Democratic Election Thread

[Hedley Lamarr]

How can anyone vote for Hillary? Like honestly, she has changed practically ever viewpoint she has ever had. Lied and been caught. Facing potential charges from the FBI....

[Moiraine]

How can anyone vote for Hillary? Like honestly, she has changed practically ever viewpoint she has ever had. Lied and been caught. Facing potential charges from the FBI....

 

The gay one is the major one I've heard and it annoys me but offhand I don't know of the others. Trump seems a lot worse in this regard.

[zoogs]

Lots of people opposed gay marriage not very long ago. Over time you'd hope people mold their views as they gain understanding. Of course, some are consistent. 'This man believes the same thing on Wednesday that he believed on Monday. No matter what happened Tuesday!' -- since when has that been regarded as a virtue?

 

Hilary is capable, accomplished, and experienced. She appears more moderate compared to Sanders which may not be your cup of tea, but I prefer centrism to unvarnished ideology that seems unlikely to pass legislature anyway. For starters there are recent gains that must be competently defended in what is known to be a hostile environment.

 

I think she would be quite a good President whose agenda would help secure direction on a number of things I care greatly about, such as healthcare and the environment. I am wary of her hawkish reputation but I think her foreign policy credentials are solid, and at the least she would not shutter the Iran Deal. I don't expect to agree with a President on everything, but her candidacy hits off all the important points for me. I'm disappointed that there aren't Republican candidates who come close to that, but that's the state of that party right now.

[Hedley Lamarr]

The issue isn't that she changes views it's that she continues to say she doesn't

[zoogs]

Does she, or is that just the political attack vector of choice? It's a real non-issue for me.. There's *no* mystery about what her platform is. She's a firmly establishment, moderate Democrat open to dealmaking and compromise. She pursues a broadly progressive agenda on social and economic issues. She's not quite (or not nearly, depending on whom you ask) as progressive or radical in her proposals as the more ideological wing of her party would want her to be. She'll probably try to embody those needs a little better but will never come close to Bernie's insurgency against the order.

 

For most candidates these things are not great mysteries. We know what Bernie's about (Wall Street!). We have a good picture of the type of ideological forces that are pushing Republican candidates (Tea Party) as well as the extent to which they are putty ready to be molded by them (*a cough that sounds remarkably like Rubio). Trump is a wildcard, admittedly; he alone appears wholly indifferent to influences from any wing of any party. Trump's just going to Trump and that will appeal greatly to those who consider this refreshing, or who find him admirable.

[Danny Bateman]

 

How can anyone vote for Hillary? Like honestly, she has changed practically ever viewpoint she has ever had. Lied and been caught. Facing potential charges from the FBI....

 

The gay one is the major one I've heard and it annoys me but offhand I don't know of the others. Trump seems a lot worse in this regard.

 

It's hard to to consider Trump a flip-flopper when the man won't adopt a firm stance on anything until he realizes who's in the room in front of him. Frankly, I just don't believe a word the guy says from the get-go, and Politifact backs this up.They rate his statements 93% Half-False or worse.

 

I'm not making excuses for Hillary, but she came from a conservative household in Chicago and thus I could see her having traditional marriage views from the outset. It does make me cringe when I see clips of her vehemently defending traditional marriage from past years, but I also don't like the fact that somehow because politicians jobs involve their various ideologies, they're somehow chiseled into stone and it is somehow inappropriate for politicians to change their personal opinions on such matters like any other person. If Joe Schmo can go from being faithless to practicing a religion, being racist to renouncing their ways, or adapting from liberal ideologies as a young'un to more conservative ones as they age, I don't see why it's such a revelation for Hillary Clinton to accept the LGBT mantle at some point after having opposed it in the past.

 

My views on the candidates are more akin to zoogs'. I will vote for Hillary because she is the most qualified candidate to be the next president, she most closely matches the ideologies I view as important, is the most pragmatic person I see running, and I cannot force myself to care about any kind of attack narrative that the right-wing machine or anyone else seems to conjure up against her.

 

Sanders is a very interesting candidate ideologically, and he tugs on the heartstrings of many working class Americans. He brings up some very important issues that I think otherwise would go unmentioned in a typical election cycle. However, I feel that while he excels at firing up his base (largely white, liberal, young males with a good dash of young females sprinkled in), most of America's more aged population largely either distrusts his policies' feasibility, or in some cases, gets a bit itchy when they hear any variant of the term "socialist" being bandied about. His naivete regarding foreign policy is also a dealbreaker for me. Thus far (one state, but getting crushed in SC polls), he cannot attract the African American vote at all, and the Democratic nod runs through that.

 

As for the GOP... well! Cruz is a madman, deriving his power mainly from evangelical energy and children's tears. He'll never be able to drum up the amount of support needed from moderates to be competitive. Thank goodness. The guy is a new level of greasy.

 

Rubio is probably the most palatable of the serious candidates. I actually feel that Carson is very intelligent, but he struggles to express himself on the big stage and some of his ideologies are nuts. The longer Kasich and Carson stay in the race, the worse it is for Rubio and the better it is for Trump.

 

Personally, I hope that they hang around for a good long while so Trump can somehow force his way to the nod. I'd love nothing more than to see Hillary and the Dems smack Trump down with the righteous hand of God during the general.

[HuskerShark]

Lots of people opposed gay marriage not very long ago. Over time you'd hope people mold their views as they gain understanding. Of course, some are consistent. 'This man believes the same thing on Wednesday that he believed on Monday. No matter what happened Tuesday!' -- since when has that been regarded as a virtue?Hilary is capable, accomplished, and experienced. She appears more moderate compared to Sanders which may not be your cup of tea, but I prefer centrism to unvarnished ideology that seems unlikely to pass legislature anyway. For starters there are recent gains that must be competently defended in what is known to be a hostile environment.I think she would be quite a good President whose agenda would help secure direction on a number of things I care greatly about, such as healthcare and the environment. I am wary of her hawkish reputation but I think her foreign policy credentials are solid, and at the least she would not shutter the Iran Deal. I don't expect to agree with a President on everything, but her candidacy hits off all the important points for me. I'm disappointed that there aren't Republican candidates who come close to that, but that's the state of that party right now.

I seriously don't get what anyone could possibly see in Hillary Clinton to think she'd ever be a quality president. Other than some idiot rooting for history being made with the first female president, I have no idea why anyone would vote for this slimy piece of trash...

[Danny Bateman]

 

Lots of people opposed gay marriage not very long ago. Over time you'd hope people mold their views as they gain understanding. Of course, some are consistent. 'This man believes the same thing on Wednesday that he believed on Monday. No matter what happened Tuesday!' -- since when has that been regarded as a virtue?Hilary is capable, accomplished, and experienced. She appears more moderate compared to Sanders which may not be your cup of tea, but I prefer centrism to unvarnished ideology that seems unlikely to pass legislature anyway. For starters there are recent gains that must be competently defended in what is known to be a hostile environment.I think she would be quite a good President whose agenda would help secure direction on a number of things I care greatly about, such as healthcare and the environment. I am wary of her hawkish reputation but I think her foreign policy credentials are solid, and at the least she would not shutter the Iran Deal. I don't expect to agree with a President on everything, but her candidacy hits off all the important points for me. I'm disappointed that there aren't Republican candidates who come close to that, but that's the state of that party right now.

I seriously don't get what anyone could possibly see in Hillary Clinton to think she'd ever be a quality president. Other than some idiot rooting for history being made with the first female president, I have no idea why anyone would vote for this slimy piece of trash...

 

 

It's all relative. This is how most on the left view Trump, so it goes both ways.

[BigRedBuster]

Hell....that's how I see both of them.

 

Can not figure out why anyone would vote for either one.

[Landlord]

I seriously don't get what anyone could possibly see in Hillary Clinton to think she'd ever be a quality president. Other than some idiot rooting for history being made with the first female president, I have no idea why anyone would vote for this slimy piece of trash...

 

 

 

 

Then you're either incapable of trying to understand perspectives other than your own, or you're unwilling. I can easily understand and grasp why someone would honestly vote for any candidate running on either side.

[zoogs]

I seriously don't get what anyone could possibly see in Hillary Clinton to think she'd ever be a quality president. Other than some idiot rooting for history being made with the first female president, I have no idea why anyone would vote for this slimy piece of trash...

Given this language it seems possible you've succumbed to the rhetoric of a right-wing war machine that has been terrified of her political potential and launching a campaign of fervent character assassination for well over a decade. I can't say it hasn't been effective even among liberals (this is a good post addressing some of the criticisms and highlighting some of her strengths, to offer a particularly pro-Hilary perspective).

 

It's what you get, I suppose, out of a party that has become ruled by the idea of zero compromise and giving no quarter to the very ones on the opposite of the aisle most capable of working with them. It's how a President who ran on unity and bipartisanship comes in to face sheer obstructionism and an opposing legislature worried about little else other than planning how to make him a 1-term president. The Republican Party deserves better than this sort of leadership. They once had it, where did it go?

[Saunders]

Does she, or is that just the political attack vector of choice?

Well...

 

http://www.huskerboard.com/index.php?/topic/75964-democratic-election-thread/page-3&do=findComment&comment=1671342

[HuskerShark]

 

I seriously don't get what anyone could possibly see in Hillary Clinton to think she'd ever be a quality president. Other than some idiot rooting for history being made with the first female president, I have no idea why anyone would vote for this slimy piece of trash...

Given this language it seems possible you've succumbed to the rhetoric of a right-wing war machine that has been terrified of her political potential and launching a campaign of fervent character assassination for well over a decade. I can't say it hasn't been effective even among liberals (this is a good post addressing some of the criticisms and highlighting some of her strengths, to offer a particularly pro-Hilary perspective).

 

It's what you get, I suppose, out of a party that has become ruled by the idea of zero compromise and giving no quarter to the very ones on the opposite of the aisle most capable of working with them. It's how a President who ran on unity and bipartisanship comes in to face sheer obstructionism and an opposing legislature worried about little else other than planning how to make him a 1-term president. The Republican Party deserves better than this sort of leadership. They once had it, where did it go?

 

 

I don't identify with either party technically. I go into every election and take an objective point of view as to what our country needs as a leader and make my decision based upon that.

 

In 2008, I'll honestly tell everyone that I voted for Obama. When 2012 came around and I'd seen his body of work up to that point, I didn't think he should have been re-elected, and I became a big fan of Ron Paul. This year, I'm a huge fan of Trump, and I'm also a fan of Rand Paul and Marco Rubio. In my opinion, the Republican primary has some very strong candidates this year, and it has been really interesting. In 2012, the GOP screwed itself when they elected Mitt Romney and they had a couple other candidates that would have been much more appealing.

 

I think the 2-party system in this country makes our politics really messing, and the government system that was set up over 200 years ago that worked very well has been tarnished by the never-ending dick measuring between the two parties.

[BigRedBuster]

Lots of people opposed gay marriage not very long ago. Over time you'd hope people mold their views as they gain understanding. Of course, some are consistent. 'This man believes the same thing on Wednesday that he believed on Monday. No matter what happened Tuesday!' -- since when has that been regarded as a virtue?

 

Hilary is capable, accomplished, and experienced. She appears more moderate compared to Sanders which may not be your cup of tea, but I prefer centrism to unvarnished ideology that seems unlikely to pass legislature anyway. For starters there are recent gains that must be competently defended in what is known to be a hostile environment.

 

I think she would be quite a good President whose agenda would help secure direction on a number of things I care greatly about, such as healthcare and the environment. I am wary of her hawkish reputation but I think her foreign policy credentials are solid, and at the least she would not shutter the Iran Deal. I don't expect to agree with a President on everything, but her candidacy hits off all the important points for me. I'm disappointed that there aren't Republican candidates who come close to that, but that's the state of that party right now.

Here's my issue with issues like gay marriage.

 

I am perfectly fine with people changing their minds on issues. Heck, I have changed my mind on many issues throughout my life. Other politicians have changed their minds on issues.

 

So.....it is clear that at some point, Hillary changed her mind on gay marriage. That isn't that big of a deal. BUT....when she now comes out and says...."I have supported gay marriage all my life"....That is absolute total BS and is just an example of a politician saying whatever it takes to get votes even if it clearly can be seen as a total lie.

 

And...no, she is not the only one that does that. I just wish a politician would come out and say "hey, at one point in my life I was against gay marriage. However, since then, I have listened and learned more about the issue and have changed my mind."

 

That would garner one heck of a lot more respect from me than the crap she (and others) spew.

[teachercd]

She must have supported gay marriage her entire life...She married a dude and she is a dude. Bazing!