The 'Players or Coaches or Both?' Thread

[skersfan]

Tom is responsible for him, or at least in some eyes.. I think he will offer to help if asked, but Bo is a very stubborn person. A lot of knowledge at his disposal, hopefully he will take advantage of it.

 

He needs to as he is nearing the end of the honeymoon.

[Paxo]

2008 - 9-4

2009 - 10-4

2010 - 10-4

2011 - currently 8-3 with 2 games left.

 

 

am i the only one that has seen this trend? 10 wins is great, but 4 losses a year is unacceptable in my opinion. Especially the way we are losing games. I could be overly critical but a decade of mediocrity is starting to get tiresome.

 

Beat Iowa! GBR!

 

You're not the only one. I'm getting sick of just competing for division titles.

[knapplc]

Tom is responsible for him, or at least in some eyes.. I think he will offer to help if asked, but Bo is a very stubborn person. A lot of knowledge at his disposal, hopefully he will take advantage of it.

 

He needs to as he is nearing the end of the honeymoon.

 

I'd say the honeymoon ended for certain after the Washington loss in the Holiday Bowl. The way last season ended was horrific.

[gobiggergoredder]

Bo has never been able to wrap his hands around turnovers and penalties at the worst possible time. I don't see how this couldn't be a part of preparation.

[grandpasknee]

Hard to tell. Coaches do what they can with the talent they get. Bo has been consistent with his record, and tends to have a few games a year when the players just don't compete like they do the rest of the year. This isn't a rare thing for Bo or any other coach; you rarely see a football team that doesn't get tripped up once in an entire season, and those are usually done by outstanding top-5 coaches.

 

Is Bo a top 5 coach? Not right now, but he's keeping Nebraska competitive and learning, getting personnel around him he likes while also recruiting to try and handle a brand new conference. Okie State just lost to Iowa State yesterday... does that make their coach suck? No, it just means they had a bad week, and it happens.

 

I think you can blame either one and be correct, but you're talking about a grown man in his 40's trying to motivate and coach a bunch of college kids that want to drink and party just as much as they want to play football probably. Getting 19-23 year old students to concentrate for an entire year is clearly tough, otherwise you'd see every football team with 9 win seasons.

 

Bo's a young coach in the grand scheme of thing... coaches that consistently succeed tend to have decades of experience and be in their 50's or 60's. I can't get mad at college kids that have an off week, though I can get mad if a coach calls a bad game, or leaves his players unprepared too many times a season. Bo's doing fine, so are the players. This is an off season, and transitional season both with the offense and with Bo changing the defensive scheme to play against Big 10 teams.

 

You can be disappointed in the season, even pissed off, but don't go calling for the heads of staff when you're still getting 9 and 10 win seasons.

 

Great post, thanks for your input. I agree with most of what you've said. I'm old enough (barely) to remember early Devaney years when a winning season was a great thing, so I'm never about firing a winning coach. Just curious.

[Comish]

Big plays today:

 

1 - Dennard gets bumped and they complete a pass to the two on 3rd & 8.

2 - Bell fumbles opening kick of second half.

3 - Thorell PI gives a new set of downs after we would have forced a FG

4 - Fumbled punt snap leads to blocked punt

5 - Roughing the punter

6 - Two DBs can't play the ball in the air and give up a TD

7 - Marlowe fumbles kickoff

8 - Martinez fumbles after we're forced to pass

 

Play 1 led to a TD, 2 & 3 combined to give up a TD, 4 led to a TD, 5 & 6 combined to lead to a TD, and 8 led to a TD. That's 35 of thier 45 points directly from player screwups.

 

I'm not saying there isn't plenty more blame to go around but please explain to me exactly what the coaching staff could have done differently to prevent any of those eight plays. The only thing you could say was possibly not call the punt block but if it works, it's a great call. If it's only running into the kicker or he misses him completly, nobody remembers it. Tough call but it was worth the gamble at that point. What other coaching move would have changed any of those plays?

 

Good sober analysis....................................

 

However, I disagree with the punt block call....................we were going to get possession across midfield with momentum.............................too high of risk/reward for the few times a block is successful .........

 

The only other HUGE coaching gaffe I would point out is being totally unprepared for the fake field goal...............It was such an obvious call to fake it ............(especially with out offense struggling if we had to take over and go 95 yards.........)

[JTrain]

2008 - 9-4

2009 - 10-4

2010 - 10-4

2011 - currently 8-3 with 2 games left.

 

 

am i the only one that has seen this trend? 10 wins is great, but 4 losses a year is unacceptable in my opinion. Especially the way we are losing games. I could be overly critical but a decade of mediocrity is starting to get tiresome.

 

Beat Iowa! GBR!

 

You're not the only one. I'm getting sick of just competing for division titles.

 

We're going to finish 2 or 3 full games behind in a division that was pretty much average this year.

[It'sNotAFakeID]

Bo has never been able to wrap his hands around turnovers and penalties at the worst possible time. I don't see how this couldn't be a part of preparation.

 

Penalties are determined at the discretion of the referees and that discretion changes as the referees change. What one sees as DPI another sees as a bang bang play. When you add that amount of difference into the equation it's hard to prepare to not penalize. You can play all the sound defense that you want, but if you get called for a penalty, sound defense doesn't make a damn bit of difference.

 

I want to make this clear: in no way am I blaming refs for our poor performance. Just maybe adding a different idea.

[lo country]

Take football out of it. If a corporate entity fails to perform, is the CEO on the line or worker on the line that gets held accountable? In the military, if the company fails to produce, who is held accountable? The PFC's, CPL's? No the CO, XO and senior NCO's.

 

It is the inability of this staff to develop talent. For example. This is year 4 under Bo. How many returning players did we have return this year at the skilled positions?

 

QB-1

RB-1

WR-1

PK/PNT-0

TE-1.5

KO Return-0

Cntr-1 (no back up time this yr either

CB-1

Safety-2 (former Blackshirt MIA)

 

Gilleyen moved to RB and lost, SJB 1 game and then gone MIA, Mitchell, Osborne, Cooper etc on D.

 

Prior to the season all the talk about depth on the line and nada.

 

An O line that now has 3 coaches.

 

Inability to translate on the field is a direct result of poor coaching, poor recruitment or playing the wrong kids. All of this is on the coaches. If it was year 1 with a new system/staff etc....I would assume the kids would make mistakes, but not year 4, game 11.

 

I even look at the hiring of Raymond as an issue. Coached CB's at Utah State last year. Look at their pass D rating. IIRC, 111th. That was the best DB coach we could find? Mike Minter chilling in Charlotte, sons in Lincoln. Ralph Brown, Booker.....Just naming Huskers to troll! I really think we could have found a guy with a proven track record of success. Couple this with the comments from Evans and Dennard pre=season and I have concerns. Comments from Carl about wanting a more physical DB play. The fact Denard was beat like a drum today.

 

Beck-RB coach who developed no talent or depth at the RB position is given the keys to the car. Again, maybe he wil be great, but there wasn't a more qualified person around. Hell game 11 and besides inconsistency, I have no idea what type of O we run. None.

 

Our D line has never played well against the run save SUH. Year 4 we should be able to adjsut to a team that simply lines up and punches us in the mouth or a mobile QB.

 

No, to quote the Who, the kids alright. This is the staff.

 

To add the whole new conference, new teams, schemes excuses.........Getting paid several million for a job should enable you to avoid 2 blow out losses on national tv. Prior to the season, I predicted the whole new OC, new scheme, new position coaches excuses, but never the new teams/venues.

 

I don't think Bo should be fired, just some serious discussions with staff/direction/recruiting etc......The above excuses, partially valid, will buy another year or 2 minimum.

 

Bo also has to let the younger kids get reps or we will lose recruits and not have quality depth. His dog house BS is just that. Unsure what the kids have done, but how about treat your staff the same ie Barney your O line sucked today. Next week, ride the pine Garison has this. Beck, your play calling is shi$. Ganz, you take it next week. The double sided discipline would wear on me.

[JTrain]

Big plays today:

 

1 - Dennard gets bumped and they complete a pass to the two on 3rd & 8.

2 - Bell fumbles opening kick of second half.

3 - Thorell PI gives a new set of downs after we would have forced a FG

4 - Fumbled punt snap leads to blocked punt

5 - Roughing the punter

6 - Two DBs can't play the ball in the air and give up a TD

7 - Marlowe fumbles kickoff

8 - Martinez fumbles after we're forced to pass

 

Play 1 led to a TD, 2 & 3 combined to give up a TD, 4 led to a TD, 5 & 6 combined to lead to a TD, and 8 led to a TD. That's 35 of thier 45 points directly from player screwups.

 

I'm not saying there isn't plenty more blame to go around but please explain to me exactly what the coaching staff could have done differently to prevent any of those eight plays. The only thing you could say was possibly not call the punt block but if it works, it's a great call. If it's only running into the kicker or he misses him completly, nobody remembers it. Tough call but it was worth the gamble at that point. What other coaching move would have changed any of those plays?

 

The game was essentially over the last two plays listed here, and pretty close to over on play #6. Play #2, you don't put a freshman with that body type in as a KR. You don't need a huge game-changing fumble to figure that out.

 

Play #5 was just a terrible call. We have had no success or even much practice blocking punts. We had all the momentum and were going to get good field position down only two scores. Risk-reward was just way too high to go after that. If we were a VTech type team that blocked 5-6 punts a season, it would make more sense.

 

But a handful of plays don't lose you a game 45-17. Yeah the game could have been different if the OPI is called on the long pass or if Bell doesn't fumble, but that's what all bad teams always say. "If only these 4-5 plays went a little differently, we would've been close."

 

Too many penalties. O-line not coming together by mid-November. Offensive playcalling unsure of itself and incapable of sustaining drives (Michigan's weakness is rushing defense...). Poor discipline in multiple areas. These are coaching issues.

[grandpasknee]

Take football out of it. If a corporate entity fails to perform, is the CEO on the line or worker on the line that gets held accountable? In the military, if the company fails to produce, who is held accountable? The PFC's, CPL's? No the CO, XO and senior NCO's.

 

It is the inability of this staff to develop talent. For example. This is year 4 under Bo. How many returning players did we have return this year at the skilled positions?

 

QB-1

RB-1

WR-1

PK/PNT-0

TE-1.5

KO Return-0

Cntr-1 (no back up time this yr either

CB-1

Safety-2 (former Blackshirt MIA)

 

Gilleyen moved to RB and lost, SJB 1 game and then gone MIA, Mitchell, Osborne, Cooper etc on D.

 

Prior to the season all the talk about depth on the line and nada.

 

An O line that now has 3 coaches.

 

Inability to translate on the field is a direct result of poor coaching, poor recruitment or playing the wrong kids. All of this is on the coaches. If it was year 1 with a new system/staff etc....I would assume the kids would make mistakes, but not year 4, game 11.

 

I even look at the hiring of Raymond as an issue. Coached CB's at Utah State last year. Look at their pass D rating. IIRC, 111th. That was the best DB coach we could find? Mike Minter chilling in Charlotte, sons in Lincoln. Ralph Brown, Booker.....Just naming Huskers to troll! I really think we could have found a guy with a proven track record of success. Couple this with the comments from Evans and Dennard pre=season and I have concerns. Comments from Carl about wanting a more physical DB play. The fact Denard was beat like a drum today.

 

Beck-RB coach who developed no talent or depth at the RB position is given the keys to the car. Again, maybe he wil be great, but there wasn't a more qualified person around. Hell game 11 and besides inconsistency, I have no idea what type of O we run. None.

 

Our D line has never played well against the run save SUH. Year 4 we should be able to adjsut to a team that simply lines up and punches us in the mouth or a mobile QB.

 

No, to quote the Who, the kids alright. This is the staff.

 

That is the kind of commentary I wanted. Hard to argue with your points.

[irafreak]

I hate...........

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thread titles like this.

Then stop opening them.

[chamrocck]

I have been a supporter of Bo but after today and what we have seen this season, I am now quietly working behind the scenes to see if anyone prominent can be available for 2013 (I would grab Gary Patterson). I have Bo here at least another year for the 2012 season and maybe he can turn it around. If so great, I will gladly eat crow. I think Bo's strength can be a tough, run through walls type attitude for this team...but that is not what we have here. Today I saw an apprehensive, oh s#!@ type team that were defeated when things started to unravel, no fight really left in them. So if this is where we are next year at this time, then we have to be ready to pull the trigger on a better hire. Don't suffer in mediocrity for 3 or 4 more years.

 

My main issues have to do with 1) Inconsistency of the team, not able to play consistently at high level and 2) Lack of adjustments when it is so apparent what we need to do and how other teams expose us.

 

The team is making the same mistakes each week...key dropped passes, poor execution on the option, poor ball security, poor D-Line play, poor O-Line play, poor tackling. It is so inconsistent...yes great option play on the Abdullah TD and some great tackling out there by David are some bright spots...but the rest is all a mush of mediocrity and poor play.

 

Inability to adjust and get better throughout the season. The defense has had the same issues since the start of the year. A slow pu&&y-footing D-Line that brings no pressure. I told you if Robinson sits back there and has time he will make throws and his WR's will come down with the ball. Baker had a good play early in the game and then our D-Line was a non-factor. Why we are still seeing certain personnel on defense is mind-boggling since these were obvious weak links early in the year. To me this is the most glaring strike against Bo...his calling card as a coach, a strong defense that attacks and causes turnovers, has played so poorly. The argument is easy to make...why do I need to keep Bo if this is the type of defense he is bringing us? Nebraska should be built on defense and this year it has suffered. Without David and Dennard we would really be quite bad. For next year, I like how Stafford and Compton seem to be getting better but then who knows with the rest of this defense as suspect as it has been. If we don't get better or find new personnel we are in trouble. So, IMO Bo has to show this next year.

 

The offense...also inconsistent and somewhat mind boggling. We show some bright spots on the play calls on Kinnie pass TD and Abdullah option TD...but have not been able to develop this consistently on offense. Inability to develop the young RB's and add speed to our offense has also been glaringly bad. The consistency of the O-Line getting mauled and having TMart bottled up on every series...this is what our offensive identity is! (Ok, too easy of a joke ). It is mind numbing we haven't improved and we continue to see lack of protection on the QB.

 

It is what is...we are not a top 15 team...we can play with 15-25 and that's it. I want to see us consistently play in the top 10. If I can get Gary Patterson for 2013 and we have another season like this one (and it's not so much the wins and losses as it is the inconsistent play), then I pull the trigger.

[Incandenza]

seriously?

 

its on the entire program....

 

Starting at the very top.

[Thabudguy]

Barney Cotton has to get some blame. The o-line was terrible again. But I was say both was to blame.