The Ongoing State of Ferguson/Systemic Racial Prejudice in the USA

[JJ Husker]

 

 

Where did I say that? I said the people need to be caught and punished.

But you also insinuated that they had it coming because they are racist. Thought the pity train comment maybe went a bit too far. The police officers who were shot had spouses, children, friends, and to my knowledge, it has not been proven those specific officers were racists. I understand that PD has issues. I'm not so sure the individual harmed officers do.

I said it's bad what happened. I said the people who did it needed punished. They didn't deserve it any more than a black guy ending up shot from simply being black and in the wrong place at the wrong time.

The pity train comment stands with the media. When I heard their comments they were making it out to sound like the police had nothing to do with causing the problems.

That's BS.

Ok. That makes sense and doesn't seem extreme. I didn't get that out of the first post you made but, now that you've explained it......

[JJ Husker]

 

 

The most insane thing I've seen with all of this is that Ferguson has 21,000 residents.

 

 

There are 16,000 warrants out for arrests. Almost every single person in that city is supposedly a wanted criminal by the police department.

 

Where are you seeing this? Something doesn't sound even close to right here.

 

Check the links I provided.

 

 

 

In the city of Ferguson, nearly everyone is a wanted criminal.

 

That may seem like hyperbole, but it is a literal fact. In Ferguson -- a city with a population of 21,000 -- 16,000 people have outstanding arrest warrants, meaning that they are currently actively wanted by the police. In other words, if you were to take four people at random, the Ferguson police would consider three of them fugitives.

 

 

It turns out that nearly everyone in the city is wanted for something. Even internal police department communications found the number of arrest warrants to be "staggering". By December of 2014, "over 16,000 people had outstanding arrest warrants that had been issued by the court." The report makes clear that this refers to individual people, rather than cases (i.e. people with many cases are not being counted multiple times). However, if we do look at the number of cases, the portrait is even starker. In 2013, 32,975 offenses had associated warrants, so that there were 1.5 offenses for every city resident.

 

That means that the city of Ferguson quite literally has more crimes than people.

 

To give some context as to how truly extreme this is, a comparison may be useful. In 2014, the Boston Municipal Court System, for a city of 645,000 people, issued about 2,300 criminal warrants. The Ferguson Municipal Court issued 9,000, for a population 1/30th the size of Boston's.

 

Color me unimpressed with the huff post article. They took a couple statistics and wrote a narrative that fit their agenda. 16,000 is a lot and sounds crazy but there are many options that could easily explain it. I bet the riots generated hundreds to thousands of new warrants. I bet the crime in that area is high to begin with. I question the validity of the "facts" offered in the huff post article. But, I also would assume that there are deep racially motivated problems that contribute to extremely high warrant numbers. So, I don't think it's all BS but, some of it? Yeah, I'm calling BS.

[Landlord]

 

Color me unimpressed with the huff post article. They took a couple statistics and wrote a narrative that fit their agenda. 16,000 is a lot and sounds crazy but there are many options that could easily explain it. I bet the riots generated hundreds to thousands of new warrants. I bet the crime in that area is high to begin with. I question the validity of the "facts" offered in the huff post article. But, I also would assume that there are deep racially motivated problems that contribute to extremely high warrant numbers. So, I don't think it's all BS but, some of it? Yeah, I'm calling BS.

 

 

 

 

There's certainly some extenuating circumstances that would account for a discrepancy, but given all of the other things that have come to light in the DOJ report, the conclusion is still the same that the systems around that place are beyond f'd up. No amount of journalistic slant or higher crime rate or anything can account for a 75% population rate with arrest warrants, when the national average is like .03% or something like that.

[BIGREDIOWAN]

And the DOJ trying to fry an innocent officer before a shred of evidence was presented to the grand jury acting like they knew things for a fact is f'd up as well. Our "leaders" words and actions have caused a lot of problems for police across the country that isn't the police's fault. These riots started because of lies and assumptions before the facts came out in the case. So I call B.S. on all those riots and protests if they're basing themselves off of that incident. Acting like there are a large part of bad police officers out there is laughable at best because there isn't. I don't even know why this discussion really needs to continue. It's been rehashed over and over and over again. It's like a clingy ex-girlfriend that just won't go the hell away.

[strigori]

You should really read the findings from that report. What was going on there is really bad. Just about anything would have worked as a flashpoint.

[admo]

 

 

The most insane thing I've seen with all of this is that Ferguson has 21,000 residents.

 

 

There are 16,000 warrants out for arrests. Almost every single person in that city is supposedly a wanted criminal by the police department.

Where are you seeing this? Something doesn't sound even close to right here.

 

 

 

Check the links I provided.

 

 

 

 

 

In the city of Ferguson, nearly everyone is a wanted criminal.

That may seem like hyperbole, but it is a literal fact. In Ferguson -- a city with a population of 21,000 -- 16,000 people have outstanding arrest warrants, meaning that they are currently actively wanted by the police. In other words, if you were to take four people at random, the Ferguson police would consider three of them fugitives.

It turns out that nearly everyone in the city is wanted for something. Even internal police department communications found the number of arrest warrants to be "staggering". By December of 2014, "over 16,000 people had outstanding arrest warrants that had been issued by the court." The report makes clear that this refers to individual people, rather than cases (i.e. people with many cases are not being counted multiple times). However, if we do look at the number of cases, the portrait is even starker. In 2013, 32,975 offenses had associated warrants, so that there were 1.5 offenses for every city resident.

That means that the city of Ferguson quite literally has more crimes than people.

To give some context as to how truly extreme this is, a comparison may be useful. In 2014, the Boston Municipal Court System, for a city of 645,000 people, issued about 2,300 criminal warrants. The Ferguson Municipal Court issued 9,000, for a population 1/30th the size of Boston's.

 

Something there doesn't sound right. Thought you could get a warrant for unpaid traffic tickets, but a fugitive warrant meant you fled the state and they want to bring you back.

[BIGREDIOWAN]

You should really read the findings from that report. What was going on there is really bad. Just about anything would have worked as a flashpoint.

No, I won't, I stand by what I said. I never said racism may not be going on there. I said if these riots and protests are based on that ONE incident, they're based on false information. And that's the reason they initially started, then it comes out later that Officer Wilson acted appropriately. I've never heard an apology from Eric Holder, POTUS, or Al Sharpton for their lies. Must be rough to be a officer who has to take on the federal government for his actions when he acted appropriately. That man went through hell all for doing what he was trained to do because of Eric Garner's actions. Now I get people making Ferguson comments on a daily basis which is B.S. but because I'm a cop, I must be dirty and racist in their minds.

[BIGREDIOWAN]

You'll also have to forgive me some. There are enough worries in this job without knee jerk reactions from the federal government and the national media. We have rights as well and I'll never understand why the POTUS said anything about this in the first place. It's a local law enforcement matter that's under investigation, he should've shut up until the facts came out.

[Landlord]

 

You should really read the findings from that report. What was going on there is really bad. Just about anything would have worked as a flashpoint.

No, I won't, I stand by what I said. I never said racism may not be going on there. I said if these riots and protests are based on that ONE incident, they're based on false information. And that's the reason they initially started, then it comes out later that Officer Wilson acted appropriately. I've never heard an apology from Eric Holder, POTUS, or Al Sharpton for their lies. Must be rough to be a officer who has to take on the federal government for his actions when he acted appropriately. That man went through hell all for doing what he was trained to do because of Eric Garner's actions. Now I get people making Ferguson comments on a daily basis which is B.S. but because I'm a cop, I must be dirty and racist in their minds.

 

 

 

Eric Garner is from New York - you're thinking of Michael Brown, but since you don't really care about the reality of the situation, by your own words (p.s. what "lies" has the President spoken about this?) I can understand how you would get that botched up. Or maybe you're talking about the right thing but I'm having a hard time tracking through your vague and mysterious allegations.

 

The protesting started because of what Michael Brown's death represented to the people; systemic injustice. It so happens that the people were wrong and that Darren Wilson was innocent, but it also so happens that they were right, and their police department and local government were beyond f'd up.

 

It was never just about one person or one incident.

[BIGREDIOWAN]

Excuse me for getting them mixed up. Your agenda has been clear for sometime dude, so me looking up all the information and putting it out there is a waste of my time for an activist like yourself. Point is, while making it very vague, Eric Holder and the POTUS put Darren Wilson out there as being wrong with what he did and condemning his actions before knowing any of the facts. Those are dangerous grounds for them to be walking on and they threw police officers under the bus. But I don't expect you to understand that. I'm not arguing with you again, you won't get it, you're trying to put words in my mouth is all, never said I didn't care did I?

[NUance]

Michael Brown was a thug. He had it comin.

 

 

There. I said it.

[strigori]

 

You should really read the findings from that report. What was going on there is really bad. Just about anything would have worked as a flashpoint.

No, I won't, I stand by what I said. I never said racism may not be going on there. I said if these riots and protests are based on that ONE incident, they're based on false information. And that's the reason they initially started, then it comes out later that Officer Wilson acted appropriately. I've never heard an apology from Eric Holder, POTUS, or Al Sharpton for their lies. Must be rough to be a officer who has to take on the federal government for his actions when he acted appropriately. That man went through hell all for doing what he was trained to do because of Eric Garner's actions. Now I get people making Ferguson comments on a daily basis which is B.S. but because I'm a cop, I must be dirty and racist in their minds.

 

Lets not even investigate police actions then huh? Lets not even ask a question of why an unarmed man was shot. Or the entire disaster that followed because the police in that town treated everyone with an appalling level of arrogance and disdain for the public. Lets not have a problem with police abusing power, and tear gassing journalists. Because THAT is what this was about. The DoJ did not "throw him under a bus" as they didn't press any charges. They ran an investigation. Hell, in Nebraska there is an automatic Grand Jury called for any officer involved death. An outside body NEEDED to run the investigation as there is absolutely no trust of the system in that town.

 

And lets be honest here. The black community has a damned good pile of evidence and experience that they are unlikely to be treated the same by the police and justice system in general. Knowledge is power. Read the findings, its not some witch hunt. And turning a blind eye to what happened there is a continuing problem in this country. A large, and growing, amount of the citizens feel that this country has become little more than a police state. The police that are supposed to be there to "protect and serve" do not tend to come across like that anymore. There is a prevailing sentiment that the police have more interest in generating income for the municipality than doing the job of true public safety. I'm sorry if that offends you, but its the reality of things right now.

[BigRedBuster]

 

 

 

I think what happened in Ferguson is probably pretty common, particularly in smaller towns. The first issue is why were the systemic problems not brought out earlier. These smaller towns (21,000 in Ferguson's case) even having SWAT teams and armored vehicles is Orwellian. These small towns have little to no oversight, can run the town like the leader's own little fiefdom. Larger communities will get more oversight from the various news media and national organizations like the ACLU. Small towns have a much easier time silencing critics than large cities do.

BS. On the "particularly in small towns comment"

Why would you call BS? Unchecked power has a tendency to corrupt. If the system in a large city was operating the same way Ferguson's was, there would be all sorts of media investigations. And in all likelihood there would have been law suits years ago. But who watches little towns?

Your thought that racism in police forces us more s problem in small towns compared to big cities is laughable at best. I can't imagine what evidence you have of this other than maybe some bias thinking small towns are nothing more than backwards hick places.

 

In the last 25 years, how many of the bad issues with police against minorities have been in small towns? We have Rodney King, Michael Brown, the guy in NYC recently, Madison Wisconsin.....etc.

 

Where are all the race problems with police in small towns in the news?

 

The fact is, in small towns the police forces are closer to the people. They are more likely to know them and their families.

 

A major problem in ferguson is that most of the police force did not live in ferguson. That is a problem that is more likely around a larger city.

[BIGREDIOWAN]

 

 

 

 

You should really read the findings from that report. What was going on there is really bad. Just about anything would have worked as a flashpoint.

No, I won't, I stand by what I said. I never said racism may not be going on there. I said if these riots and protests are based on that ONE incident, they're based on false information. And that's the reason they initially started, then it comes out later that Officer Wilson acted appropriately. I've never heard an apology from Eric Holder, POTUS, or Al Sharpton for their lies. Must be rough to be a officer who has to take on the federal government for his actions when he acted appropriately. That man went through hell all for doing what he was trained to do because of Eric Garner's actions. Now I get people making Ferguson comments on a daily basis which is B.S. but because I'm a cop, I must be dirty and racist in their minds.

Lets not even investigate police actions then huh? Lets not even ask a question of why an unarmed man was shot. Or the entire disaster that followed because the police in that town treated everyone with an appalling level of arrogance and disdain for the public. Lets not have a problem with police abusing power, and tear gassing journalists. Because THAT is what this was about. The DoJ did not "throw him under a bus" as they didn't press any charges. They ran an investigation. Hell, in Nebraska there is an automatic Grand Jury called for any officer involved death. An outside body NEEDED to run the investigation as there is absolutely no trust of the system in that town.

 

And lets be honest here. The black community has a damned good pile of evidence and experience that they are unlikely to be treated the same by the police and justice system in general. Knowledge is power. Read the findings, its not some witch hunt. And turning a blind eye to what happened there is a continuing problem in this country. A large, and growing, amount of the citizens feel that this country has become little more than a police state. The police that are supposed to be there to "protect and serve" do not tend to come across like that anymore. There is a prevailing sentiment that the police have more interest in generating income for the municipality than doing the job of true public safety. I'm sorry if that offends you, but its the reality of things right now.

Police have had to adapt to the public they serve, this isn't Mayberry anymore if you haven't noticed. The police haven't changed that, the public has with their actions as well, so you come across blaming the police for those problems in my opinion. Which is laughable........I also never said any of those things you're implying, another person trying to put words in someone's mouth to fit their argument. We don't write tickets to generate revenue, that's a BS excuse used by people to bitch and complain about the police. I know of ZERO officers that would ever do such a thing, it's unethical and not our purpose.

[ZRod]

Read the findings BRI, or at least a couple articles on them. It's outrageous. It might not be a problem in your town, it might not be a problem in most towns, but it was a problem in this town and is a problem in other towns.