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Democratic Election Thread

TGHusker

By TGHusker,
in Politics & Religion

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Danny Bateman Defensive Coordinator

Danny Bateman

Posted
Posted

Oh, Lil' Red, I forgot this bit:

The debacle in Nevada sucked all the way around. There's no room in this party for violence when dealing with any kind of political proceedings, no matter how mad you are. I don't care if it was Clinton or Sanders supporters, it was unacceptable.

 

I know it's not representative of real supporters of either side, but Sanders supporters posting her phone number online and harassing/threatening her really bothered me. As did Bernie's (IMO) halfhearted repudiation. He seemed more interest in chiding the DNC over perceived injustices than unequivocally condemning that behavior. His response to it really turned me off a great deal, to be honest.

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Lil' Red Scout Team

Lil' Red

Posted
Posted

 

 

Sanders Camp Flirts with Going Full "Burn It Down"

 

Pretty good summary of some rumblings seemingly floating out of the Sanders camp at the moment. Personally, I'm pretty put off by it.

 

I understand the logic, but I disagree about the effect it would have. If this is true, he's shown an ongoing penchant to want to vilify and demonize the Democratic party at large as being too cozy with special interests. This makes sense, since Sanders himself is truly no Democrat and apparently feels no allegiance to the party. It also fits the whispers we've heard from colleagues about his holier-than-thou attitude on the hill. I agree there's a lot that could be improved with our political process, but I'm damn well tired of Sanders turning the entire thing into a gigantic purity test.

 

If he ultimately pursues this course of action and actively hurts his party while helping strengthen the possibility of a Trump presidency, I'd never forgive him. I know there are some fans on the board (Landlord, Moiraine), and I used to sympathize with his cause, but now I'm tired of this old man. If he helps piss away the Supreme Court to conservatives for what's probably the majority of my life, I'd be absolutely livid.

 

Five things the Democratic Party should stop saying about Bernie Sanders

 

This addresses most of the concerns in your article and explains why they are overblown. It also points out how divisive Hillary was in the 2008 primary. I believe Sanders will ultimately get on board and endorse Hillary but I don't have a problem with him voicing his complaints against the Democratic Party and Hillary in the mean time.

 

 

That's a question of opinion. I still have what I feel are valid concerns about the path it appears Sanders wants to take this.

 

For one, I supported Obama in 2008. I much less ardent in the attention that I paid to that election, though, and don't have personal memories of the way the primary devolved. All I've heard are some pretty damning recollections. I will say I'm never a fan of politics taking the low road, and it sounds like that's exactly what happened in 2008. We're all gearing up for more of the same with Trump in 2016.

 

That said, I don't appreciate either of our candidates taking that same road now. But I see some clear distinctions between then and now.

 

Chiefly, Bernie really is not a Democrat. The link that helped bring Clinton and Obama together in 2008, even as heated as it got, was that in the end, they both wanted what was best for the party. We do not have that guarantee with Bernie, as much as I'd like to think we do. He's an Independent that appears to have major resentment with the MO of the Democratic party and how they carry out elections.

 

Who's to say he feels like he owes the Dems anything? If he feels they cheated him out of anything, would he not try to skewer them for what he perceives to be their rigged, corrupt nature? I'm not sure, and I wish I was.

 

Normally, I'd agree that he should stay in through California and spread his message, as he's earned it. But his attacks on Clinton are being used verbatim by the Trump campaign, and he seems consumed by lodging complaints at the DNC about how unfair the process is and how they're disenfranchising voters.

 

Ideally, in my mind, he'd stay in until the end, stop criticizing Clinton or the Dems, and make it very clear he gets serious planks on the party platform, including some reforms he wants to the primary process.

 

Right now, he's actively hurting my party, and it's all to go down in a flame of ideological purity. I'm thinking more about the cold, hard, end result here. Bernie won't be the nominee. And if he does damage to our chances to win in November in the meantime, I for one am not going to forgive him.

 

 

He's not a true Democrat but if he truly cares about his policies (which I believe he does) he'll endorse Hillary and help her win the general election. I'm not concerned that anything he does now will have much of an effect on the general election as long as he endorses Hillary.

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Lil' Red Scout Team

Lil' Red

Posted
Posted

Oh, Lil' Red, I forgot this bit:

 

The debacle in Nevada sucked all the way around. There's no room in this party for violence when dealing with any kind of political proceedings, no matter how mad you are. I don't care if it was Clinton or Sanders supporters, it was unacceptable.

 

I know it's not representative of real supporters of either side, but Sanders supporters posting her phone number online and harassing/threatening her really bothered me. As did Bernie's (IMO) halfhearted repudiation. He seemed more interest in chiding the DNC over perceived injustices than unequivocally condemning that behavior. His response to it really turned me off a great deal, to be honest.

 

I agree.

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Moiraine Head Coach

Moiraine

Posted
Posted

dudeguyy - pretty sure I already told you that while I like Sanders and don't like Clinton, I'll vote for her if she wins the nomination. I will be pissed if Sanders runs as an independent. Unless of course he can pull off a miracle and actually win, which seems unlikely.

 

That being said if he can somehow get rid of superdelegates immediately and win the nomination I'm fine with it and don't mind him trying. I don't really think he's damaging Clinton. And as I've mentioned before it's only been his party for one year.

 

On the flip side... superdelegates don't seem like such a bad idea. If the Republicans had them they might not have had Trump as their nominee.

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Danny Bateman Defensive Coordinator

Danny Bateman

Posted
Posted

dudeguyy - pretty sure I already told you that while I like Sanders and don't like Clinton, I'll vote for her if she wins the nomination. I will be pissed if Sanders runs as an independent. Unless of course he can pull off a miracle and actually win, which seems unlikely.

 

That being said if he can somehow get rid of superdelegates immediately and win the nomination I'm fine with it and don't mind him trying. I don't really think he's damaging Clinton. And as I've mentioned before it's only been his party for one year.

 

On the flip side... superdelegates don't seem like such a bad idea. If the Republicans had them they might not have had Trump as their nominee.

 

I had forgotten you had said you were fine with either. I just recalled that you mentioned at some point that you preferred Sanders.

 

It seems like the Dems may need to unseat the head of the DNC as a bit of a peace offering to Sanders since it appears that he feels incredibly wronged in all of this. I don't really care about that. Honestly, DWS is pretty unlikable.

 

I don't necessarily think he's been shafted as badly as he does. And you're right, the supers do serve a real purpose. Nominating a super far left candidate with no superdelegate input led to this electoral college map:

 

Electoral_college_1972.jpg

 

... and set the advent of superdelegates in motion.

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  • 2 weeks later...

HuskerNation1 All Conference

HuskerNation1

Posted
Posted

 

It looks like Bernie has caught up to Hillary in California. If she can't beat a self-described socialist, how in the heck is she going to win in November. She has to be the worst candidate ever, worse than McCain was in 2008.

We're talking about California.

 

 

I mean in general she's still struggling to topple him. As far as California goes, I know views are out of the mainstream there, but I don't view it is a progressive/socialist safehaven as there are plenty of establishment Dems there too. And she was winning in CA by over 10 points just a week or two ago.

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HuskerNation1 All Conference

HuskerNation1

Posted
Posted

She's leading him by 767 delegates. There is 475 delegates in California but it's not a winner take all state. So, at most, it looks like they will split them. All she needs is 71 more to secure the nomination.

 

I'm failing to see where she is "struggling to put topple him".

 

Well when counting actual votes won, the delegate count is 1769 to 1501. I'm not saying she is not leading, but she has taken much longer to secure the Dem nomination in a 3 or 4 person field than Trump did in a 16 person field, and the candidates on the GOP side were much stronger that Trump toppled than what Hillary had to deal with. I'm not discounting Bernie's success with the far left elements of the Democratic party either.

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Danny Bateman Defensive Coordinator

Danny Bateman

Posted
Posted

 

She's leading him by 767 delegates. There is 475 delegates in California but it's not a winner take all state. So, at most, it looks like they will split them. All she needs is 71 more to secure the nomination.

 

I'm failing to see where she is "struggling to put topple him".

 

Well when counting actual votes won, the delegate count is 1769 to 1501. I'm not saying she is not leading, but she has taken much longer to secure the Dem nomination in a 3 or 4 person field than Trump did in a 16 person field, and the candidates on the GOP side were much stronger that Trump toppled than what Hillary had to deal with. I'm not discounting Bernie's success with the far left elements of the Democratic party either.

 

 

She's struggling in the same way Obama "struggled" to put away Clinton in 2008. Much less so, by the numbers. It's just a natural by-product of the proportional delegate system they use. Bernie benefited particularly well from being the only other alternative.

 

Trump, on the other hand, benefited in a major way from the WTA allocation. If they'd have used the same system the Dems used, I doubt he would've been the nominee.

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