illegally" it certainly had a way of being prevented.

 

I'm not saying them being illegal is why. I am saying that because of the illegal status, there was a prevention of it, it's more of the how/gateway. In my opinion. They raped her because of something that had wrong them in their own past. Not because of nationality or that all illegals are rapists.

 

If that makes sense?

[Scratchtown]

Had they not been here they likely would have raped a Mexican girl. I don't see that as less bad than raping an American girl. It wasn't the move that turned them into rapists.

 

No one said that it was. I certainly said none of those things. Thanks for twisting my words though.

[Moiraine]

 

 

Had they not been here they likely would have raped a Mexican girl. I don't see that as less bad than raping an American girl. It wasn't the move that turned them into rapists.

No one said that it was. I certainly said none of those things. Thanks for twisting my words though.

You just twisted my words. I certainly never said you said any of those things.

[Scratchtown]

 

 

Had they not been here they likely would have raped a Mexican girl. I don't see that as less bad than raping an American girl. It wasn't the move that turned them into rapists.

No one said that it was. I certainly said none of those things. Thanks for twisting my words though.

You just twisted my words. I certainly never said you said any of those things.

 

Then you should clarify who you are responding to.

[StPaulHusker]

 

 

 

Had they not been here they likely would have raped a Mexican girl. I don't see that as less bad than raping an American girl. It wasn't the move that turned them into rapists.

No one said that it was. I certainly said none of those things. Thanks for twisting my words though.

You just twisted my words. I certainly never said you said any of those things.

 

Then you should clarify who you are responding to.

 

It appears she wasn't responding to anyone and just making a comment. That is evidenced by a stand alone post as opposed to a reply on someones post.

 

There is an old saying that if you throw a rock into a pack of dogs, the one that yelps is the one that got hit.

[RedDenver]

I think coach is trying to say (and correct me if I'm wrong, coach) that the "illegal immigrant" part had an effect on time and place which means it changed who their victim was, but had nothing to do with them being rapists, which is the part that matters.

[zoogs]

I mean, it just feels like you are saying if we had stopped (their) illegal immigration, then this (American) girl would be safe. It seems eerily similar to the White House's argument on this matter in support of their policy views. It's like, "I'm not saying we should take an ugly view towards illegal immigrants, but look at this horrible thing that wouldn't have been happened if only we souped up ICE like Trump wants." The latter ultimately negates the former.

[knapplc]

Upwards of 250 rapes happen in America every day. Why do we have a thread in P&R about this one? Because conservative outlets are making this an immigration issue rather than a rape issue.

[Scratchtown]

I think coach is trying to say (and correct me if I'm wrong, coach) that the "illegal immigrant" part had an effect on time and place which means it changed who their victim was, but had nothing to do with them being rapists, which is the part that matters.

 

This is exactly what I'm saying.

[Scratchtown]

I mean, it just feels like you are saying if we had stopped (their) illegal immigration, then this (American) girl would be safe. It seems eerily similar to the White House's argument on this matter in support of their policy views. It's like, "I'm not saying we should take an ugly view towards illegal immigrants, but look at this horrible thing that wouldn't have been happened if only we souped up ICE like Trump wants." The latter ultimately negates the former.

Jesus....no that's not what I'm saying.

 

You all can keep saying that I am, I guess.

[TonyStalloni]

I mean, it just feels like you are saying if we had stopped (their) illegal immigration, then this (American) girl would be safe. It seems eerily similar to the White House's argument on this matter in support of their policy views. It's like, "I'm not saying we should take an ugly view towards illegal immigrants, but look at this horrible thing that wouldn't have been happened if only we souped up ICE like Trump wants." The latter ultimately negates the former.

And there isn't anything false in making that claim. Had this guy not been let into the country, the timeline that put he and the young girl in the same place at the same time would not have happened. I don't understand why this statement causes you grief.

[zoogs]

Jesus....no that's not what I'm saying.

 

You all can keep saying that I am, I guess.

I don't think you are intending to say it, but is that not the content of "...certainly had a way of being prevented"? That mindset precisely makes it an immigration issue and not a rape issue, and it's the type of stuff usually used as justification for a stronger stance on immigration/deportation/wall-building, etc.

 

Reading through your couple of posts again, it seems your entire argument is focused around how this particular case could have been prevented because they were illegal immigrants.

 

That's at least an unconscious appeal to policy, no?

 

And there isn't anything false in making that claim.

What, then, for the native-born rapists?

 

If a church-goer commits a rape, do we clamp down on church-goers? If a legal immigrant commits a rape, do we shut down immigration from that country?

[StPaulHusker]

 

I mean, it just feels like you are saying if we had stopped (their) illegal immigration, then this (American) girl would be safe. It seems eerily similar to the White House's argument on this matter in support of their policy views. It's like, "I'm not saying we should take an ugly view towards illegal immigrants, but look at this horrible thing that wouldn't have been happened if only we souped up ICE like Trump wants." The latter ultimately negates the former.

And there isn't anything false in making that claim. Had this guy not been let into the country, the timeline that put he and the young girl in the same place at the same time would not have happened. I don't understand why this statement causes you grief.

 

Was he "let" into the country or did he cross borders illegally without anyone knowing for a while? There is a difference.