Russia

[ZRod]

1 hour ago, Scarlet said:

 

This two would seem to be at extreme odds from a business standpoint.

[BigRedBuster]

 

[TGHusker]

2 hours ago, BigRedBuster said:

 

Reagan is rolling in his grave 

[Decked]

2 hours ago, BigRedBuster said:

 

About time for this thing to end. Ukraine isn’t going to be happy but they’re going to lose at least officially a lot of their Eastern/SE border to Russia. They are dead in the water with no way to win this and losing support. 

[commando]

2 hours ago, BigRedBuster said:

 

those same reublicans "cleared" trump in the "russia, russia, russia" hearings

[Scarlet]

38 minutes ago, Decked said:

About time for this thing to end. Ukraine isn’t going to be happy but they’re going to lose at least officially a lot of their Eastern/SE border to Russia. They are dead in the water with no way to win this and losing support. 

Because a negotiated "peace" with Putin is going to end this.  No way would we wind up sending troops to defend NATO countries like Poland or the Baltic countries to defend against Putin's known desire to reconstitute the Soviet empire. I mean there aren't any historical examples that would back that notion up.

 

Once again abandoning our allies.  That send a fantastic message around the world 

[Decked]

8 minutes ago, Scarlet said:

Because a negotiated "peace" with Putin is going to end this.  No way would we wind up sending troops to defend NATO countries like Poland or the Baltic countries to defend against Putin's known desire to reconstitute the Soviet empire. I mean there aren't any historical examples that would back that notion up.

 

Once again abandoning our allies.  That send a fantastic message around the world 

This is an unwinnable war for Ukraine. They are going to get screwed over regardless. I have my doubts russia attacks any NATO country. It is just a money funnel. 

[Archy1221]

1 hour ago, commando said:

those same reublicans "cleared" trump in the "russia, russia, russia" hearings

The facts cleared him   It’s nearly unanimous at this point (except for a few hardline holdouts I guess) 

[commando]

2 minutes ago, Archy1221 said:

The facts cleared him   It’s nearly unanimous at this point (except for a few hardline holdouts I guess) 

keep believing what MAGA has sold you.

[Archy1221]

1 minute ago, commando said:

keep believing what MAGA has sold you.

1) what is MAGA (outside of the acronym)? 
 

2) has “MAGA” sold it to virtually every middle to left traditional national news media too?   I guess when NYT and CNN are even buying it, you may want to get on the train.  

[commando]

19 minutes ago, Archy1221 said:

1) what is MAGA (outside of the acronym)? 
 

2) has “MAGA” sold it to virtually every middle to left traditional national news media too?   I guess when NYT and CNN are even buying it, you may want to get on the train.  

i get it...you're happy that the current republican party just got thanked by Putin.    hip hip hooray and some sprinkles for your team.

[Decked]

6 minutes ago, commando said:

i get it...you're happy that the current republican party just got thanked by Putin.    hip hip hooray and some sprinkles for your team.

Cutting aside the name calling/baiting. What is the long term objective to help Ukraine winning this war? It doesn’t seem feasible. They are no step closer to regaining territory than before their counteroffensive. It is an endless money pit for American taxpayers. Russia is committed to dig in & drain American finances and support. Do we really want to fund a war for 5 years? And now with Israel we will continue to fund them too. Meanwhile…China is probing Taiwan every day. It is irrational. Please, tell me the long term goal and what the probability for Ukraine winning is. 

[commando]

8 minutes ago, Decked said:

Cutting aside the name calling/baiting. What is the long term objective to help Ukraine winning this war? It doesn’t seem feasible. They are no step closer to regaining territory than before their counteroffensive. It is an endless money pit for American taxpayers. Russia is committed to dig in & drain American finances and support. Do we really want to fund a war for 5 years? And now with Israel we will continue to fund them too. Meanwhile…China is probing Taiwan every day. It is irrational. Please, tell me the long term goal and what the probability for Ukraine winning is. 

if we didn't learn from history we can find out again by making the same mistakes.    do you remember reading about neville chamberlain? (sp)?   specifically his "peace in our time" statement after giving territory to nazi germany?  Hitler told him that he had no further territorial ambitions...but we know how that turned out.   we have stood by and watched russia invade several countries and annex territory for several years now.   it's time to give Ukraine what they need to stop Putin before he finally crosses whatever line he needs to cross before our troops get involved.   that's my opinion FWIW

[Decked]

6 minutes ago, commando said:

if we didn't learn from history we can find out again by making the same mistakes.    do you remember reading about neville chamberlain? (sp)?   specifically his "peace in our time" statement after giving territory to nazi germany?  Hitler told him that he had no further territorial ambitions...but we know how that turned out.   we have stood by and watched russia invade several countries and annex territory for several years now.   it's time to give Ukraine what they need to stop Putin before he finally crosses whatever line he needs to cross before our troops get involved.   that's my opinion FWIW

I am just not sure America can support long term a three prong proxy war. Europe needs to step up. It’s getting tiring being the piggy bank for Europe and the western world. It’s time for the rest of them to contribute more (minus Poland). The American war machine is bankrupting future generations such as myself. Meanwhile enriching the pockets of aging democrats & republicans that have little regard for the future as they will die before real consequences. It’s hard for me to care about Israelis & Ukrainians with debt soaring & spending power decreasing. It’s time for a massive federal spending cut and voting out middle eastern warmongers on both sides. 

[Scarlet]

1 hour ago, Decked said:

This is an unwinnable war for Ukraine. They are going to get screwed over regardless. I have my doubts russia attacks any NATO country. It is just a money funnel. 

It's an unwinnable war for Ukraine if we bailout on them now I agree.  Our most effective weapon systems are just now arriving or are to arrive in the near future.  The Biden administration made the mistake of slow rolling a lot of these systems.  Long range ATACMS should have been there long ago.  

 

If you don't believe Russia won't attack a NATO country after we prove to not have the intestinal fortitude to stick by our allies, once again, and when Trump decides to pull out of NATO then I'd have to disagree.  We're repeating history here.  Weren't you the one who said a cease fire in Gaza only allows Hamas to regroup and continue their war?  I fail to see how this is different.  

 

National defense costs money. That's why there's a budget for it.  I'd consider it a good investment to allow an expansionist dictator bent on reconstituting his country's former empire to significantly degraded his forces.  

 

Sometimes there are no good choices in life.  The worst decision is to cut funding to Ukraine now.  That'll have long term foreign policy ramifications.  China is definitely watching what we do.  

 

Then there's the fact that we helped negotiate the Trilateral Agreement of 1994.  We assured Ukraine national security assistance in the event of exactly what is happening now.  Ukraine believed us and neutered itself in the process.  Other countries won't be so willing to believe us in the future.