The P&R Plague Thread (Covid-19)

[BigRedBuster]

1 minute ago, Archy1221 said:

Since all payments rates are basically set by the government currently, it is impossible to have government out of everything.  

They are?  How so?

[Born N Bled Red]

9 minutes ago, Archy1221 said:

Well, providers depend on private insurance rates to pay their bills.  To make trillions and enrich their stockholders. If your happy with less providers, less innovation, then go with an all Medicare solution. 
 

If that’s your solution, then why don’t we have the government run everything?  Get rid of every middle man and things will be cheaper all around.  Gov could own every store and products will be cheaper too. Gov could own every manufacturing facility and company that way everything is cheaper and get those darned middle men profits out of there.  Less costs, more money for the rest of us, cause salaries will all be the same or Gov can just give us monthly checks since they own everything 

 

Fixed it for you.

 

PS. Nice Slippery Slope logical fallacy. 

[DevoHusker]

35 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

This doesn't affect the cost of the individual treatment.  People in other countries spend multiple times the cost of the same procedure as we do.  That's directly related to the relationship the system has with insurance companies.

 

So...other countries don't have it so good? Or am I reading this wrong?

[Archy1221]

6 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

They are?  How so?

Private insurance uses Medicare rates to set their rates. 

[BigRedBuster]

3 minutes ago, DevoHusker said:

So...other countries don't have it so good? Or am I reading this wrong?

miss typed.  We spend multiple times what other countries do.

 

2 minutes ago, Archy1221 said:

Private insurance uses Medicare rates to set their rates. 

That's what I figured you meant.

 

So....why don't we pay Medicare rates instead of a certain amount ABOVE Medicare rates?

 

And, government doesn't set how much more I pay.  So...no....they don't set the rates.

[Archy1221]

4 minutes ago, Born N Bled Red said:

 

Fixed it for you.

 

PS. Nice Slippery Slope logical fallacy. 

How do providers make trillions and enrich stockholders?   Most provided I know own their practice or are employed in a hospital system?  

[Archy1221]

2 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

miss typed.  We spend multiple times what other countries do.

 

That's what I figured you meant.

 

So....why don't we pay Medicare rates instead of a certain amount ABOVE Medicare rates?

Private companies can choose to pay whatever rates they want to a provider I guess.  I don’t know why they are more generous than the government.  Never worked in that type of company.  I will ask around and see why though. 

[BigRedBuster]

2 minutes ago, Archy1221 said:

Private companies can choose to pay whatever rates they want to a provider I guess.  I don’t know why they are more generous than the government.  Never worked in that type of company.  I will ask around and see why though. 

Sure, ask around.

But, the answer is that it's easy.  They can just pass on the cost to who's paying for the insurance.  Which...in the US is many times employers.  The employee/patient only really cares about the deductible and co-pays.  They have no clue what it's really costing and don't care.  The employer has to keep paying more and more to provide good benefits to attract employees.  The Insurance company doesn't care because they can just pass it on.

[Born N Bled Red]

9 minutes ago, Archy1221 said:

How do providers make trillions and enrich stockholders?   Most provided I know own their practice or are employed in a hospital system?  

 

Ah, now we are conflating insurance providers with healthcare providers to confuse the question. - The conversation about cutting out the middleman is in regard to the insurance providers. 

[Born N Bled Red]

5 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

Sure, ask around.

But, the answer is that it's easy.  They can just pass on the cost to who's paying for the insurance.  Which...in the US is many times employers.  The employee/patient only really cares about the deductible and co-pays.  They have no clue what it's really costing and don't care.  The employer has to keep paying more and more to provide good benefits to attract employees.  The Insurance company doesn't care because they can just pass it on.

 

Huh? Nearly all employer provided healthcare includes an employee cost share that also rises at the same time the cost to the employer does. I'm pretty darned sure that when my cola adjustment is completely wiped out by the increase in my portion of healthcare costs and then some, I care greatly. So does nearly every other employee in America. 

[BigRedBuster]

The first graph in this article just about makes me want to puke.  There is ABSOLUTELY no reason why this is like this other than people yelling SOCIALISM!!!!  Every time the subject is brought up.

 

LINK

 

 

[BigRedBuster]

6 minutes ago, Born N Bled Red said:

 

Huh? Nearly all employer provided healthcare includes an employee cost share that also rises at the same time the cost to the employer does. I'm pretty darned sure that when my cola adjustment is completely wiped out by the increase in my portion of healthcare costs and then some, I care greatly. So does nearly every other employee in America. 

I'm the one who purchases the health insurance for our company.  If an employee of ours goes and gets an MRI, they only need to worry about their deductible and co-pays.  They don't care if the MRI costs $10,000 or $1,000.

 

Edit:  I just checked with the person who administers our plan in our company.  I asked if a person gets sick and is in the hospital and the bill is $50,000, how much does the employee pay.  Answer:  Just the deductible.

 

That's why the patient never really cares.

[DevoHusker]

19 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

miss typed.  We spend multiple times what other countries do.

 

Got it. I didn't want to assume, but thought that was the case. 

[BigRedBuster]

@Archy1221  This is a good article showing why looking at life expectancy compared to cost is important.  We basically are spending WAY more than other countries and getting fewer services for it.

 

LINK

 

We pay TRILLIONS of dollars to health insurance companies whose motivated to REDUCE us using the healthcare system.  Look at the number of physician consultations and length of hospital stays compared to other countries.  This is a direct result of insurance companies denying coverage and pressuring Drs to release patients quicker and quicker....so they don't have to pay more.

 

Then, when you compare that to the very first graph on what we spend compared to those countries....we are getting ripped off.  

 

Our healthcare system SUCKS and anyone who tries to claim it's the best in the world is brainwashed or doesn't want to look at the reality of the situation.

[Archy1221]

15 minutes ago, Born N Bled Red said:

 

Ah, now we are conflating insurance providers with healthcare providers to confuse the question. - The conversation about cutting out the middleman is in regard to the insurance providers. 

we aren’t, you are. I was clearly talking about doctors depending on private insurance rates in many cases to pay their bills. You are the one who tried to “fix” my post 
 

Well, providers depend on private insurance rates to pay their bills.  To make trillions and enrich their stockholders. If your happy with less providers, less innovation, then go with an all Medicare solution.

 

If cutting out middle men is so great in healthcare then why don’t we do it in every industry?   If we can save so much money and have better healthcare with government in total control then why can’t government do this in every industry?  Let’s do it all around.   Cost savings would be everywhere by your logic and we don’t need private industry.