Defensive Issues - Who's more at fault?

[huskerfan333157]

On 10/13/2018 at 8:02 PM, lo country said:

You and I have gone back and forth.  I get it.  This staff is perfect and the kids suck.  I have no issue with his philosophy.  I just haven't seen what he describes yet.  I used DT as a universal term for another DL position.  As far as playing for the future, we lost in OT.  It should have never gotten to OT.  I'll say it again. These same kids went 4-8 last year.  This year we might be 1-11.....This is the worst start in 126 years of playing NU football....  

 

I'm not saying to fire anyone.  I've said repeatedly to trust the process that we are short on talent and left with a bare cupboard.  Throw in the 4th DC for some of these kids and it's a recipe for disaster.  BUT Chin needs to adapt and evaluate what he has.  Bo's D was good in the Big XII, but crap in the B1G.  Maybe Chin needs to go back and read his own presser and get that aggressive press coverage style.  Manufacture the QB hurries and sacks....

So you're assuming we have perfect press corners on the roster that won't get beat?  Who are these amazing press corners we don't know about?  Could it be that none of our corners can play press and could get beat deep?  I guess giving up one play touchdowns all the time is okay because we are pressing! 

 

I get you want an aggressive style but every time we get aggressive they proceed to hit us with a big play 

[onlyHskrfaninIL]

aaron williams can't play nickel corner and be stuck in m2m coverage most of the time.  he can't do it.  he might be a decent safety but he is not nor has he ever been a man coverage guy.  much rather see cam taylor get a shot there.

 

go back and watch the 1st TD nagel scored if you don't believe me.

[onlyHskrfaninIL]

17 hours ago, huskerfan333157 said:

What can you do though?  We have no talent on defense at ANY position.  We make mental mistakes.  It's easy to say "he needs to adjust" but can you be specific on how he needs to adjust? You can't say "different personnel packages" because each position is equally as bad.

i would start by taking out my base d-line on obvious passing downs (pretty much the whole 2nd half vs NW) and come up with an actual nickel/dime set.  leave stille and maybe freedom out there and put them on the guards.  the rest would be a combo of gifford, tannor, davis, barry, or whoever to give you some (in theory) more athletic guys that can rush the passer.  That at least give you a better chance with only bringing 4-5 guys. yes, they may adjust and start to run the ball but that is kind of the point to force them to re-adjust.  this diaco like nonsense of leaving the base d-line in the whole time is idiotic.

[Mavric]

6 minutes ago, onlyHskrfaninIL said:

aaron williams can't play nickel corner and be stuck in m2m coverage most of the time.  he can't do it.  he might be a decent safety but he is not nor has he ever been a man coverage guy.  much rather see cam taylor get a shot there.

 

go back and watch the 1st TD nagel scored if you don't believe me.

 

Yeah, he was being asked to do something that is not his best attribute.  There's a reason he's a safety and not a corner.

 

I did see one of the media guys on Twitter say Williams was limping noticeably before that first TD.  But it looked like he was supposed to cut off the slant so he jumped hard inside at the snap.  But the receiver just adjust and ran to the corner.  Williams couldn't keep up.

[onlyHskrfaninIL]

1 minute ago, Mavric said:

 

Yeah, he was being asked to do something that is not his best attribute.  There's a reason he's a safety and not a corner.

 

I did see one of the media guys on Twitter say Williams was limping noticeably before that first TD.  But it looked like he was supposed to cut off the slant so he jumped hard inside at the snap.  But the receiver just adjust and ran to the corner.  Williams couldn't keep up.

yes, he simply doesn't have the footspeed or change of direction to play man to man on a regular basis.  that just isnt his game.

[knapplc]

On 10/13/2018 at 7:45 PM, lo country said:

When Chin first came here he talked about an aggressive D.  DB's who could play press coverage.  That it really wasn't a 3-4, but something flexible.   A D that would be adaptive.  It has been none of this.  A base 3-4 and really not much else.  Little to no press and sure not dynamic and aggressive.  Hard to reach the QB when you start your blitz from 10 yards off the LOS....No stunts, no confusing looks.....Vanilla.  If our strategy is to score 50 if you score 49 and to use the D to simply give our O a rest, we will continue to lose.  Even if we get the horses, this bend don't break will get you bent over in the B1G.  We sure don't have the horses now so how about going to a 4-3 in passing downs and blitz a DB.  Or putting in extra DT's to go to a 5 man front and use 6 DB's when it was fourth and 10 twice....Anything to put the "less" athletic players in a position to win and succeed.  

 

This is exactly where I'm at. I voted "Personnel" in the poll, but it's 51/49 on personnel vs. Chin.

 

We may not have the guys we need, but we are not playing smart football.  It's frustrating to watch.

[TheSker]

On 10/13/2018 at 6:45 PM, lo country said:

Or putting in extra DT's to go to a 5 man front and use 6 DB's when it was fourth and 10 twice....

Mick is out, so who are your 5 DTs and what is the 2 deep?

[Mavric]

It's pretty much damned if you do, damned if you don't on that kind of stuff.  If you play coverage and still give up the first down, people will wonder why you didn't blitz so the QB had less time.  If you bring a blitz and don't get there, people will wonder why you didn't just play coverage when they had so far to go.

[Jeremy]

Chin's scheme for a while was actually fairly decent - drop 8, keep them in front of us, make them nickel and dime. He made a couple glaring mistakes though, especially at the end.

 

As others have mentioned, don't leave Aaron Williams 1 on 1 with Nagel, especially if you're going to send 6. The blitzes weren't bad, but Nagel was wide open on his long TD when we were up 28-14. Bracket Nagel with Williams and Neal, and that doesn't happen, they go 3 and out, and we step on their throats. Same deal when they went 99 yards. How is Williams 1 on 1 in that situation? Why? 

 

Also, when we went up 28-14, we blitzed, and Thorson hit that deep one. Don't blitz there. Don't. Make them nickel and dime down the field, eating up most of the clock so they don't have any at the end. 

 

Also, you can tell a kid to turn around and look for the ball in coverage, but he won't do it in a game unless he has PRACTICED doing it, OVER and OVER and OVER. That's coaching. Maybe he doesn't like practicing it, it's boring or whatever. Who cares, do it. Suck it up and figure it out, or you'll be on the bench. I don't get how this hasn't been addressed. 

 

I don't know what happens in practice, but it's obvious they aren't MAKING Bootle (and others) practice turning around to look for the ball. I see very few other teams with the issues we have there. It's maddening.

[Jeepy]

I'm new here.  Reading through this thread makes one thing clear:  You guys know too much about football and the Huskers in particular.

 

What kind of place is this?

 

 

[huskerfan333157]

1 hour ago, onlyHskrfaninIL said:

i would start by taking out my base d-line on obvious passing downs (pretty much the whole 2nd half vs NW) and come up with an actual nickel/dime set.  leave stille and maybe freedom out there and put them on the guards.  the rest would be a combo of gifford, tannor, davis, barry, or whoever to give you some (in theory) more athletic guys that can rush the passer.  That at least give you a better chance with only bringing 4-5 guys. yes, they may adjust and start to run the ball but that is kind of the point to force them to re-adjust.  this diaco like nonsense of leaving the base d-line in the whole time is idiotic.

That would be a great idea.. if we had depth at cb.  Just because he has "cb" next to his name doesn't mean he can cover.  Also, just because they're athletic doesn't mean they can blockshed or get passed an olineman.  People are acting like we have good pass rushers and good cbs that are hidden on the roster!  They would also see that personnel set that you just mentioned and could audible (they would do this) to the run.  Could you imagine that lineup against the run? It wouldn't be pretty.  So, how would you adjust if you put that lineup out there and they kept audibling to the run?

[onlyHskrfaninIL]

Just now, huskerfan333157 said:

That would be a great idea.. if we had depth at cb.  Just because he has "cb" next to his name doesn't mean he can cover.  Also, just because they're athletic doesn't mean they can blockshed or get passed an olineman.  People are acting like we have good pass rushers and good cbs that are hidden on the roster!  They would also see that personnel set that you just mentioned and could audible (they would do this) to the run.  Could you imagine that lineup against the run? It wouldn't be pretty.  So, how would you adjust if you put that lineup out there and they kept audibling to the run?

As I mentioned, you would obviously have to re-adjust.  But putting your base d in and sitting back in coverage obviously doesn't work either.  Putting guys who should be theoretically better pass rushers out there just makes more sense than leaving guys who we know aren't out there.  That logic might not hold against balanced offenses, but NW really had very little interest in running the ball, especially once behind.

[knapplc]

6 minutes ago, onlyHskrfaninIL said:

Putting guys who should be theoretically better pass rushers out there just makes more sense than leaving guys who we know aren't out there.

 

I'd be willing to bet two dollars that Chin, who has attended one or two practices, knows if the backups are good enough pass rushers. 

 

And that knowledge probably contributes to why they aren't in there.

[onlyHskrfaninIL]

2 minutes ago, knapplc said:

 

I'd be willing to bet two dollars that Chin, who has attended one or two practices, knows if the backups are good enough pass rushers. 

 

And that knowledge probably contributes to why they aren't in there.

i'm not talking about backups i'm talking about swapping out DTs for edge players.

[knapplc]

1 minute ago, onlyHskrfaninIL said:

i'm not talking about backups i'm talking about swapping out DTs for edge players.

 

Which backup edge players can do a better job than our current DTs?