What is wrong with Christianity? And Christians?

[Landlord]

I am not disagreeing with your assessment of the kingdom to come and of the kingdom being made real by our lives currently - just disagree on the logistics of what's going on up in the throne room currently, but like you said, I don't think that affects my salvation or my purpose.

[NUance]

I agree with this...and it took me close to 10 years of study of the Bible to come up with what I considered unbiased translation of the Bible. The idea here is like the game of telephone. Just with a circle of friends, the message you pass gets warped. How much more will that be for translation?

Just curious Blitz, what is your go-to version of the Bible, the version you use most often? I mostly flip-flop between NIV (or NIRV) and KJV. The NIV is so much easier for me to understand, but you just can't beat some of the poetic verses in the King James. For example, the 23rd Psalm in KJV is far and away the most poetic and pleasing version.

 

Anyone else (JJ, LOMS, etc.), what is your go-to version?

[Landlord]

ESV and NASB - they're kind of sister translations, and both straddle right in the middle with good balance between essential literal faithfulness to the languages and beauty/readability in modern English. The NASB is slightly more formal/academic, but the ESV is becoming the go-to in most evangelical circles so there's consistency there.

[Scratchtown]

My study bible is in NIV (Life app) prior to the 2007 versions that came out. I bought my wife what I thought was the same study NIV but her's is the 2007 version.

My NIV, which is comparable to ESV states Matthew 18:15 as this "If your brother sins against you, go and show him his fault, just between the two of you. If he listens to you, you have won your brother over."

My wifes NIV (2007) states the same verse as this: "If your brother or sister sins, go and point out their fault, just between the two of you. If they listen to you, you have won them over."

Look how the context changes! I was very perturbed about this when we were reading and she told me hers said something different. I need to get a KJV. I am starting to believe that the KJV is the best source for accuracy.


Do me a favor and someone go look up Acts 8:37 in your personal bible and tell me the version and what it says. (Don't use the internet, just grab your bible and look it up.)

[NUance]

Do me a favor and someone go look up Acts 8:37 in your personal bible and tell me the version and what it says. (Don't use the internet, just grab your bible and look it up.)

 

Acts 8:36-37

36/37 As they traveled along the road, they came to some water. The official said, “Look! Here is water! Why shouldn’t I be baptized?”

From my NIRV. 36 and 37 are combined.

[JJ Husker]

The Bible I typically read is a Revised Standard Version.

 

Acts 8:36-37

And as they went along the road they came to some water, and the eunuch said, "See, here is water! What is to prevent my being baptized?"

[Scratchtown]

The versions you are reading from don't have 37. It goes from 36 to 38 as the next verse. Why?

Verse 36 (basically the same as yours) And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?



KJV states verse 37 as this:

"And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God."

[tschu]

There she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of horses.

 

Ezekiel 23:20

 

 

 

These are the words of the Lord.

[HSKR]

 

There she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of horses.

 

Ezekiel 23:20

 

 

 

These are the words of the Lord.

 

 

Miley Cyrus is in the Bible?

[JJ Husker]

Deleted

[tschu]

I'm trolling, JJ, calm down.

[JJ Husker]

I'm trolling, JJ, calm down.

Actually I was not familiar with that Ezekiel verse so I spoke before I looked it up and realized that is in fact what it says. Originally thought you were twisting words to get a rise. My bad.

[walksalone]

 

 

But why is it that most wars are started over religion, and not "Science, education, personal experience, philosophy, social justice, or anything else"??

 

If the higher power tells you to go out and slaughter those who don't subscribe to your system of beliefs, it's ok?

 

 

Most wars are started over patriotism and pursuits of power, not religion. In fact, according to Encyclopedia of Wars, 6.98% of all wars as being religious in nature.

 

 

aren't most "pursuits of power", based on religion? Kinda like the Crusades?

 

"Hey, we want the holy land back. Oh, you're not going to give it to us? Well, we'll be there shortly to f*ck you up."

 

And 6.98% of all wars are based on religion? What wingnut came up with that? Some egghead at some "esteemed learning institution"?

[Landlord]

 

 

 

But why is it that most wars are started over religion, and not "Science, education, personal experience, philosophy, social justice, or anything else"??

 

If the higher power tells you to go out and slaughter those who don't subscribe to your system of beliefs, it's ok?

 

 

Most wars are started over patriotism and pursuits of power, not religion. In fact, according to Encyclopedia of Wars, 6.98% of all wars as being religious in nature.

 

 

aren't most "pursuits of power", based on religion? Kinda like the Crusades?

 

"Hey, we want the holy land back. Oh, you're not going to give it to us? Well, we'll be there shortly to f*ck you up."

 

And 6.98% of all wars are based on religion? What wingnut came up with that? Some egghead at some "esteemed learning institution"?

 

 

Pursuits of power are based on human nature and justified by tons of things, religion being one of them. Trying to categorize them into tight little boxes is stupid - were the crusades really about religion, or were they about political power and used religion as their justified means of achieving that end? Or maybe a little bit of both.

 

Either way your assessment is off the mark.

 

 

Since you apparently don't recognize actual published books to be reliable maybe you trust wikipedia Their list of major religious wars is quite short:

 

Thirty Years' War

French Wars of Religion

Nigerian Civil War

Second Sudanese Civil War

Crusades

Lebanese Civil War

 

 

 

As compared to their list of major wars period, without the religious qualification:

 

WWII

Mongol Conquests

Qing dynasty

Taiping Rebellion

Second Sino-Japanese war

WWI

An Lushan Rebellion

Chinese Civil War

Conquests of Tamerlane

Russian Civil War

Napoleonic Wars

Thirty Years' War (

Second Congo War

French Wars of Religion

Shaka's conquests

Korean War

Vietnam War

Mexican Revolution

Persian Gulf War

Japanese invasions of Korea

 

 

that's just a few of them, for example.

[knapplc]

Most of the wars of the 20th Century.

1898-1901 Boxer Rebellion - Multiple causes including anti-foreign & anti-Christian movement.
1899-1902 Boer War - Creation of a single, unified state of South Africa from various disparate regions / British Imperialism
1904-1905 Russo-Japanese War - Imperialistic desires of Russia & Japan to control Manchuria & Korea
1910-1920 Mexican Revolution - Overthrow of Porfirio Diaz & creation of modern-day Mexico
1912-1913 First and Second Balkan Wars - Revolt / freedom from the Ottoman Empire (1st) Stop Bulgarian Imperialism / define borders (2nd)
1914-1918 World War I - Diplomacy run amok, combined with alliances, nationalism & centuries-old European mutual distrust/dissatisfaction
1915-1918 Armenian Genocide - ethnic cleansing of Armenians from Ottoman-Empire Turkey. First modern-day genocide.
1917 Russian Revolution - Overthrow of Tsarist rule in Russia
1918-1921 Russian Civil War - Consolidation of power by Bolshevik Russians and quelling of separatist movements in various states
1919-1921 Irish War of Independence - Overthrow of foreign British rule of Ireland
1927-1937 Chinese Civil War - Ideological split between Communist China & "Nationalist" China (Communists vs. Koumintang)
1935-1936 Second Italo-Abyssinian War - Italian imperialism directed at Ethiopia
1936-1939 Spanish Civil War - Political war fought between warring non-religious factions
1939-1945 World War II - Combat German, Italian & Japanese Imperialism
1945-1990 Cold War - Political / Ideological war between Capitalism/Communism, including Soviet/American Imperialism
1946-1954 French Indochina War - Revolution against French imperialism in southeast Asia
1948 Arab-Israeli War - Religious war at its core, basically a mess of geopolitics, religion & nationalism
1950-1953 Korean War - Political war fought between Nationalists & Communists
1954-1962 French-Algerian War - Algerian overthrow of French imperialism
1955-1972 Anyanya Rebellion - Sudanese civil war between Sudanese government & Anyanya separatists
1956 Suez Crisis - Geopolitical crisis between France, Britain & Israel vs. Egypt, fought over control of the Suez Canal Zone, Gaza Strip & the Sinai
1959 Cuban Revolution - Communist overthrow of corrupt nationalist government
1959-1973 Vietnam War - Communists vs. Capitalists, this time in Vietnam
1967 Six-Day War - response to growing tensions between Israel & Egypt, Jordan and Syria.
1979-1989 Soviet-Afghan War - An extension of the Cold War, combined with Russian/Soviet imperialism & Afghani independence movements
1980-1988 Iran-Iraq War - Geopolitical issues including border disputes, jockeying for power in the Persian Gulf, fear of the Iranian Revolution spreading to Iraq, & religious suppression (Sunni over Shia)
1990-1991 Persian Gulf War - Iraqi imperialism & oil
1991-1995 Third Balkan War - Ethnic conflicts not differentiated by religious affiliation.
1990-1993 Rwandan Civil War - Political conflict featuring genocide (1994) and various other atrocities.

 

Of these wars, only the Arab/Israeli conflicts (Arab/Israeli War, Suez Crisis, Six Day War) can be construed as happening because of religion.

 

All of the major wars in the past century have been fought for primarily political reasons.