QB Race

[EZ-E]

1. Martinez would be the best running QB we've had since Jammal Lord.

 

2. Jammal Lord nearly single-handedly beat Texas, even with a Craig Bohl defense.

 

3. Zac Lee couldn't get a TD on Texas even when Niles Paul gave him the ball at the 10 yard line. He only got a TD on Oklahoma when Prince gave him the ball at the 1 yard line.

 

4. Martinez will make mistakes. So will/did Lee. But Taylor can make plays with his legs that Lee simply can't make. The jury is still out on making plays with his arm.

 

5. The offense last year was terrible. It was beyond terrible. It was one of the worst offenses I've ever seen. Anybody who isn't at least open to the idea of having a new QB is out of their mind.

 

This whole argument is stupid, because no one participating has seen Zac Lee or Taylor Martinez or Cody Green all fall. It's been a competition that only the coaches have been able to evaluate. For anyone here to question their judgement without seeing a single practice is just ridiculous. Whoever's in the lead in the competition will get the start tomorrow, and that will be our first chance to evaluate anything on our own. And within the next few weeks, I'm sure it will all sort itself out, and by the end of the Washington game, it'll be pretty clear who we want at QB. Until then, just chill out.

 

With all that said, it kind of seems like people are picking sides, and that's stupid too. It seems like some people here are actually hoping Martinez goes out and fails so their personal views are validated. Some people are ripping on Lee even though he played all of last year with a bum elbow. People are ripping on Green even though he was a true freshman. Stop picking sides. How do you not hope that Martinez is going to show up and be able to manage the game, and throw the ball well, on top of his crazy running abilities. How do you not hope that Lee hasn't come back from his surgery even stronger, a better leader, and a more able runner? How do you not hope that Cody's gotten a better grip on the offense?

 

Pelini's going to start the guy who he thinks will help the team win. Bo Pelini knows more about football then anyone on this board. He knows more about what it takes to win football games than anyone on this board. And he hates losing way, way more than anyone on this board. So please, everybody just CHILL OUT.

 

 

In your five points above you make it seem very clear to me that your opinion is that we should go with TMart, but then in the next three paragraphs you tell us not to pick sides.

 

You also state some things about Lee making it appear that you are blaming all of the offensive issues on him last year, but then proceed to say that people get all over him even though he played hurt. If you would have posted the bottom couple of paragraphs it would have been okay, but the first five points don't mirror what you said in the last three paragraphs.

[jsneb83]

1. Martinez would be the best running QB we've had since Jammal Lord.

 

2. Jammal Lord nearly single-handedly beat Texas, even with a Craig Bohl defense.

 

3. Zac Lee couldn't get a TD on Texas even when Niles Paul gave him the ball at the 10 yard line. He only got a TD on Oklahoma when Prince gave him the ball at the 1 yard line.

 

4. Martinez will make mistakes. So will/did Lee. But Taylor can make plays with his legs that Lee simply can't make. The jury is still out on making plays with his arm.

 

5. The offense last year was terrible. It was beyond terrible. It was one of the worst offenses I've ever seen. Anybody who isn't at least open to the idea of having a new QB is out of their mind.

 

This whole argument is stupid, because no one participating has seen Zac Lee or Taylor Martinez or Cody Green all fall. It's been a competition that only the coaches have been able to evaluate. For anyone here to question their judgement without seeing a single practice is just ridiculous. Whoever's in the lead in the competition will get the start tomorrow, and that will be our first chance to evaluate anything on our own. And within the next few weeks, I'm sure it will all sort itself out, and by the end of the Washington game, it'll be pretty clear who we want at QB. Until then, just chill out.

 

With all that said, it kind of seems like people are picking sides, and that's stupid too. It seems like some people here are actually hoping Martinez goes out and fails so their personal views are validated. Some people are ripping on Lee even though he played all of last year with a bum elbow. People are ripping on Green even though he was a true freshman. Stop picking sides. How do you not hope that Martinez is going to show up and be able to manage the game, and throw the ball well, on top of his crazy running abilities. How do you not hope that Lee hasn't come back from his surgery even stronger, a better leader, and a more able runner? How do you not hope that Cody's gotten a better grip on the offense?

 

Pelini's going to start the guy who he thinks will help the team win. Bo Pelini knows more about football then anyone on this board. He knows more about what it takes to win football games than anyone on this board. And he hates losing way, way more than anyone on this board. So please, everybody just CHILL OUT.

 

 

In your five points above you make it seem very clear to me that your opinion is that we should go with TMart, but then in the next three paragraphs you tell us not to pick sides.

 

You also state some things about Lee making it appear that you are blaming all of the offensive issues on him last year, but then proceed to say that people get all over him even though he played hurt. If you would have posted the bottom couple of paragraphs it would have been okay, but the first five points don't mirror what you said in the last three paragraphs.

He's John Kerry

[zoogs]

1. Martinez would be the best running QB we've had since Jammal Lord.

 

He could also be the worst passing QB we've had since Lord. I don't get why we only focus on one aspect of a QB's skillset. If a RB has great hands, but can't run worth a lick, does he start at RB?

 

2. Jammal Lord nearly single-handedly beat Texas, even with a Craig Bohl defense.

 

Jammal Lord also got creamed by Texas, even with a Pelini defense.

 

3. Zac Lee couldn't get a TD on Texas even when Niles Paul gave him the ball at the 10 yard line. He only got a TD on Oklahoma when Prince gave him the ball at the 1 yard line.

 

4. Martinez will make mistakes. So will/did Lee. But Taylor can make plays with his legs that Lee simply can't make. The jury is still out on making plays with his arm.

 

If both players make mistakes, but Taylor is better at a secondary skill while worse at the primary skill of a QB, why does that justify his starting?

 

5. The offense last year was terrible. It was beyond terrible. It was one of the worst offenses I've ever seen. Anybody who isn't at least open to the idea of having a new QB is out of their mind.

 

I'd be open to the idea. It's Taylor Martinez being the challenger I'm real skeptical about. I mean, let's say we had a redshirt freshman Tyler Gabbert, or a healthy Kody Spano, or Pat Witt still with the program. Heck, even a rapidly developing Cody Green. I'd be open to all these ideas. But Lee came back from surgery to have a consistent and strong fall camp, and the guy who has been anything but consistent in fall camp, comes out of nowhere to jump from 3 to 1. I don't claim to know more than the coaches, but something does not add up here.

 

With all that said, it kind of seems like people are picking sides, and that's stupid too. It seems like some people here are actually hoping Martinez goes out and fails so their personal views are validated. Some people are ripping on Lee even though he played all of last year with a bum elbow. People are ripping on Green even though he was a true freshman. Stop picking sides. How do you not hope that Martinez is going to show up and be able to manage the game, and throw the ball well, on top of his crazy running abilities. How do you not hope that Lee hasn't come back from his surgery even stronger, a better leader, and a more able runner? How do you not hope that Cody's gotten a better grip on the offense?

 

I agree on the picking sides thing, but I want to point out that though I criticize Martinez and Green, I don't tear them down or rip them. I simply am of the opinion that they are not (or were not, in Green's case; I don't know about now) ready for prime time. I defend Lee because he's been at the butt of all the real ripping and criticism, while Martinez is being put up on a pedestal already at Lee's expense. Sure, I hope whoever starts at QB kills it this year. But I'm seeing a situation where a guy is inexplicably not factoring into a QB race at all, and some seem to be relishing this. I know that's an overreaction on my part, but this whole thing just has me throwing my arms up in the air in frustration.

 

We have had people close to the program coming here and saying that Lee is in a doghouse; that he's getting 'punished'. I don't know how this can be not alarming to people, because it means that we are not starting the guy that gives us the best chance to win; rather, we are starting the guy that's not named Zac Lee that gives us the best chance to win. Now, you guys may have your own different opinions of how good Zac Lee is, but I'm all about a competition to determine the winner. If Zac, Taylor, and Cody had an open competition and Taylor flat out won, I would be ALL for this! Don't get me wrong. But if Zac is in the doghouse, then he's not part of this competition. His skillset and ability to run the offense are taken out of the equation. That's what concerns me: that the best between Taylor and Cody may not be the best among Zac, Taylor, and Cody.

[BigWillie]

I would say this thread has hammered nearly every angle of this situation - eight times over.

 

Regardless of anyones personal thoughts, it will not change a single thing. Nearly everything, and everyone, says Taylor will be our QB later today.

 

Time to put all those personal thoughts aside to give him, and the rest of the team our full support.

[bshirt]

Lee isn't getting "slapped in the face". He's getting BEAT by better qb play by Green & Tmart (who are also far, far better athletes)this Fall camp.

 

But go ahead, keep dreaming up your excuses.....

 

Why don't you learn to read. Read the whole thread, then comment. Don't reply till you do that. Then your post would be a lot more educated than this.

 

The part about Lee getting slapped in the face has come from him not getting a chance to play fully healthy and prove what he can do in a game without Bo pulling the reins back. He played hurt all of last year and laid it all on the line for us, I do believe that he should be given an opportunity.

 

But why don't you read back through the thread. It may get you back up to speed.

 

I read the whole thread, nimrod, and I commented appropriately about just that.

 

Just because Lee played last year, Healthy or not healthy, does NOT mean he should get the starter job on a platter this year. Sorry EZ-E, your boy has to EARN it like everyone else.

[Hercules]

1. Martinez would be the best running QB we've had since Jammal Lord.

 

2. Jammal Lord nearly single-handedly beat Texas, even with a Craig Bohl defense.

 

3. Zac Lee couldn't get a TD on Texas even when Niles Paul gave him the ball at the 10 yard line. He only got a TD on Oklahoma when Prince gave him the ball at the 1 yard line.

 

4. Martinez will make mistakes. So will/did Lee. But Taylor can make plays with his legs that Lee simply can't make. The jury is still out on making plays with his arm.

 

5. The offense last year was terrible. It was beyond terrible. It was one of the worst offenses I've ever seen. Anybody who isn't at least open to the idea of having a new QB is out of their mind.

 

This whole argument is stupid, because no one participating has seen Zac Lee or Taylor Martinez or Cody Green all fall. It's been a competition that only the coaches have been able to evaluate. For anyone here to question their judgement without seeing a single practice is just ridiculous. Whoever's in the lead in the competition will get the start tomorrow, and that will be our first chance to evaluate anything on our own. And within the next few weeks, I'm sure it will all sort itself out, and by the end of the Washington game, it'll be pretty clear who we want at QB. Until then, just chill out.

 

With all that said, it kind of seems like people are picking sides, and that's stupid too. It seems like some people here are actually hoping Martinez goes out and fails so their personal views are validated. Some people are ripping on Lee even though he played all of last year with a bum elbow. People are ripping on Green even though he was a true freshman. Stop picking sides. How do you not hope that Martinez is going to show up and be able to manage the game, and throw the ball well, on top of his crazy running abilities. How do you not hope that Lee hasn't come back from his surgery even stronger, a better leader, and a more able runner? How do you not hope that Cody's gotten a better grip on the offense?

 

Pelini's going to start the guy who he thinks will help the team win. Bo Pelini knows more about football then anyone on this board. He knows more about what it takes to win football games than anyone on this board. And he hates losing way, way more than anyone on this board. So please, everybody just CHILL OUT.

 

 

In your five points above you make it seem very clear to me that your opinion is that we should go with TMart, but then in the next three paragraphs you tell us not to pick sides.

 

You also state some things about Lee making it appear that you are blaming all of the offensive issues on him last year, but then proceed to say that people get all over him even though he played hurt. If you would have posted the bottom couple of paragraphs it would have been okay, but the first five points don't mirror what you said in the last three paragraphs.

 

The first 5 points were more about defending Martinez against claims that Zac Lee is clearly the better choice at QB, which at this point don't really have any foundation. The arguments that Green or Martinez are clearly the right choice don't have any foundation either, but since I had just read about 5 posts ripping on Martinez, I decided to use that as my example.

 

All I said about Lee were, I think, pretty agreed-upon facts. The offense sucked. REALLY SUCKED. So it's ridiculous that anyone, at this point, before seeing anyone play, would be 100% behind Lee.

 

It's also ridiculous for anyone to be 100% behind Martinez. He hasn't played a down of college football yet.

 

It's also ridiculous for anyone to be 100% behind Green. He looked bad last year when we saw him.

 

And just as ridiculous for anyone to be 100% behind any of these guys, is for anyone to be 100% against any of these guys.

 

Everyone on here is just taking a side. They're going 100% behind whatever guy they chose, for whatever reason. This might be why my post is confusing to some of you. I'm not trying to take an absolute position. It's not "you're either with us or against us." My position is "Why don't you all shut up because we don't really know anything about any of these players anyways. Lee sucked last year but he was hurt. Green sucked last year, but he was a freshman. Taylor Martinez is really fast, but that's about all we know about him." My post is confusing because I'm not arguing about who should be the starter. I'm arguing about how stupid this entire argument is.

[zoogs]

Fair enough; Go Big Red y'all!

[Hercules]

1. Martinez would be the best running QB we've had since Jammal Lord.

 

He could also be the worst passing QB we've had since Lord. I don't get why we only focus on one aspect of a QB's skillset. If a RB has great hands, but can't run worth a lick, does he start at RB?

 

2. Jammal Lord nearly single-handedly beat Texas, even with a Craig Bohl defense.

 

Jammal Lord also got creamed by Texas, even with a Pelini defense.

 

3. Zac Lee couldn't get a TD on Texas even when Niles Paul gave him the ball at the 10 yard line. He only got a TD on Oklahoma when Prince gave him the ball at the 1 yard line.

 

4. Martinez will make mistakes. So will/did Lee. But Taylor can make plays with his legs that Lee simply can't make. The jury is still out on making plays with his arm.

 

If both players make mistakes, but Taylor is better at a secondary skill while worse at the primary skill of a QB, why does that justify his starting?

 

5. The offense last year was terrible. It was beyond terrible. It was one of the worst offenses I've ever seen. Anybody who isn't at least open to the idea of having a new QB is out of their mind.

 

I'd be open to the idea. It's Taylor Martinez being the challenger I'm real skeptical about. I mean, let's say we had a redshirt freshman Tyler Gabbert, or a healthy Kody Spano, or Pat Witt still with the program. Heck, even a rapidly developing Cody Green. I'd be open to all these ideas. But Lee came back from surgery to have a consistent and strong fall camp, and the guy who has been anything but consistent in fall camp, comes out of nowhere to jump from 3 to 1. I don't claim to know more than the coaches, but something does not add up here.

 

With all that said, it kind of seems like people are picking sides, and that's stupid too. It seems like some people here are actually hoping Martinez goes out and fails so their personal views are validated. Some people are ripping on Lee even though he played all of last year with a bum elbow. People are ripping on Green even though he was a true freshman. Stop picking sides. How do you not hope that Martinez is going to show up and be able to manage the game, and throw the ball well, on top of his crazy running abilities. How do you not hope that Lee hasn't come back from his surgery even stronger, a better leader, and a more able runner? How do you not hope that Cody's gotten a better grip on the offense?

 

I agree on the picking sides thing, but I want to point out that though I criticize Martinez and Green, I don't tear them down or rip them. I simply am of the opinion that they are not (or were not, in Green's case; I don't know about now) ready for prime time. I defend Lee because he's been at the butt of all the real ripping and criticism, while Martinez is being put up on a pedestal already at Lee's expense. Sure, I hope whoever starts at QB kills it this year. But I'm seeing a situation where a guy is inexplicably not factoring into a QB race at all, and some seem to be relishing this. I know that's an overreaction on my part, but this whole thing just has me throwing my arms up in the air in frustration.

 

We have had people close to the program coming here and saying that Lee is in a doghouse; that he's getting 'punished'. I don't know how this can be not alarming to people, because it means that we are not starting the guy that gives us the best chance to win; rather, we are starting the guy that's not named Zac Lee that gives us the best chance to win. Now, you guys may have your own different opinions of how good Zac Lee is, but I'm all about a competition to determine the winner. If Zac, Taylor, and Cody had an open competition and Taylor flat out won, I would be ALL for this! Don't get me wrong. But if Zac is in the doghouse, then he's not part of this competition. His skillset and ability to run the offense are taken out of the equation. That's what concerns me: that the best between Taylor and Cody may not be the best among Zac, Taylor, and Cody.

 

First of all, YOU JUST DID claim to know more than the coaches. You said, "But Lee came back from surgery to have a consistent and strong fall camp, and the guy who has become anything but consistent in fall camp..." Where is that coming from? You weren't at every practice, watching every drill live and then again on film. How do you know Lee had a consistent camp and Martinez didn't? How do you know it's not the other way around? Nobody truly knows anything except for the coaches and the players.

 

You assume the same thing in the last paragraph of your response, saying that the coaches haven't held a true competition, that Zac has had some sort of disadvantage by being in the "doghouse." I don't care what guys with any kind of ties close to the program have said here, nobody knows anything. If people were coming on here with that kind of information, why didn't they just leak every little detail about the QB race? Why are we still not really 100% sure who's starting? Furthermore, nobody really knows what the "doghouse" is. Philip Dillard was in the doghouse, and when he earned his way out of it, he was a better player for it.

 

Anyways, that's what bugs me about this whole discussion, is the idea that we really know anything about it, especially anything more than the coaches do. If you trust the coaching staff that's in place, this whole debate is pretty useless. The only reason this debate is interesting is if you don't trust the coaches to run the program the right way, and to make the right call.

[zoogs]

Herc, I don't claim to know more than the coaches. It's just what we've all heard. Coaches haven't come out and said Lee is struggling this camp; rather the opposite I think. You are assuming here that Lee is not starting because he is struggling and the coaches are seeing this.

 

I have to say that's a reasonable assumption. But I put forth why there may be reasons to doubt it. You're right. It's not my knowledge, and the coaches sure know a hell of a lot more about football than I do. Further, the practice reports could all be erroneous.

 

I don't care what guys with any kind of ties close to the program have said here, nobody knows anything. If people were coming on here with that kind of information, why didn't they just leak every little detail about the QB race? Why are we still not really 100% sure who's starting? Furthermore, nobody really knows what the "doghouse" is. Philip Dillard was in the doghouse, and when he earned his way out of it, he was a better player for it.

 

I think you could be a little off the mark here with 'nobody knows anything.' Well, I don't. But it doesn't mean that there aren't people who might. Heck if I know how they know, or if they know. It's a judgment call here. And knowing some details, does not mean knowing every little detail about the QB race - and knowing every detail, does not mean an obligation to share it (indeed, it'd be inappropriate to, probably).

 

As far as knowing 100% for sure who's starting, I think for a day or two it has been pretty certain. Not even based on "insider" claims, because every single sign is pointing in this direction. It'd be a shocker if it weren't.

 

Not to go down the Philip Dillard road again, but Willie did say if you didn't see in another thread, that Dillard did everything he could to earn his way out, but was kept in until our redshirt freshman linebackers (Comp and Fisher) struggled mightily. Absolutely, he was a better player for it; but he was also overweight before being in the doghouse, something he had to fix. Zac's been a tough kid for us, so if he's in the doghouse because Bo doesn't think he's tough...well, I don't know. Maybe that's too big an if to talk about.

 

If you trust the coaching staff that's in place, this whole debate is pretty useless. The only reason this debate is interesting is if you don't trust the coaches to run the program the right way, and to make the right call.

 

The implication here is that as fans, we should.

 

I do by and large, but I don't like that implication necessarily. There are some things you decide over time to be critical of coaching staffs over. For example, trusting Callahan to come back from a halftime deficit. Is trusting the current staff to not hold silly grudges going to be added to that list? Well, I wouldn't say that yet, but I would say that it's not unfair to question it.

 

But we are on the eve of the season, and I just want to root for the Huskers. So I guess we can put this discussion off for until we start doing less well - since until then, I doubt I'd care too much personally about anything else. Basically, it is what it is, and let's just enjoy the game tonight.

[bugeater17]

anyone that lives outside of nebraska, such as my self, continually heard last season about how bad zac lee is non stop... one of my favorite quotes is something along the lines of if we could get bad qb play instead of horrendous we would have been a bcs bowl team last year.

 

my point is zac lee had his shot... blame it on the injury but that is just taking the easy road.. an injured elbow still doesn't make up for bad reads and running with his head down (a point i never noticed but many of my sooner buddies made).

 

i'm all for playing our best players but we might as well figure out what we have in the stable before we try and rely on a horse that just doesn't have it.

[Hunter94]

thankfully, it is game day.......that is all i got to say about this!

[Blaze1up]

Love the sig EZ-E one of my favorites.

[huKSer]

Who starts among Martinez, Green and Lee?

 

Wouldn't it be crazy if all three started in a crazy souped up Wildcat?

 

Then everyone would be right.

[hoyamannn]

If the reasons that I heard for Lee being in the doghouse are true, then I think I've lost a lot of respect for Pelini. But, I will always support this program even if I don't agree with everything that the head coach is doing.

 

There's a LOT more to the story than Lee being in the doghouse and Pelini having a grudge, but it's stuff that needs to stay within the program. The main factor in TM starting is that he BEAT OUT Lee on the field. Even though he's prone to making a few more mistakes, he has something Lee doesn't have with his ability to make something happen if the play breaks down. He's also not going to look for the ground when he sees contact coming.

 

Pelini and his staff have expectations so much greater than fans, and bottom line is that they're going to do whatever they can to win games. MOST of them feel that Martinez starting gives the team the best chance to win.

[EZ-E]

The buzz came from within the program from players (see PJ above) talking about their experiences at practice. It did not come from internet junkies like ourselves. He did give himself that "T-Magic" nickname, but other than that I don't think it is fair of us to assume that he is cocky. He has not been in front of the media yet.

 

If he passing ability is what Niles said it was above then I think we have a football player here fellas.

 

Eh. If that's the case, why is Green second?

 

That has got to be the fishiest part of this deal to me.

 

It's one thing if Taylor truly has unseated last year's incumbent starter who improved. It's another thing when it looks like the incumbent just fell off the map in coaches' eyes. It's going to be really interesting to see if Green does indeed get the 2nd quarter as some have said. To me, that is a rather unfortunate indictment on Taylor and it is an absolute slap in the face to Lee. Some may think he deserves it...but we'll agree to disagree on that. A much more preferable situation would be if coaches got behind Taylor and started him the whole game.

 

 

I fully agree with you here. I believe that Lee is getting slapped in the face by the coaches which is sad imo. He led this team to 10 wins last year and had a hell of a great bowl game. If Tmarts throwing skills have improved beyond lee's then i can see why they want him to start. but before one snap has taken place this fall live Lee has lost his position and it makes absolutely no sense to me.

 

Go back and watch film from last season and count how many times he overthrew, underthrew, and just flat out missed the receiver. I dont care if he was injured. The man couldn't hit the broad side of a barn with a scoop shovel. He DID NOT lead the team last year to 10 wins. He was lucky we had the best defense in all of football or we would have been lucky to make it to .500. All of the people who have been calling for Lee to be the starter is just mind blowing to me. The guy is not a good football player, imo. I don't care how good he knows the offense, if he cant make the plays then he should be wearing the headset on the sidelines. If he does get the start I hope he proves me wrong. However, what is the point in having him number 2? Get the younger player in Green in there at number 2 so he gets more reps and can improve. Lee is gone after this year, no point for him to get much action at all if he isn't gonna be THE GUY. Lets go T-Magic!!!

 

I agree that Lee is getting slapped in the face. Wish I knew every knitty gritty detail to this. Does not make sense, I agree with you Zoogies.

 

This is the most ignorant part of the post above.

 

Go back and watch film from last season and count how many times he overthrew, underthrew, and just flat out missed the receiver. I dont care if he was injured. The man couldn't hit the broad side of a barn with a scoop shovel.

 

We all know that he could not throw the ball last year. That is why Bo pulled the reins back. You saying that you don't care that he was injured is the most assinine and ignorant statement I have read on this board in awhile. That is like saying Roy Helu didn't have as many yards as I wanted him to get when we all know that he was not near 100% after the Mizzou game. Educate yourself on Zac Lee's situation and then come back here.

 

I do believe that Martinez and Green will be better than Zac Lee is in their respective careers. What I also believe is that Zac Lee deserves his chance to lead this offense FULLY HEALTHY and without Bo pulling the reins back. He played hurt and laid it all on the line for us last year.

 

Im fully educated on Zac Lees situation, thank you very much. I saw what a fully healthy Zac Lee was capable of in the first half of the season last year and that is not the qb I want on the field. I didn't want it last year and I don't want it now. Don't try to tell me that he racked up all kinds of yards and we smoked those cream puffs either. He was making all kinds of terrible throws then and it carried over the rest of the year, injury or no injury. We started playing against real defenses and our offense tanked. No Lee For Me. Zac Lee had his chance and now it is time to move on. If the coaches can't see that (Watson) I will be very disappointed.

 

You saw a healthy Zac Lee in the first two games. Not the first half of the season. You proved yourself wrong in your opening two sentences.