Why is Donald Trump a racist?

[JJ Husker]

 

 

 

Dangit LOMS. I got a cramp in my thumb just scrolling through that one post.

 

 

But let's just be calm and see how it goes, right?

Nah, you go ahead and do whatever you're going to do now. I'm done trying to calm anybody down. But personally, I'm going to wait to lose my sh#t for when some actual racist legislation begins or executive order actually occurs.

 

What if there is never any change in legislation but hate crimes increase 200, 300, 400%?

Do you mean an escalaton in race related problems like we have seen these last few years while Obama was in the White House? That type of increase, with generally worse race relations in the country? Sure, I guess you can blame one man, DJT, for that if you wish.

[ColoNoCoHusker]

 

 

 

 

Dangit LOMS. I got a cramp in my thumb just scrolling through that one post.

 

But let's just be calm and see how it goes, right?

Nah, you go ahead and do whatever you're going to do now. I'm done trying to calm anybody down. But personally, I'm going to wait to lose my sh#t for when some actual racist legislation begins or executive order actually occurs.

 

What if there is never any change in legislation but hate crimes increase 200, 300, 400%?

Do you mean an escalaton in race related problems like we have seen these last few years while Obama was in the White House? That type of increase, with generally worse race relations in the country? Sure, I guess you can blame one man, DJT, for that if you wish.

 

 

JJH - Just so we are clear...

 

You are stating that the erosion of white male privilege; the war against institutional & systemic discrimination in police, government service, healthcare, and financial sectors; a minuscule improvement in fair pay for women & minorities; and a focus on Ability/Capability/Achievement rather than on Race/Color/Creed/Religion/Gender/Sexual Orientation/other arbitrary classification are, in fact, a worsening of race relations in this country?

 

Or, are you stating the improvement minorities expected 8 years ago have not been fully realized in this country and we still have a long way to go before women and non-white male heterosexuals have the same rights and privileges in their daily lives as white male heterosexuals?

 

Sincerely

~72% of US population

[JJ Husker]

 

 

 

 

 

Dangit LOMS. I got a cramp in my thumb just scrolling through that one post.

 

 

But let's just be calm and see how it goes, right?

Nah, you go ahead and do whatever you're going to do now. I'm done trying to calm anybody down. But personally, I'm going to wait to lose my sh#t for when some actual racist legislation begins or executive order actually occurs.

 

What if there is never any change in legislation but hate crimes increase 200, 300, 400%?

Do you mean an escalaton in race related problems like we have seen these last few years while Obama was in the White House? That type of increase, with generally worse race relations in the country? Sure, I guess you can blame one man, DJT, for that if you wish.

JJH - Just so we are clear...

 

You are stating that the erosion of white male privilege; the war against institutional & systemic discrimination in police, government service, healthcare, and financial sectors; a minuscule improvement in fair pay for women & minorities; and a focus on Ability/Capability/Achievement rather than on Race/Color/Creed/Religion/Gender/Sexual Orientation/other arbitrary classification are, in fact, a worsening of race relations in this country?

 

Or, are you stating the improvement minorities expected 8 years ago have not been fully realized in this country and we still have a long way to go before women and non-white male heterosexuals have the same rights and privileges in their daily lives as white male heterosexuals?

 

Sincerely

~72% of US population

Well, I guess, thank you for telling me what I must've really meant by simply commenting that race relations now, before DJT came on the scene, seem to be much more strained than they were 4 or 8 years ago.

 

PS: Note to other posters- please refrain from reading things that are not actually included in a person's post. Thanks much in advance.

[ColoNoCoHusker]

I can make vague, subjective, and unsubstantiated statements as well. It does not make any of them true.

 

"Our economy was great in 2008."

"Healthcare has never been worse in this country"

"Everyone is a whiner"

"Republicans are..."

 

If you are going to make vague, subjective statements without any concrete examples, how is anyone supposed to interpret it correctly?

 

You say things are worse and more strained but provide nothing of substance around this. I asked for clarification and you still refuse to provide it and are acting a little snippy over it. If you are going to emote and provide unsubstantiated opinion, this is what you will get...

[zoogs]

I think it's important to understand a few things about race relations:

 

- Social justice won victories in the 1960s, but racism wasn't defeated. It just became subtler and more creative. It will never be defeated.

- Systemic racial inequality does exist, it's felt by a lot of people, and they're slowly finding a stronger voice about it.

- Man is there a backlash to that. I tend to blame racism, when it comes to racism -- and not those who stand up against it for provoking the reaction.

- The victories over the years have never been more fragile in the post-Shelby County v Holder era, and now we've elected a President talking about nationwide stop-and-frisk and going after the "inner city" war zones with stronger enforcement.

 

A lot of these problems as they existed weren't any particular person's fault (hence, systemic). But boy, it seems like we're going in the wrong direction here. I'd credit those who were able to see and encourage discussion/action about the problems, rather than those who both refuse to see and would bring about a newly regressive era.

[knapplc]

Well, I guess, thank you for telling me what I must've really meant by simply commenting that race relations now, before DJT came on the scene, seem to be much more strained than they were 4 or 8 years ago.

 

PS: Note to other posters- please refrain from reading things that are not actually included in a person's post. Thanks much in advance.

How are race relations worse today than they were 8 years ago?

If they are demonstrably worse, what role, specifically, has Barack Obama played in that?

If they are demonstrably worse, what role, specifically, have White racists played in that?

If they are demonstrably worse, what role, specifically, Conservative America played in that? *

If they are demonstrably worse, how, specifically, will Barack Obama leaving office help that?

If they are demonstrably worse, how, specifically, will Donald Trump taking office help that?

 

* Note that I specifically split Conservative America and White racists apart. They are not one and the same.

[Landlord]

Race tensions are high because, suddenly, we're actually paying attention to it, and people are not happy.

 

 

It's not that things are actually worse, imo - it's that the flashlight has finally been shone on the dark corners of our country that too many of us thought disappeared after the 60's.

[JJ Husker]

 

Well, I guess, thank you for telling me what I must've really meant by simply commenting that race relations now, before DJT came on the scene, seem to be much more strained than they were 4 or 8 years ago.

 

PS: Note to other posters- please refrain from reading things that are not actually included in a person's post. Thanks much in advance.

How are race relations worse today than they were 8 years ago? I said "seem" to be much more strained. They may not be actually worse but more what LOMS is saying below. I don't think there is any questioning that it is much more at the forefront and therefore seems to be worse. However, if anyone thinks they are better, I would sure entertain the explanation.

If they are demonstrably worse, what role, specifically, has Barack Obama played in that? He was/is the President. No specific role in it other than it did not improve under his watch as hoped and the standard for most of these things has little to do with what the President actually does and is usually only related to when he held office. I would also add that just by being the first black President, it caused some backlash reaction with actual racists in this country. Not his fault but just a consequence of his being black.

If they are demonstrably worse, what role, specifically, have White racists played in that? A huge role as that is fairly self explanatory. I would add that black racists also contributed as do all racists.

If they are demonstrably worse, what role, specifically, Conservative America played in that? * Not sure any of it can be contributed to "conservative America" just like it can't be contributed to "liberal or progressive America" so, none.

If they are demonstrably worse, how, specifically, will Barack Obama leaving office help that? It won't.

If they are demonstrably worse, how, specifically, will Donald Trump taking office help that? It won't.

 

* Note that I specifically split Conservative America and White racists apart. They are not one and the same. Thank you.

 

 

 

Race tensions are high because, suddenly, we're actually paying attention to it, and people are not happy.

 

 

It's not that things are actually worse, imo - it's that the flashlight has finally been shone on the dark corners of our country that too many of us thought disappeared after the 60's.

I would agree that much of it is due to the light in the dark corners. And some of it is due to people seeing things in those poorly illuminated shadows that don't really exist. When it comes to these police shooting issues, I have seen just about as many false claims of racism as I have legitimate claims. But, I will acknowledge that if we get rid of the real cases, the false claims should dwindle exponentially.

[Moiraine]

Racial tensions are high because the internet exists and the problems, while less frequent and severe than ever before, still exist.

[teachercd]

Racial tensions are high because the internet exists and the problems, while less frequent and severe than ever before, still exist.

This is 100% so true.

 

It is so simple but so true. Good lord, just look at comments that people leave on YouTube and FB and Instagram and stuff like that...

 

So many people, White, Black, Brown, Sunburnt, Super Pale where they can't check their mail without sunscreen, Orange because they still use an old tanning bed and even that grayish-green color...are a$$hole$.

 

Sometimes people forget that a lot of people are just a$$hole$. It isn't education or lack of...it isn't how they were raised or weren't raised...it isn't the job they have or don't have...some people are just a$$hole$.

[JJ Husker]

Racial tensions are high because the internet exists and the problems, while less frequent and severe than ever before, still exist.

Are the problems really less frequent and less severe than ever before?

I understand that the internet and social media sometimes (read-usually) blows things out of proportion but I'm pretty sure that only 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 years ago that the internet and social media existed and that we also would have otherwise heard about police shootings, people shooting police, etc.

Not being snarky (for the first time today), would really like to see some hard data that proves racial tension is objectively less now than ever before. I'm really not seeing that.

[zoogs]

I think social media really rose up in the 2005-2006 area. At that time YouTube was just starting up, Twitter was nonexistent, and Facebook was the exclusive domain of colleges and high schools. The first iPhone came out in I want to say 2008 (Moiraine makes a great point below about smartphone/social media ubiquity). There's been a lot of change in this time.

 

I don't know how exactly you'd measure something like that, since a lot of it is after all perception. I would say that society as a whole has been getting better and more peaceful in the United States over the decades. And I think times where all this stuff happened but nobody heard the voices of those it happened to (at a national level), that wasn't better, even if it meant that we could all be happier about things we assumed didn't happen.

 

Just for example, discriminatory housing practices. Still going on today. But after decades of tireless effort combating it (you go, Tim Kaine!) and a lot of consciousness gained on the issue, it's impossible that we haven't come quite a long way on this.

 

(EDIT) Since I brought up that example, it stands that there would be data. Here's a 2012 report quantifying and qualifying areas of improvement and areas of ongoing concern. http://www.huduser.gov/portal/Publications/pdf/HUD-514_HDS2012_execsumm.pdf

[Moiraine]

 

Racial tensions are high because the internet exists and the problems, while less frequent and severe than ever before, still exist.

Are the problems really less frequent and less severe than ever before?

I understand that the internet and social media sometimes (read-usually) blows things out of proportion but I'm pretty sure that only 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 years ago that the internet and social media existed and that we also would have otherwise heard about police shootings, people shooting police, etc.

Not being snarky (for the first time today), would really like to see some hard data that proves racial tension is objectively less now than ever before. I'm really not seeing that.

 

The internet is used by way more people now, for way more hours, for way more things. So we hear about way more incidents. They can be posted on the internet immediately after they happen, and then people thousands of miles away see it. Semi-related: I remember my mom talking about how bad crime was in the 90s, and my brother would always have to tell her crime rates are actually down, they're just on the news more often. And by the data, he was right.

 

Anyway, back in 2008, IIRC, not nearly as many people could take good quality video with their phones. I got my first smartphone in 2011 (although I was a little bit late).

 

The thing I remember seeing with actual data is police shootings, but the graph only goes up to 2011.

 

 

 

And since you mentioned people shooting police:

 

 

This graph shows mid-year killings. It's showed the latest year I could find.

For 2016 we're on pace to have 139 line of duty deaths (natural causes included). But that isn't the midpoint. The midpoint is probably 70.

 

Here's the total (mid-year), which I'm including because it shows 2016 - you can find graphs with full year but the 2014 one was the latest I found. The trends are very similar:

 

 

Also, keep in mind, these are not per capita and they are not per police officer. These are total deaths. I don't know how the size of our police force has changed over the years, but I'm guessing it's gone up, so if this graph had proportions the decrease would be much larger.

 

 

One last thing I want to add. I've seen Obama blamed for this over and over, and maybe I've mentioned it on this forum before, but does no one consider that maybe, just maybe, having him as president has made Blacks feel empowered to speak up when they see racism? Whereas before they may have thought they should stay quiet. I've posted some graphs to show things are better, but there are still HUGE disparities in a lot of things.

[Moiraine]

Here's another one. Not really race related. Just found it interesting. People really like alcohol.

 

 

 

What I really want is that first graph through 2015. I could search hate crimes but I don't think that's a good one. It seems to be a relatively new term and it's pretty subjective.


Edit: well, this covers only modern years so that makes it more legit in my mind, for a phrase, "hate crime" that's fairly new, so I'm including it. I would have expected it to go up as more people used the phrase:

[zoogs]

This story isn't about Donald Trump. But to think that we are only concerned with the personal racism or not of one man would be to miss the boat entirely.

 

WaPo: 'Ape in heels' - WV officials under fire after comments about Michelle Obama

 

After Donald Trump’s election as president, Pamela Ramsey Taylor, who was director of Clay County Development Corp. in Clay, a tiny town outside Charleston, reportedly posted about the move from Michelle Obama to Melania Trump on Facebook, saying: “It will be so refreshing to have a classy, beautiful, dignified First Lady back in the White House. I’m tired of seeing a Ape in heels,” according to NBC affiliate WSAZ.

 

The news station reported that the town’s mayor, Beverly Whaling, then replied, “Just made my day Pam.”