Gun Control

[DefenderAO]

2 minutes ago, NM11046 said:

 

Archy has posted data where you've made shooting-related statements that were untrue.  Have you reviewed them as data drives the most informed and best decisions on a very complex subject.

[knapplc]

2 minutes ago, DefenderAO said:

They seem mentally ill.  In this case it seems to have manifested in gender dysphoria.  The most recent shooter, was/were, was a transgender.  Tell me what prospective, unhinged mass shooting classes are special or exempt.  When thinking soundly and not clouded with contempt, I suspect you'd say none are exempt. Zero.

 

What would you do here?   You trumpet "not one more life!!"  Here it is in front of you.  They've taken no action yet.  What's your move?  

 

You all want action and less platitudes.

 

Here it is.

 

No, we're calling out your hypocrisy. You're 100% focused on trans people and not the real problem. There have been 

 

Trans people are not mentally ill. Full stop. Go educate yourself on trans people before posting about them again. Speak to a few (if they'll speak to you, that is). 

 

As for this particular situation you keep posting? At least one of the people in that "article" aren't advocating violence, they're explaining why violence might happen. The article is pretty suspect. But let's pretend it's all real - the answer would be to remove guns from society so people who would commit violent acts with guns cannot.

 

THE PROBLEM IS THE GUNS. WITHOUT THE GUNS THERE WOULD BE NO MASS SHOOTINGS. 

 

 

[NM11046]

 

 

[Scarlet]

14 minutes ago, DefenderAO said:

Now, what groups are the ones depressed?  Is it a conservative Christian problem?  What cultural issue does the US have other countries do not? 

Ridiculous.  The top three countries for depression are Greece, Spain, and Portugal.  They don't have conservative Christians?  

 

"What cultural issue does the US have that other countries don't?". Are you saying countries like Thailand (104 in the world) or Cambodia (169), Laos (180), Sri Lanka (150), Singapore (190) don't have trans people residing there?  Because if you are you need to get out into the world.  The difference is they are accepted in those cultures because the body is not viewed as who you are.  

 

 

[BigRedBuster]

21 minutes ago, DefenderAO said:

I told you it's difficult.  Completely overhaul the mental health system.  

 

Let's put you in action - what would you do with these people today?  You want action?  I know what I'd do.  What's your play?

What would you do with these people?  You obviously know...let's see it?

 

These people are no different than extreme right wing nut jobs that have promoted violence towards elected officials and promoted J6.  One of those people is our ex President.  I personally think that if and when they break a law, they should be held accountable to the fullest extent.

[DefenderAO]

14 minutes ago, knapplc said:

 

No, we're calling out your hypocrisy. You're 100% focused on trans people and not the real problem. There have been 

 

Trans people are not mentally ill. Full stop. Go educate yourself on trans people before posting about them again. Speak to a few (if they'll speak to you, that is). 

 

As for this particular situation you keep posting? At least one of the people in that "article" aren't advocating violence, they're explaining why violence might happen. The article is pretty suspect. But let's pretend it's all real - the answer would be to remove guns from society so people who would commit violent acts with guns cannot.

 

THE PROBLEM IS THE GUNS. WITHOUT THE GUNS THERE WOULD BE NO MASS SHOOTINGS. 

 

 

It's good you don't make policy.  Your stated prejudice against religious groups/spiritual people (cultists) is palpable contempt.  

 

The people in the link are mentally ill.  It manifests in gender dysphoria.  

 

I suspect your lead-in analysis of the lone non-violent already had mitigated life loss. He/she isn't seemingly violent.  Since the focus is saving lives, not calling out the loner that is likely no threat, you state the inanimate tool is the problem, not the sociopath wielding it.

 

Utterly astounding.

[DefenderAO]

2 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

What would you do with these people?  You obviously know...let's see it?

 

These people are no different than extreme right wing nut jobs that have promoted violence towards elected officials and promoted J6.  One of those people is our ex President.  I personally think that if and when they break a law, they should be held accountable to the fullest extent.

Immediately detained without bail.  Investigate their networks and those people.  If any risk to the innocent, detained.   Then, through a fully reformed mental health system, rehab them. They do not leave until fully changed as defined by your overhauled system. 

 

So your proposal is wait and see if they break a law?  Then, when they do, come back to the forum and complain about loss of life, conservatives, and guns?

 

You have your answer so shouldn't need to ask me gain.  Reactivity is death in this scenario.  Proactive measures, focused on those willing to so brazenly share their moral and mental ineptitude, is critical.  

[knapplc]

1 minute ago, DefenderAO said:

It's good you don't make policy.  Your stated prejudice against religious groups/spiritual people (cultists) is palpable contempt.  

 

The people in the link are mentally ill.  It manifests in gender dysphoria.  

 

I suspect your lead-in analysis of the lone non-violent already had mitigated life loss. He/she isn't seemingly violent.  Since the focus is saving lives, you state the inanimate tool is the problem, not the sociopath wielding it.

 

Utterly astounding.

 

Gender dysphoria isn't mental illness. Educate yourself.

 

"I suspect your lead-in analysis of the lone non-violent already had mitigated life loss." - I have no idea what this word salad means. 

 

"Since the focus is saving lives, you state the inanimate tool is the problem, not the sociopath wielding it." - Correct. The guns are the problem. Sociopaths should not have access to guns. We all agree on that. Since we can't identify the sociopaths before they commit violence, the obvious solution is to ban guns. They are unnecessary in our society - with the obvious exception of hunting to control wildlife populations.

 

Normal citizens do not need guns to live in a free society. Every other first-world nation has figured that out. The gun cult in America resists getting rid of guns, and thus we have a problem no other free society has to deal with. 

[Archy1221]

10 minutes ago, knapplc said:

Trans people are not mentally ill. Full stop. Go educate yourself on trans people before posting about them again. Speak to a few (if they'll speak to you, that is). 

im not getting into the gun debate between you two but @DefenderAOthe poster might want to educate himself a bit.  Or speak to a few  

Mental Health issues are more prevalent in the trans community than the population at large. For a variety of reasons.  

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6830528/

 

We performed a cross-sectional analysis of the prevalence of psychiatric diagnoses among transgender patients in clinical care using an all-payer electronic health record database. Of 10,270 transgender patients identified, 58% (n=5940) had at least one psychiatric diagnosis compared with 13.6% (n=7,311,780) in the control patient population (p<0.0005). 

[DefenderAO]

Just now, knapplc said:

 

Gender dysphoria isn't mental illness. Educate yourself.

 

"I suspect your lead-in analysis of the lone non-violent already had mitigated life loss." - I have no idea what this word salad means. 

 

"Since the focus is saving lives, you state the inanimate tool is the problem, not the sociopath wielding it." - Correct. The guns are the problem. Sociopaths should not have access to guns. We all agree on that. Since we can't identify the sociopaths before they commit violence, the obvious solution is to ban guns. They are unnecessary in our society - with the obvious exception of hunting to control wildlife populations.

 

Normal citizens do not need guns to live in a free society. Every other first-world nation has figured that out. The gun cult in America resists getting rid of guns, and thus we have a problem no other free society has to deal with. 

You're reading what you want to read.  Not what was said.  These people are mentally ill.  Their mental illness has manifested, or yielded, gender identity issues.  

 

I've identified possible sociopaths and mentally unwell.  You proposal is to protect them and take the inanimate tool they hold.  

 

The inability to recognize evil, take appropriate measures, and understand the need to protect against it...defend what is good, is astounding.  The law abiding would give up their guns before the sociopaths do.  

 

"Just one life."  The lone point we agree.  Except, your measures wouldn't to do anything you say your heart desires.

[BigRedBuster]

13 minutes ago, DefenderAO said:

Immediately detained without bail.  Investigate their networks and those people.  If any risk to the innocent, detained.   Then, through a fully reformed mental health system, rehab them. They do not leave until fully changed as defined by your overhauled system. 

 

So your proposal is wait and see if they break a law?  Then, when they do, come back to the forum and complain about loss of life, conservatives, and guns?

 

You have your answer so shouldn't need to ask me gain.  Reactivity is death in this scenario.  Proactive measures, focused on those willing to so brazenly share their moral and mental ineptitude, is critical.  

And, you feel detaining people who have not broken the law is constitutional.

 

Or...are we throwing the constitution out...if so....your 2nd amendment argument goes out the door.

 

I would obviously be monitoring this group very heavily with the FBI. 

[knapplc]

2 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

And, you feel detaining people who have not broken the law is constitutional.

 

Or...are we throwing the constitution out...if so....your 2nd amendment argument goes out the door.

 

Exactly. That "solution" is fascism. 

[NM11046]

12 minutes ago, DefenderAO said:

Archy has posted data where you've made shooting-related statements that were untrue.  Have you reviewed them as data drives the most informed and best decisions on a very complex subject.

Thanks for pointing that out - sadly that is someone I and many others have blocked on this forum for past offenses, so I'm not aware.

 

It's challenging to get all the data to agree across sources, in part due to lack of formal collection and due to the fact that "mass" is defined differently depending on the group tracking, and often a gunman will use multiple weapons so where is he bucketed?  I don't have time to review and compile the list right now, we'll see if I can find time to pull it together or find a reputable source, but would you agree that that assault weapons and large capacity magazines allow for more kills more quickly?  And I assume you know that some of the worst atrocities had at least one assault weapon involved?  Marjory Stoneman, Las Vegas, Sutherland Springs, Robb Elementary, El Paso, Auroa, Dayton, Pulse Nightclub, Uvalde and now Covnenant.  

 

I think that often times NRA and their advocates take advantage of the nuance of gun types and abilities to poo-poo the calls for banning or buy backs or proper liscensing etc.  As you and I went back and forth last night, I'm all for banning all firearms and weapons except for hunting, so the whole "it's a handgun that's killing people not an assault weapon" seems like a pretty ridiculous smokescreen to use in an argument.  I doubt very much it matters to the family members of victims what weapon was used in the massacre of their own.  

[DefenderAO]

6 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

And, you feel detaining people who have not broken the law is constitutional.

 

Or...are we throwing the constitution out...if so....your 2nd amendment argument goes out the door.

 

I would obviously be monitoring this group very heavily with the FBI. 

So, Red Flag laws are Constitutional?   You want to protect the document, these people, or possible victims?

 

They're not a threat enough for you?  Do you want action or like to banter in a DU football forum?   If I posted a similar link of some fake Christian white kid, would you have the same tone?  And, for the record, evil white kids in this vain should be handled no differently.

[BigRedBuster]

Just now, DefenderAO said:

So, Red Flag laws are Constitutional?   You want to protect the document, these people, or possible victims?

 

They're not a threat enough for you?  Do you want action or like to banter in a DU football forum?   If I posted a similar link of some fake Christian white kid, would you have the same tone?  And, for the record, evil white kids in this vain should be handled no differently.

Red flag laws actually are constitutional.  Detaining someone indefinitely who hasn't broken the law just based on something they said....I'm pretty sure isn't....until it's involved in breaking the law.

 

Now....if we are going to totally question and change the constitution to try to fix this....OK....just be prepared that the 2nd amendment is going to be questioned too.