The Repub Debate

[teachercd]

 

Trump got "dominated" in the minds of people that hate him...that is it. All that was last night was finally two other dudes standing up for themselves...like when your little brother finally fights back.

 

Cruz wishes he was out because he wants to be a supreme court justice...

Just like Trump and Christie had an alliance before New Hampshire...I think Cruz and Rubio are forming one, and if Cruz does poorly in the SEC states, even if he eeks out a win in Texas, I think he will bow out as he would rather have Rubio win than Trump.

 

I think you have a point...but I still think Cruz wants to be a supreme court justice

[HuskerShark]

 

--SNIP--

I think everybody gets the impression when he says he's going to make Mexico pay for it that he is going to build it and send a bill to the president of Mexico. However, when asked about it, he brought up (iirc) a $58 billion trade deficit each year with Mexico. So what I get out of it is that he will be very stubborn with Mexico and rectify the trade deals we're making in order to pay for it, hence "Mexico paying for it."

--SNIP--

 

I know we're in the Repub thread, but even in here, this wall nonsense is just that... nonsense.

 

Here are a few articles you should look over regarding the viability of such a wall:

 

A description of Trump's wall from an engineer with good desriptions

 

Here's why Trump doesn't fundamentally understand the implications or expedience of his immigration policy

 

Trump's flawed view on economics as a whole

 

The last two are particularly in step with my own personal thinking. I'm by no means an economist, but even I can tell when Trump talks about "losing to China, losing to Mexico, etc.," he's just totally wrong about the way trade with those country's work.

I asked another person here and got no response. Tell me how Trump gets this wall built? Slapping an embargo on Mexico or imposing massive tariffs on them is going to be very harmful to OUR economy, despite the trade deficit he cites with them. Furthermore, there's no legitimate way to force Mexico to pay for the billions and billions of dollars it will take to build this wall. We've already had MULTIPLE Mexican presidents tell Trump to pound sand.

So please, tell me where Trump gets the actual support to do this? He's acting like when he takes office, he's going to be able to do a lot of things unilaterally that he isn't actually going to be able to do.

You've got a bunch of employees trying to tell a multi-billionaire that he doesn't understand finance... That's about as ridiculous as a bunch of employees trying to tell people that a man known as the mentor to the millionaires wrote a book that's full of sh**ty financial advice....

[Moiraine]

 

 

--SNIP--

I think everybody gets the impression when he says he's going to make Mexico pay for it that he is going to build it and send a bill to the president of Mexico. However, when asked about it, he brought up (iirc) a $58 billion trade deficit each year with Mexico. So what I get out of it is that he will be very stubborn with Mexico and rectify the trade deals we're making in order to pay for it, hence "Mexico paying for it."

--SNIP--

I know we're in the Repub thread, but even in here, this wall nonsense is just that... nonsense.

 

Here are a few articles you should look over regarding the viability of such a wall:

 

A description of Trump's wall from an engineer with good desriptions

 

Here's why Trump doesn't fundamentally understand the implications or expedience of his immigration policy

 

Trump's flawed view on economics as a whole

 

The last two are particularly in step with my own personal thinking. I'm by no means an economist, but even I can tell when Trump talks about "losing to China, losing to Mexico, etc.," he's just totally wrong about the way trade with those country's work.

I asked another person here and got no response. Tell me how Trump gets this wall built? Slapping an embargo on Mexico or imposing massive tariffs on them is going to be very harmful to OUR economy, despite the trade deficit he cites with them. Furthermore, there's no legitimate way to force Mexico to pay for the billions and billions of dollars it will take to build this wall. We've already had MULTIPLE Mexican presidents tell Trump to pound sand.

So please, tell me where Trump gets the actual support to do this? He's acting like when he takes office, he's going to be able to do a lot of things unilaterally that he isn't actually going to be able to do.

You've got a bunch of employees trying to tell a multi-billionaire that he doesn't understand finance... That's about as ridiculous as a bunch of employees trying to tell people that a man known as the mentor to the millionaires wrote a book that's full of sh**ty financial advice....

Being a billionaire who did no better than the S&P500 and went bankrupt several times doesn't mean you understand finance. But then we've had this conversation before.

[B.B. Hemingway]

It'll never cease to amaze me how easy some people think it is to operate, and manage a vast,financial empire. An unimaginable amount of variables involved, yet so easy.

[Moiraine]

It'll never cease to amaze me how easy some people think it is to operate, and manage a vast,financial empire. An unimaginable amount of variables involved, yet so easy.

It'll never cease to amaze me that people see the word "billion" and ignore all other variables involved, such as baseline wealth.

 

As far as I recall I don't think I've said I think what he did is easy. But I don't think his wealth shows that he's savvy or proves that he understands the economy for the middle class. I think not a small proportion of the population, given that they had the ambition to be filthy rich, could have done what he did given that they started off with the amount of $ that less than 400 people had in 1980.

[B.B. Hemingway]

 

It'll never cease to amaze me how easy some people think it is to operate, and manage a vast,financial empire. An unimaginable amount of variables involved, yet so easy.

It'll never cease to amaze me that people see the word "billion" and ignore all other variables involved, such as baseline wealth.

As far as I recall I don't think I've said I think what he did is easy. But I don't think his wealth shows that he's savvy or proves that he understands the economy for the middle class. I think not a small proportion of the population, given that they had the ambition to be filthy rich, could have done what he did given that they started off with the amount of $ that less than 400 people had in 1980.

I've never ignored his baseline wealth, neither... I've agreed that his circumstances were a definite advantage, but some on here act like $200 million automatically turns in $4 Billion, or however much he has now. Maintaining wealth becomes significantly more difficult when you're actively investing it in multiple business arenas....

[teachercd]

I bet that 75% of the people that post on this site are billionaires...

[HuskerNation1]

 

 

 

Trump got "dominated" in the minds of people that hate him...that is it. All that was last night was finally two other dudes standing up for themselves...like when your little brother finally fights back.

 

Cruz wishes he was out because he wants to be a supreme court justice...

Just like Trump and Christie had an alliance before New Hampshire...I think Cruz and Rubio are forming one, and if Cruz does poorly in the SEC states, even if he eeks out a win in Texas, I think he will bow out as he would rather have Rubio win than Trump.

I think you have a point...but I still think Cruz wants to be a supreme court justice

Yes his interest in the supreme court has been reported on townhall and other sites, but it would require a gop win for president and holding on to the senate...something that wont happen with Trump as the nominee.

[Danny Bateman]

 

 

--SNIP--

I think everybody gets the impression when he says he's going to make Mexico pay for it that he is going to build it and send a bill to the president of Mexico. However, when asked about it, he brought up (iirc) a $58 billion trade deficit each year with Mexico. So what I get out of it is that he will be very stubborn with Mexico and rectify the trade deals we're making in order to pay for it, hence "Mexico paying for it."

--SNIP--

I know we're in the Repub thread, but even in here, this wall nonsense is just that... nonsense.

 

Here are a few articles you should look over regarding the viability of such a wall:

 

A description of Trump's wall from an engineer with good desriptions

 

Here's why Trump doesn't fundamentally understand the implications or expedience of his immigration policy

 

Trump's flawed view on economics as a whole

 

The last two are particularly in step with my own personal thinking. I'm by no means an economist, but even I can tell when Trump talks about "losing to China, losing to Mexico, etc.," he's just totally wrong about the way trade with those country's work.

I asked another person here and got no response. Tell me how Trump gets this wall built? Slapping an embargo on Mexico or imposing massive tariffs on them is going to be very harmful to OUR economy, despite the trade deficit he cites with them. Furthermore, there's no legitimate way to force Mexico to pay for the billions and billions of dollars it will take to build this wall. We've already had MULTIPLE Mexican presidents tell Trump to pound sand.

So please, tell me where Trump gets the actual support to do this? He's acting like when he takes office, he's going to be able to do a lot of things unilaterally that he isn't actually going to be able to do.

You've got a bunch of employees trying to tell a multi-billionaire that he doesn't understand finance... That's about as ridiculous as a bunch of employees trying to tell people that a man known as the mentor to the millionaires wrote a book that's full of sh**ty financial advice....

 

Ad hominem isn't exactly a strong counterargument.

[Danny Bateman]

 

It'll never cease to amaze me how easy some people think it is to operate, and manage a vast,financial empire. An unimaginable amount of variables involved, yet so easy.

It'll never cease to amaze me that people see the word "billion" and ignore all other variables involved, such as baseline wealth.

 

As far as I recall I don't think I've said I think what he did is easy. But I don't think his wealth shows that he's savvy or proves that he understands the economy for the middle class. I think not a small proportion of the population, given that they had the ambition to be filthy rich, could have done what he did given that they started off with the amount of $ that less than 400 people had in 1980.

 

Trump got a "small loan" of $1 million and gained control of his father's company in 1971. This is probably where Rubio gets the $200 million dollar figure for what he was given.

 

The latest figure has his current net worth somewhere between $4-4.5 billion. The Forbes 400 said $4.1 billion in their latest list, and in '82 estimated him worth $200 million. Of course, Donald likes to brag using exaggerated numbers-- in '82 he claimed he was worth "more than $500 million" and of course, no he says he's worth north of $10 billion. But we know he's full of crap, right?

 

But, to your point, he's done a fairly mediocre job managing his money. Let's give him the benefit of the doubt. If he'd simply taken his fortune of $500 million in '82 and invested it in UNmanaged stock index funds (e.g., doesn't need actively managed, just reinvest the interest you make back into funds), he'd be worth $20 billion today. That's twice his claimed net worth and 5x the objective net worth.

 

Basically, Donald would've been much better off doing next to nothing with his money than actively using it.

 

Hemingway may be right about the executive experience bit, but I'd argue he's actually done a pretty shoddy job as an executive, and very basic numbers seem to back that up.

[Moiraine]

 

 

It'll never cease to amaze me how easy some people think it is to operate, and manage a vast,financial empire. An unimaginable amount of variables involved, yet so easy.

It'll never cease to amaze me that people see the word "billion" and ignore all other variables involved, such as baseline wealth.

 

As far as I recall I don't think I've said I think what he did is easy. But I don't think his wealth shows that he's savvy or proves that he understands the economy for the middle class. I think not a small proportion of the population, given that they had the ambition to be filthy rich, could have done what he did given that they started off with the amount of $ that less than 400 people had in 1980.

 

Trump got a "small loan" of $1 million and gained control of his father's company in 1971. This is probably where Rubio gets the $200 million dollar figure for what he was given.

 

The latest figure has his current net worth somewhere between $4-4.5 billion. The Forbes 400 said $4.1 billion in their latest list, and in '82 estimated him worth $200 million. Of course, Donald likes to brag using exaggerated numbers-- in '82 he claimed he was worth "more than $500 million" and of course, no he says he's worth north of $10 billion. But we know he's full of crap, right?

 

But, to your point, he's done a fairly mediocre job managing his money. Let's give him the benefit of the doubt. If he'd simply taken his fortune of $500 million in '82 and invested it in UNmanaged stock index funds (e.g., doesn't need actively managed, just reinvest the interest you make back into funds), he'd be worth $20 billion today. That's twice his claimed net worth and 5x the objective net worth.

 

Basically, Donald would've been much better off doing next to nothing with his money than actively using it.

 

Hemingway may be right about the executive experience bit, but I'd argue he's actually done a pretty shoddy job as an executive, and very basic numbers seem to back that up.

 

 

 

The estimates for how much he was loaned in 1974 are from $40 million to $200 million. He also received thousands of properties.

 

Also:

 

Trump eventually found himself in serious financial trouble. In 1990, due to excessive leveraging, The Trump Organization revealed that it was $5 billion in debt ($8.8 billion by some estimates), with $1 billion personally guaranteed by Trump himself. The survival of the company was made possible only by a bailout pact agreed upon in August of that same year by some 70 banks, allowing Trump to defer on nearly $1 billion in debt, as well as to take out second and third mortgages on almost all of his properties. If it were not for the collective effort of all banks and parties involved in that 1990 deal, Trump’s business would have gone bankrupt and failed.

 

 

 

I bet that 75% of the people that post on this site are billionaires...

 

 

I bet that 75% of the people that post on this site had more money than all but 400 people in the entire U.S. in 1982. I bet that 75% of the people that post on this site were several billion $ in debt and got their asses saved by a bail out.

[teachercd]

 

 

 

It'll never cease to amaze me how easy some people think it is to operate, and manage a vast,financial empire. An unimaginable amount of variables involved, yet so easy.

It'll never cease to amaze me that people see the word "billion" and ignore all other variables involved, such as baseline wealth.

 

As far as I recall I don't think I've said I think what he did is easy. But I don't think his wealth shows that he's savvy or proves that he understands the economy for the middle class. I think not a small proportion of the population, given that they had the ambition to be filthy rich, could have done what he did given that they started off with the amount of $ that less than 400 people had in 1980.

 

Trump got a "small loan" of $1 million and gained control of his father's company in 1971. This is probably where Rubio gets the $200 million dollar figure for what he was given.

 

The latest figure has his current net worth somewhere between $4-4.5 billion. The Forbes 400 said $4.1 billion in their latest list, and in '82 estimated him worth $200 million. Of course, Donald likes to brag using exaggerated numbers-- in '82 he claimed he was worth "more than $500 million" and of course, no he says he's worth north of $10 billion. But we know he's full of crap, right?

 

But, to your point, he's done a fairly mediocre job managing his money. Let's give him the benefit of the doubt. If he'd simply taken his fortune of $500 million in '82 and invested it in UNmanaged stock index funds (e.g., doesn't need actively managed, just reinvest the interest you make back into funds), he'd be worth $20 billion today. That's twice his claimed net worth and 5x the objective net worth.

 

Basically, Donald would've been much better off doing next to nothing with his money than actively using it.

 

Hemingway may be right about the executive experience bit, but I'd argue he's actually done a pretty shoddy job as an executive, and very basic numbers seem to back that up.

 

 

 

The estimates for how much he was loaned in 1974 are from $40 million to $200 million. He also received thousands of properties.

 

Also:

 

Trump eventually found himself in serious financial trouble. In 1990, due to excessive leveraging, The Trump Organization revealed that it was $5 billion in debt ($8.8 billion by some estimates), with $1 billion personally guaranteed by Trump himself. The survival of the company was made possible only by a bailout pact agreed upon in August of that same year by some 70 banks, allowing Trump to defer on nearly $1 billion in debt, as well as to take out second and third mortgages on almost all of his properties. If it were not for the collective effort of all banks and parties involved in that 1990 deal, Trump’s business would have gone bankrupt and failed.

 

 

 

I bet that 75% of the people that post on this site are billionaires...

 

 

I bet that 75% of the people that post on this site had more money than all but 400 people in the entire U.S. in 1982. I bet that 75% of the people that post on this site were several billion $ in debt and got their asses saved by a bail out.

 

Yikes...I think you would lose both those bets...don't you?

 

1-800-BETS OFF

[Moiraine]

 

 

 

 

It'll never cease to amaze me how easy some people think it is to operate, and manage a vast,financial empire. An unimaginable amount of variables involved, yet so easy.

It'll never cease to amaze me that people see the word "billion" and ignore all other variables involved, such as baseline wealth.

 

As far as I recall I don't think I've said I think what he did is easy. But I don't think his wealth shows that he's savvy or proves that he understands the economy for the middle class. I think not a small proportion of the population, given that they had the ambition to be filthy rich, could have done what he did given that they started off with the amount of $ that less than 400 people had in 1980.

 

Trump got a "small loan" of $1 million and gained control of his father's company in 1971. This is probably where Rubio gets the $200 million dollar figure for what he was given.

 

The latest figure has his current net worth somewhere between $4-4.5 billion. The Forbes 400 said $4.1 billion in their latest list, and in '82 estimated him worth $200 million. Of course, Donald likes to brag using exaggerated numbers-- in '82 he claimed he was worth "more than $500 million" and of course, no he says he's worth north of $10 billion. But we know he's full of crap, right?

 

But, to your point, he's done a fairly mediocre job managing his money. Let's give him the benefit of the doubt. If he'd simply taken his fortune of $500 million in '82 and invested it in UNmanaged stock index funds (e.g., doesn't need actively managed, just reinvest the interest you make back into funds), he'd be worth $20 billion today. That's twice his claimed net worth and 5x the objective net worth.

 

Basically, Donald would've been much better off doing next to nothing with his money than actively using it.

 

Hemingway may be right about the executive experience bit, but I'd argue he's actually done a pretty shoddy job as an executive, and very basic numbers seem to back that up.

 

 

 

The estimates for how much he was loaned in 1974 are from $40 million to $200 million. He also received thousands of properties.

 

Also:

 

Trump eventually found himself in serious financial trouble. In 1990, due to excessive leveraging, The Trump Organization revealed that it was $5 billion in debt ($8.8 billion by some estimates), with $1 billion personally guaranteed by Trump himself. The survival of the company was made possible only by a bailout pact agreed upon in August of that same year by some 70 banks, allowing Trump to defer on nearly $1 billion in debt, as well as to take out second and third mortgages on almost all of his properties. If it were not for the collective effort of all banks and parties involved in that 1990 deal, Trump’s business would have gone bankrupt and failed.

 

 

 

I bet that 75% of the people that post on this site are billionaires...

 

 

I bet that 75% of the people that post on this site had more money than all but 400 people in the entire U.S. in 1982. I bet that 75% of the people that post on this site were several billion $ in debt and got their asses saved by a bail out.

 

Yikes...I think you would lose both those bets...don't you?

 

1-800-BETS OFF

 

 

 

Yup. They're as idiotic as the point I think you're trying to make.

[teachercd]

No...

[Moiraine]