The Obama Legacy

[Danny Bateman]

 

Obama's legacy? Perhaps it has been clearly described by other comments on this board but I have not read every single statement or opinion thereon. But:

 

Obama himself summed up one major consequence of his Presidency just in the last few days when he said "America is becoming a 'browner' nation" suggesting that with the mass influx of Mexicans and other latinos, the color tone of the skin has gotten darker. Not something to really hang one's hat on as far as major accomplishments of a positive nature. Mexicans and the vast majority of foreigners entering the United States over the last 230 years or so of its history have been quite positive contributors to our society. The problem is there are simply 15 or 20 million too many! We don't have room economically, socially, politically and culturally to absorb and assimilate into our unique American culture. Being American is different than being African American or Mexican American or even Irish American. We permit immigration because of NEED and not for any other reason. America is not a great big social 'experiment' or something to be tampered with in a reckless way

 

Historically America has seen substantial immigration (nearly 100% of which was done legally through the established naturalization procedures in an orderly and limited and controlled manner btw) of groups from various places around the world. In large numbers, problems almost always arose and social and political and cultural and even legal consequences followed. However, nearly all those who came in the past, did so for the very purpose of becoming Americans and to live the American dream. They did not come to live the "Mexican American" or the "Irish American" or the Chinese American dream. They came to BECOME Americans with all the rights, virtues, benefits and responsibilities and advantages thereof.

 

I trace the beginnings of the destabilization of American society and culture to the concoction of the terms "multiculturalism" and the deliberate attempts to seperate and divide Americans into racial and ethic groups and to pit them against one another for political purposes. To drive political wedges in between racial and ethic and cultural 'groups' is to sew the seeds of disintegration and destruction of American society and ultimately to tear us apart as 'one Nation'. We are the "United States of America" and that name means a great deal more than just a convenient name for our country. The Constitution was written carefully in order to create a bond or 'union' of the several states for the common defense and to ensure domestic tranquility.

 

In many ways, Obama's legacy has been to create fractures and division and to de-unify and disintegrate our culture. This is very dangerous to the health, welfare, safety and security of us all. Whether Obama intended this as his legacy (about half of our voting population believes so) or not, it is in fact a big part of whatever legacy he leaves to future Americans to wrestle with. Hopefully, the bonds that have kept this nation together will be repaired and restored soon. Lord knows we can't stand much more division and political hate between liberals and conservatives. If Californians vote to leave the union, I would say let them go. In fact, maybe Trump can simply sell California back to Mexico to fund the wall and then add a thousand or so miles if needed. LOL

 

Well said 84, especially the part in bold. He has sought to create divisions in this country for his own political gains, and hence we are now more divided than ever, and this was well before the 2016 election got started.

Gee, who else could we apply this description to?

[HuskerNation1]

 

 

 

 

Obama's legacy? Perhaps it has been clearly described by other comments on this board but I have not read every single statement or opinion thereon. But:

 

Obama himself summed up one major consequence of his Presidency just in the last few days when he said "America is becoming a 'browner' nation" suggesting that with the mass influx of Mexicans and other latinos, the color tone of the skin has gotten darker. Not something to really hang one's hat on as far as major accomplishments of a positive nature. Mexicans and the vast majority of foreigners entering the United States over the last 230 years or so of its history have been quite positive contributors to our society. The problem is there are simply 15 or 20 million too many! We don't have room economically, socially, politically and culturally to absorb and assimilate into our unique American culture. Being American is different than being African American or Mexican American or even Irish American. We permit immigration because of NEED and not for any other reason. America is not a great big social 'experiment' or something to be tampered with in a reckless way

 

Historically America has seen substantial immigration (nearly 100% of which was done legally through the established naturalization procedures in an orderly and limited and controlled manner btw) of groups from various places around the world. In large numbers, problems almost always arose and social and political and cultural and even legal consequences followed. However, nearly all those who came in the past, did so for the very purpose of becoming Americans and to live the American dream. They did not come to live the "Mexican American" or the "Irish American" or the Chinese American dream. They came to BECOME Americans with all the rights, virtues, benefits and responsibilities and advantages thereof.

 

I trace the beginnings of the destabilization of American society and culture to the concoction of the terms "multiculturalism" and the deliberate attempts to seperate and divide Americans into racial and ethic groups and to pit them against one another for political purposes. To drive political wedges in between racial and ethic and cultural 'groups' is to sew the seeds of disintegration and destruction of American society and ultimately to tear us apart as 'one Nation'. We are the "United States of America" and that name means a great deal more than just a convenient name for our country. The Constitution was written carefully in order to create a bond or 'union' of the several states for the common defense and to ensure domestic tranquility.

 

In many ways, Obama's legacy has been to create fractures and division and to de-unify and disintegrate our culture. This is very dangerous to the health, welfare, safety and security of us all. Whether Obama intended this as his legacy (about half of our voting population believes so) or not, it is in fact a big part of whatever legacy he leaves to future Americans to wrestle with. Hopefully, the bonds that have kept this nation together will be repaired and restored soon. Lord knows we can't stand much more division and political hate between liberals and conservatives. If Californians vote to leave the union, I would say let them go. In fact, maybe Trump can simply sell California back to Mexico to fund the wall and then add a thousand or so miles if needed. LOL

Well said 84, especially the part in bold. He has sought to create divisions in this country for his own political gains, and hence we are now more divided than ever, and this was well before the 2016 election got started.

Just so we're all on the same page, you place the blame of a divided nation solely at Obama's feet while disregarding (or intentionally ignoring) the significant failures and childish behaviors of a Republican controlled House since 2011?

 

I'm not a Democrat or a staunch Obama supporter, but that's complete and total bullsh*t.

If you have read my posts throughout this thread, I have stated that Obama (nor any Potus) is not solely responsible for things that happened under his watch, yet Presidents in general are often held accountable and have those things tied to their legacy in the history books.

 

Its like saying that Bush 43 should not have the Iraq war tied to his legacy because he was not the one who gathered the faulty intelligence, or perhaps a better example would be saying the 2008 world financial collapse should not be a part of his legacy as the Democrats had taken over Congress in 2006 and are to blame. The credit and the failures in American politics goes with the person at the top.

[ZRod]

 

 

 

 

Obama's legacy? Perhaps it has been clearly described by other comments on this board but I have not read every single statement or opinion thereon. But:

 

Obama himself summed up one major consequence of his Presidency just in the last few days when he said "America is becoming a 'browner' nation" suggesting that with the mass influx of Mexicans and other latinos, the color tone of the skin has gotten darker. Not something to really hang one's hat on as far as major accomplishments of a positive nature. Mexicans and the vast majority of foreigners entering the United States over the last 230 years or so of its history have been quite positive contributors to our society. The problem is there are simply 15 or 20 million too many! We don't have room economically, socially, politically and culturally to absorb and assimilate into our unique American culture. Being American is different than being African American or Mexican American or even Irish American. We permit immigration because of NEED and not for any other reason. America is not a great big social 'experiment' or something to be tampered with in a reckless way

 

Historically America has seen substantial immigration (nearly 100% of which was done legally through the established naturalization procedures in an orderly and limited and controlled manner btw) of groups from various places around the world. In large numbers, problems almost always arose and social and political and cultural and even legal consequences followed. However, nearly all those who came in the past, did so for the very purpose of becoming Americans and to live the American dream. They did not come to live the "Mexican American" or the "Irish American" or the Chinese American dream. They came to BECOME Americans with all the rights, virtues, benefits and responsibilities and advantages thereof.

 

I trace the beginnings of the destabilization of American society and culture to the concoction of the terms "multiculturalism" and the deliberate attempts to seperate and divide Americans into racial and ethic groups and to pit them against one another for political purposes. To drive political wedges in between racial and ethic and cultural 'groups' is to sew the seeds of disintegration and destruction of American society and ultimately to tear us apart as 'one Nation'. We are the "United States of America" and that name means a great deal more than just a convenient name for our country. The Constitution was written carefully in order to create a bond or 'union' of the several states for the common defense and to ensure domestic tranquility.

 

In many ways, Obama's legacy has been to create fractures and division and to de-unify and disintegrate our culture. This is very dangerous to the health, welfare, safety and security of us all. Whether Obama intended this as his legacy (about half of our voting population believes so) or not, it is in fact a big part of whatever legacy he leaves to future Americans to wrestle with. Hopefully, the bonds that have kept this nation together will be repaired and restored soon. Lord knows we can't stand much more division and political hate between liberals and conservatives. If Californians vote to leave the union, I would say let them go. In fact, maybe Trump can simply sell California back to Mexico to fund the wall and then add a thousand or so miles if needed. LOL

 

Well said 84, especially the part in bold. He has sought to create divisions in this country for his own political gains, and hence we are now more divided than ever, and this was well before the 2016 election got started.

Absolutely delusional... You're going to ignore over 200 years of institutional racism and place the blame on the last 8 years? Did we forget about black sentiments after Katrina? How about after OJ? Rodney King? What about Koreans and black fighting each other during the LA riots? How about how we treated "Muslims", Indians, Mexicans, and any other brown man after 9/11? The Japanese and Germans during WWII? Irish Catholic immigrants and Asian immigrants around the 20th century. Do I even need to mention slavery? Or what about the one nobody wants to talk about. How we continue to treat the people who first called this land home. Native Americans.

 

You want to say that this country, which is infact a melting pot of many peoples from across the world living together, and has been called "The Grand Experiment" by one of its founding fathers (hint: we are actually a social experiment, of democracy and liberty!), has somehow been destabilized and damaged because one of its presidents was willing to acknowledge and bring to light its faults? Not for political gain, but for discourse and progress. That, somehow makes us more divided despite our 240 years of division? Give me a break...

[BigRedBuster]

 

 

 

Obama's legacy? Perhaps it has been clearly described by other comments on this board but I have not read every single statement or opinion thereon. But:

 

Obama himself summed up one major consequence of his Presidency just in the last few days when he said "America is becoming a 'browner' nation" suggesting that with the mass influx of Mexicans and other latinos, the color tone of the skin has gotten darker. Not something to really hang one's hat on as far as major accomplishments of a positive nature. Mexicans and the vast majority of foreigners entering the United States over the last 230 years or so of its history have been quite positive contributors to our society. The problem is there are simply 15 or 20 million too many! We don't have room economically, socially, politically and culturally to absorb and assimilate into our unique American culture. Being American is different than being African American or Mexican American or even Irish American. We permit immigration because of NEED and not for any other reason. America is not a great big social 'experiment' or something to be tampered with in a reckless way

 

Historically America has seen substantial immigration (nearly 100% of which was done legally through the established naturalization procedures in an orderly and limited and controlled manner btw) of groups from various places around the world. In large numbers, problems almost always arose and social and political and cultural and even legal consequences followed. However, nearly all those who came in the past, did so for the very purpose of becoming Americans and to live the American dream. They did not come to live the "Mexican American" or the "Irish American" or the Chinese American dream. They came to BECOME Americans with all the rights, virtues, benefits and responsibilities and advantages thereof.

 

I trace the beginnings of the destabilization of American society and culture to the concoction of the terms "multiculturalism" and the deliberate attempts to seperate and divide Americans into racial and ethic groups and to pit them against one another for political purposes. To drive political wedges in between racial and ethic and cultural 'groups' is to sew the seeds of disintegration and destruction of American society and ultimately to tear us apart as 'one Nation'. We are the "United States of America" and that name means a great deal more than just a convenient name for our country. The Constitution was written carefully in order to create a bond or 'union' of the several states for the common defense and to ensure domestic tranquility.

 

In many ways, Obama's legacy has been to create fractures and division and to de-unify and disintegrate our culture. This is very dangerous to the health, welfare, safety and security of us all. Whether Obama intended this as his legacy (about half of our voting population believes so) or not, it is in fact a big part of whatever legacy he leaves to future Americans to wrestle with. Hopefully, the bonds that have kept this nation together will be repaired and restored soon. Lord knows we can't stand much more division and political hate between liberals and conservatives. If Californians vote to leave the union, I would say let them go. In fact, maybe Trump can simply sell California back to Mexico to fund the wall and then add a thousand or so miles if needed. LOL

Well said 84, especially the part in bold. He has sought to create divisions in this country for his own political gains, and hence we are now more divided than ever, and this was well before the 2016 election got started.

Just so we're all on the same page, you place the blame of a divided nation solely at Obama's feet while disregarding (or intentionally ignoring) the significant failures and childish behaviors of a Republican controlled House since 2011?

 

I'm not a Democrat or a staunch Obama supporter, but that's complete and total bullsh*t.

If you have read my posts throughout this thread, I have stated that Obama (nor any Potus) is not solely responsible for things that happened under his watch, yet Presidents in general are often held accountable and have those things tied to their legacy in the history books.

 

Its like saying that Bush 43 should not have the Iraq war tied to his legacy because he was not the one who gathered the faulty intelligence, or perhaps a better example would be saying the 2008 world financial collapse should not be a part of his legacy as the Democrats had taken over Congress in 2006 and are to blame. The credit and the failures in American politics goes with the person at the top.

 

Many people blame whoever is President at the time because they simply don't understand the facts around a certain situation and realize how various actions years before contributed to the problem.

 

I find it odd that someone who claims they DO understand this, still fixates on blaming the President who happens to be at the top at a particular time.

[Enhance]

 

 

 

Obama's legacy? Perhaps it has been clearly described by other comments on this board but I have not read every single statement or opinion thereon. But:

 

Obama himself summed up one major consequence of his Presidency just in the last few days when he said "America is becoming a 'browner' nation" suggesting that with the mass influx of Mexicans and other latinos, the color tone of the skin has gotten darker. Not something to really hang one's hat on as far as major accomplishments of a positive nature. Mexicans and the vast majority of foreigners entering the United States over the last 230 years or so of its history have been quite positive contributors to our society. The problem is there are simply 15 or 20 million too many! We don't have room economically, socially, politically and culturally to absorb and assimilate into our unique American culture. Being American is different than being African American or Mexican American or even Irish American. We permit immigration because of NEED and not for any other reason. America is not a great big social 'experiment' or something to be tampered with in a reckless way

 

Historically America has seen substantial immigration (nearly 100% of which was done legally through the established naturalization procedures in an orderly and limited and controlled manner btw) of groups from various places around the world. In large numbers, problems almost always arose and social and political and cultural and even legal consequences followed. However, nearly all those who came in the past, did so for the very purpose of becoming Americans and to live the American dream. They did not come to live the "Mexican American" or the "Irish American" or the Chinese American dream. They came to BECOME Americans with all the rights, virtues, benefits and responsibilities and advantages thereof.

 

I trace the beginnings of the destabilization of American society and culture to the concoction of the terms "multiculturalism" and the deliberate attempts to seperate and divide Americans into racial and ethic groups and to pit them against one another for political purposes. To drive political wedges in between racial and ethic and cultural 'groups' is to sew the seeds of disintegration and destruction of American society and ultimately to tear us apart as 'one Nation'. We are the "United States of America" and that name means a great deal more than just a convenient name for our country. The Constitution was written carefully in order to create a bond or 'union' of the several states for the common defense and to ensure domestic tranquility.

 

In many ways, Obama's legacy has been to create fractures and division and to de-unify and disintegrate our culture. This is very dangerous to the health, welfare, safety and security of us all. Whether Obama intended this as his legacy (about half of our voting population believes so) or not, it is in fact a big part of whatever legacy he leaves to future Americans to wrestle with. Hopefully, the bonds that have kept this nation together will be repaired and restored soon. Lord knows we can't stand much more division and political hate between liberals and conservatives. If Californians vote to leave the union, I would say let them go. In fact, maybe Trump can simply sell California back to Mexico to fund the wall and then add a thousand or so miles if needed. LOL

Well said 84, especially the part in bold. He has sought to create divisions in this country for his own political gains, and hence we are now more divided than ever, and this was well before the 2016 election got started.

Just so we're all on the same page, you place the blame of a divided nation solely at Obama's feet while disregarding (or intentionally ignoring) the significant failures and childish behaviors of a Republican controlled House since 2011?

 

I'm not a Democrat or a staunch Obama supporter, but that's complete and total bullsh*t.

If you have read my posts throughout this thread, I have stated that Obama (nor any Potus) is not solely responsible for things that happened under his watch, yet Presidents in general are often held accountable and have those things tied to their legacy in the history books.

 

Its like saying that Bush 43 should not have the Iraq war tied to his legacy because he was not the one who gathered the faulty intelligence, or perhaps a better example would be saying the 2008 world financial collapse should not be a part of his legacy as the Democrats had taken over Congress in 2006 and are to blame. The credit and the failures in American politics goes with the person at the top.

 

But your language and tone suggest you DO blame Obama entirely. "He has sought to create divisions in this country for his own political gains, and hence we are now more divided than ever." Your semantics leave no room for any other culprit.

 

I see and somewhat agree with the point you're making about legacy, but disagree with your examples. I don't think you can reasonably suggest societal divisions and the Iraq War are somehow equivalent when evaluating legacy. One of them cost thousands of American lives and a couple trillion dollars.

 

Obama made some mistakes with race relations, but from my perspective, he also brought up the elephant in the room that desperately need more attention brought to it. In the same breath, we could all easily argue that Trump has made problems worse, as well, so it's a two way street.

[Danny Bateman]

 

 

 

 

Obama's legacy? Perhaps it has been clearly described by other comments on this board but I have not read every single statement or opinion thereon. But:

 

Obama himself summed up one major consequence of his Presidency just in the last few days when he said "America is becoming a 'browner' nation" suggesting that with the mass influx of Mexicans and other latinos, the color tone of the skin has gotten darker. Not something to really hang one's hat on as far as major accomplishments of a positive nature. Mexicans and the vast majority of foreigners entering the United States over the last 230 years or so of its history have been quite positive contributors to our society. The problem is there are simply 15 or 20 million too many! We don't have room economically, socially, politically and culturally to absorb and assimilate into our unique American culture. Being American is different than being African American or Mexican American or even Irish American. We permit immigration because of NEED and not for any other reason. America is not a great big social 'experiment' or something to be tampered with in a reckless way

 

Historically America has seen substantial immigration (nearly 100% of which was done legally through the established naturalization procedures in an orderly and limited and controlled manner btw) of groups from various places around the world. In large numbers, problems almost always arose and social and political and cultural and even legal consequences followed. However, nearly all those who came in the past, did so for the very purpose of becoming Americans and to live the American dream. They did not come to live the "Mexican American" or the "Irish American" or the Chinese American dream. They came to BECOME Americans with all the rights, virtues, benefits and responsibilities and advantages thereof.

 

I trace the beginnings of the destabilization of American society and culture to the concoction of the terms "multiculturalism" and the deliberate attempts to seperate and divide Americans into racial and ethic groups and to pit them against one another for political purposes. To drive political wedges in between racial and ethic and cultural 'groups' is to sew the seeds of disintegration and destruction of American society and ultimately to tear us apart as 'one Nation'. We are the "United States of America" and that name means a great deal more than just a convenient name for our country. The Constitution was written carefully in order to create a bond or 'union' of the several states for the common defense and to ensure domestic tranquility.

 

In many ways, Obama's legacy has been to create fractures and division and to de-unify and disintegrate our culture. This is very dangerous to the health, welfare, safety and security of us all. Whether Obama intended this as his legacy (about half of our voting population believes so) or not, it is in fact a big part of whatever legacy he leaves to future Americans to wrestle with. Hopefully, the bonds that have kept this nation together will be repaired and restored soon. Lord knows we can't stand much more division and political hate between liberals and conservatives. If Californians vote to leave the union, I would say let them go. In fact, maybe Trump can simply sell California back to Mexico to fund the wall and then add a thousand or so miles if needed. LOL

Well said 84, especially the part in bold. He has sought to create divisions in this country for his own political gains, and hence we are now more divided than ever, and this was well before the 2016 election got started.

Absolutely delusional... You're going to ignore over 200 years of institutional racism and place the blame on the last 8 years? Did we forget about black sentiments after Katrina? How about after OJ? Rodney King? What about Koreans and black fighting each other during the LA riots? How about how we treated "Muslims", Indians, Mexicans, and any other brown man after 9/11? The Japanese and Germans during WWII? Irish Catholic immigrants and Asian immigrants around the 20th century. Do I even need to mention slavery? Or what about the one nobody wants to talk about. How we continue to treat the people who first called this land home. Native Americans.

 

You want to say that this country, which is infact a melting pot of many peoples from across the world living together, and has been called "The Grand Experiment" by one of its founding fathers (hint: we are actually a social experiment, of democracy and liberty!), has somehow been destabilized and damaged because one of its presidents was willing to acknowledge and bring to light its faults? Not for political gain, but for discourse and progress. That, somehow makes us more divided despite our 240 years of division? Give me a break...

 

 

Look at this guy, making excuses to avoid talking about the REAL problem of white oppression, over here.

 

 

Well said my friend.

[HuskerNation1]

 

 

 

 

 

Obama's legacy? Perhaps it has been clearly described by other comments on this board but I have not read every single statement or opinion thereon. But:

 

Obama himself summed up one major consequence of his Presidency just in the last few days when he said "America is becoming a 'browner' nation" suggesting that with the mass influx of Mexicans and other latinos, the color tone of the skin has gotten darker. Not something to really hang one's hat on as far as major accomplishments of a positive nature. Mexicans and the vast majority of foreigners entering the United States over the last 230 years or so of its history have been quite positive contributors to our society. The problem is there are simply 15 or 20 million too many! We don't have room economically, socially, politically and culturally to absorb and assimilate into our unique American culture. Being American is different than being African American or Mexican American or even Irish American. We permit immigration because of NEED and not for any other reason. America is not a great big social 'experiment' or something to be tampered with in a reckless way

 

Historically America has seen substantial immigration (nearly 100% of which was done legally through the established naturalization procedures in an orderly and limited and controlled manner btw) of groups from various places around the world. In large numbers, problems almost always arose and social and political and cultural and even legal consequences followed. However, nearly all those who came in the past, did so for the very purpose of becoming Americans and to live the American dream. They did not come to live the "Mexican American" or the "Irish American" or the Chinese American dream. They came to BECOME Americans with all the rights, virtues, benefits and responsibilities and advantages thereof.

 

I trace the beginnings of the destabilization of American society and culture to the concoction of the terms "multiculturalism" and the deliberate attempts to seperate and divide Americans into racial and ethic groups and to pit them against one another for political purposes. To drive political wedges in between racial and ethic and cultural 'groups' is to sew the seeds of disintegration and destruction of American society and ultimately to tear us apart as 'one Nation'. We are the "United States of America" and that name means a great deal more than just a convenient name for our country. The Constitution was written carefully in order to create a bond or 'union' of the several states for the common defense and to ensure domestic tranquility.

 

In many ways, Obama's legacy has been to create fractures and division and to de-unify and disintegrate our culture. This is very dangerous to the health, welfare, safety and security of us all. Whether Obama intended this as his legacy (about half of our voting population believes so) or not, it is in fact a big part of whatever legacy he leaves to future Americans to wrestle with. Hopefully, the bonds that have kept this nation together will be repaired and restored soon. Lord knows we can't stand much more division and political hate between liberals and conservatives. If Californians vote to leave the union, I would say let them go. In fact, maybe Trump can simply sell California back to Mexico to fund the wall and then add a thousand or so miles if needed. LOL

 

Well said 84, especially the part in bold. He has sought to create divisions in this country for his own political gains, and hence we are now more divided than ever, and this was well before the 2016 election got started.

Absolutely delusional... You're going to ignore over 200 years of institutional racism and place the blame on the last 8 years? Did we forget about black sentiments after Katrina? How about after OJ? Rodney King? What about Koreans and black fighting each other during the LA riots? How about how we treated "Muslims", Indians, Mexicans, and any other brown man after 9/11? The Japanese and Germans during WWII? Irish Catholic immigrants and Asian immigrants around the 20th century. Do I even need to mention slavery? Or what about the one nobody wants to talk about. How we continue to treat the people who first called this land home. Native Americans.

 

You want to say that this country, which is infact a melting pot of many peoples from across the world living together, and has been called "The Grand Experiment" by one of its founding fathers (hint: we are actually a social experiment, of democracy and liberty!), has somehow been destabilized and damaged because one of its presidents was willing to acknowledge and bring to light its faults? Not for political gain, but for discourse and progress. That, somehow makes us more divided despite our 240 years of division? Give me a break...

You can make whatever excuses you want on this topic. Nobody is stating that racial tensions suddenly began under Obama, so you are grossly off topic in using this as rationale to deny the evidence that racial tensions have deepened under Obamas tenure, and that this will be a part of his legacy which is what this thread is about. And I have said repeatedly that Obama alone cannot be blamed for this result, just as Bush cannot be solely blamed for Iraq. But I do stand by my belief that Obama used race as a wedge issue to help him gain politically, and it worked for him in 2008 and 2012.

[BigRedBuster]

 

 

 

 

Obama's legacy? Perhaps it has been clearly described by other comments on this board but I have not read every single statement or opinion thereon. But:

 

Obama himself summed up one major consequence of his Presidency just in the last few days when he said "America is becoming a 'browner' nation" suggesting that with the mass influx of Mexicans and other latinos, the color tone of the skin has gotten darker. Not something to really hang one's hat on as far as major accomplishments of a positive nature. Mexicans and the vast majority of foreigners entering the United States over the last 230 years or so of its history have been quite positive contributors to our society. The problem is there are simply 15 or 20 million too many! We don't have room economically, socially, politically and culturally to absorb and assimilate into our unique American culture. Being American is different than being African American or Mexican American or even Irish American. We permit immigration because of NEED and not for any other reason. America is not a great big social 'experiment' or something to be tampered with in a reckless way

 

Historically America has seen substantial immigration (nearly 100% of which was done legally through the established naturalization procedures in an orderly and limited and controlled manner btw) of groups from various places around the world. In large numbers, problems almost always arose and social and political and cultural and even legal consequences followed. However, nearly all those who came in the past, did so for the very purpose of becoming Americans and to live the American dream. They did not come to live the "Mexican American" or the "Irish American" or the Chinese American dream. They came to BECOME Americans with all the rights, virtues, benefits and responsibilities and advantages thereof.

 

I trace the beginnings of the destabilization of American society and culture to the concoction of the terms "multiculturalism" and the deliberate attempts to seperate and divide Americans into racial and ethic groups and to pit them against one another for political purposes. To drive political wedges in between racial and ethic and cultural 'groups' is to sew the seeds of disintegration and destruction of American society and ultimately to tear us apart as 'one Nation'. We are the "United States of America" and that name means a great deal more than just a convenient name for our country. The Constitution was written carefully in order to create a bond or 'union' of the several states for the common defense and to ensure domestic tranquility.

 

In many ways, Obama's legacy has been to create fractures and division and to de-unify and disintegrate our culture. This is very dangerous to the health, welfare, safety and security of us all. Whether Obama intended this as his legacy (about half of our voting population believes so) or not, it is in fact a big part of whatever legacy he leaves to future Americans to wrestle with. Hopefully, the bonds that have kept this nation together will be repaired and restored soon. Lord knows we can't stand much more division and political hate between liberals and conservatives. If Californians vote to leave the union, I would say let them go. In fact, maybe Trump can simply sell California back to Mexico to fund the wall and then add a thousand or so miles if needed. LOL

Well said 84, especially the part in bold. He has sought to create divisions in this country for his own political gains, and hence we are now more divided than ever, and this was well before the 2016 election got started.

Absolutely delusional... You're going to ignore over 200 years of institutional racism and place the blame on the last 8 years? Did we forget about black sentiments after Katrina? How about after OJ? Rodney King? What about Koreans and black fighting each other during the LA riots? How about how we treated "Muslims", Indians, Mexicans, and any other brown man after 9/11? The Japanese and Germans during WWII? Irish Catholic immigrants and Asian immigrants around the 20th century. Do I even need to mention slavery? Or what about the one nobody wants to talk about. How we continue to treat the people who first called this land home. Native Americans.

 

You want to say that this country, which is infact a melting pot of many peoples from across the world living together, and has been called "The Grand Experiment" by one of its founding fathers (hint: we are actually a social experiment, of democracy and liberty!), has somehow been destabilized and damaged because one of its presidents was willing to acknowledge and bring to light its faults? Not for political gain, but for discourse and progress. That, somehow makes us more divided despite our 240 years of division? Give me a break...

You can make whatever excuses you want on this topic. Nobody is stating that racial tensions suddenly began under Obama, so you are grossly off topic in using this as rationale to deny the evidence that racial tensions have deepened under Obamas tenure, and that this will be a part of his legacy which is what this thread is about. And I have said repeatedly that Obama alone cannot be blamed for this result, just as Bush cannot be solely blamed for Iraq. But I do stand by my belief that Obama used race as a wedge issue to help him gain politically, and it worked for him in 2008 and 2012.

 

So, let me ask this.

 

Back in 2008 when he was elected, during and after the election, I started hearing jokes and seeing on social media extremely racist stuff from people who opposed him as President. This has not stopped. I have seen very immature and disrespectful racial stuff about the first lady also. This isn't just from a few Neanderthals. These have carried on through the past 8 years from people who are staunch Republican voters and people I would never have guessed would contribute to this.

 

So.......I guess maybe he has been the cause of a lot of the racial tensions over the last 8 years.....but, one heck of a lot of that is simply because he and his wife are black and I personally hold people who have contributed to this as Republican voters responsible i a major way for the racial tensions because obviously, they just couldn't handle the thought of a black president.

 

Am I supposed to just ignore the fact that one heck of a lot of people who voted against Obama the last 8 years constantly pass around and perpetuate these racial jokes and comments?

[HuskerNation1]

 

 

 

 

 

 

Obama's legacy? Perhaps it has been clearly described by other comments on this board but I have not read every single statement or opinion thereon. But:

 

Obama himself summed up one major consequence of his Presidency just in the last few days when he said "America is becoming a 'browner' nation" suggesting that with the mass influx of Mexicans and other latinos, the color tone of the skin has gotten darker. Not something to really hang one's hat on as far as major accomplishments of a positive nature. Mexicans and the vast majority of foreigners entering the United States over the last 230 years or so of its history have been quite positive contributors to our society. The problem is there are simply 15 or 20 million too many! We don't have room economically, socially, politically and culturally to absorb and assimilate into our unique American culture. Being American is different than being African American or Mexican American or even Irish American. We permit immigration because of NEED and not for any other reason. America is not a great big social 'experiment' or something to be tampered with in a reckless way

 

Historically America has seen substantial immigration (nearly 100% of which was done legally through the established naturalization procedures in an orderly and limited and controlled manner btw) of groups from various places around the world. In large numbers, problems almost always arose and social and political and cultural and even legal consequences followed. However, nearly all those who came in the past, did so for the very purpose of becoming Americans and to live the American dream. They did not come to live the "Mexican American" or the "Irish American" or the Chinese American dream. They came to BECOME Americans with all the rights, virtues, benefits and responsibilities and advantages thereof.

 

I trace the beginnings of the destabilization of American society and culture to the concoction of the terms "multiculturalism" and the deliberate attempts to seperate and divide Americans into racial and ethic groups and to pit them against one another for political purposes. To drive political wedges in between racial and ethic and cultural 'groups' is to sew the seeds of disintegration and destruction of American society and ultimately to tear us apart as 'one Nation'. We are the "United States of America" and that name means a great deal more than just a convenient name for our country. The Constitution was written carefully in order to create a bond or 'union' of the several states for the common defense and to ensure domestic tranquility.

 

In many ways, Obama's legacy has been to create fractures and division and to de-unify and disintegrate our culture. This is very dangerous to the health, welfare, safety and security of us all. Whether Obama intended this as his legacy (about half of our voting population believes so) or not, it is in fact a big part of whatever legacy he leaves to future Americans to wrestle with. Hopefully, the bonds that have kept this nation together will be repaired and restored soon. Lord knows we can't stand much more division and political hate between liberals and conservatives. If Californians vote to leave the union, I would say let them go. In fact, maybe Trump can simply sell California back to Mexico to fund the wall and then add a thousand or so miles if needed. LOL

Well said 84, especially the part in bold. He has sought to create divisions in this country for his own political gains, and hence we are now more divided than ever, and this was well before the 2016 election got started.

Absolutely delusional... You're going to ignore over 200 years of institutional racism and place the blame on the last 8 years? Did we forget about black sentiments after Katrina? How about after OJ? Rodney King? What about Koreans and black fighting each other during the LA riots? How about how we treated "Muslims", Indians, Mexicans, and any other brown man after 9/11? The Japanese and Germans during WWII? Irish Catholic immigrants and Asian immigrants around the 20th century. Do I even need to mention slavery? Or what about the one nobody wants to talk about. How we continue to treat the people who first called this land home. Native Americans.

 

You want to say that this country, which is infact a melting pot of many peoples from across the world living together, and has been called "The Grand Experiment" by one of its founding fathers (hint: we are actually a social experiment, of democracy and liberty!), has somehow been destabilized and damaged because one of its presidents was willing to acknowledge and bring to light its faults? Not for political gain, but for discourse and progress. That, somehow makes us more divided despite our 240 years of division? Give me a break...

You can make whatever excuses you want on this topic. Nobody is stating that racial tensions suddenly began under Obama, so you are grossly off topic in using this as rationale to deny the evidence that racial tensions have deepened under Obamas tenure, and that this will be a part of his legacy which is what this thread is about. And I have said repeatedly that Obama alone cannot be blamed for this result, just as Bush cannot be solely blamed for Iraq. But I do stand by my belief that Obama used race as a wedge issue to help him gain politically, and it worked for him in 2008 and 2012.

So, let me ask this.

 

Back in 2008 when he was elected, during and after the election, I started hearing jokes and seeing on social media extremely racist stuff from people who opposed him as President. This has not stopped. I have seen very immature and disrespectful racial stuff about the first lady also. This isn't just from a few Neanderthals. These have carried on through the past 8 years from people who are staunch Republican voters and people I would never have guessed would contribute to this.

 

So.......I guess maybe he has been the cause of a lot of the racial tensions over the last 8 years.....but, one heck of a lot of that is simply because he and his wife are black and I personally hold people who have contributed to this as Republican voters responsible i a major way for the racial tensions because obviously, they just couldn't handle the thought of a black president.

 

Am I supposed to just ignore the fact that one heck of a lot of people who voted against Obama the last 8 years constantly pass around and perpetuate these racial jokes and comments?

Hmm... I am a bit surprised to see you using anecdotal social media posts to suggest that is a reason for the decline, especially when the gallup data I provided showed that the longstanding stability of race relations was steady through his first term which completely underscores your argument.

 

There is so much hate in social media on both sides that I dont think it encompasses both parties. I have seen plenty of hate filled comments by the left the past month about Trump and his family, including racist comments about whites that aligns with Van Jones "whitelash" rhetoric.

[Danny Bateman]

 

 

 

 

 

Obama's legacy? Perhaps it has been clearly described by other comments on this board but I have not read every single statement or opinion thereon. But:

 

Obama himself summed up one major consequence of his Presidency just in the last few days when he said "America is becoming a 'browner' nation" suggesting that with the mass influx of Mexicans and other latinos, the color tone of the skin has gotten darker. Not something to really hang one's hat on as far as major accomplishments of a positive nature. Mexicans and the vast majority of foreigners entering the United States over the last 230 years or so of its history have been quite positive contributors to our society. The problem is there are simply 15 or 20 million too many! We don't have room economically, socially, politically and culturally to absorb and assimilate into our unique American culture. Being American is different than being African American or Mexican American or even Irish American. We permit immigration because of NEED and not for any other reason. America is not a great big social 'experiment' or something to be tampered with in a reckless way

 

Historically America has seen substantial immigration (nearly 100% of which was done legally through the established naturalization procedures in an orderly and limited and controlled manner btw) of groups from various places around the world. In large numbers, problems almost always arose and social and political and cultural and even legal consequences followed. However, nearly all those who came in the past, did so for the very purpose of becoming Americans and to live the American dream. They did not come to live the "Mexican American" or the "Irish American" or the Chinese American dream. They came to BECOME Americans with all the rights, virtues, benefits and responsibilities and advantages thereof.

 

I trace the beginnings of the destabilization of American society and culture to the concoction of the terms "multiculturalism" and the deliberate attempts to seperate and divide Americans into racial and ethic groups and to pit them against one another for political purposes. To drive political wedges in between racial and ethic and cultural 'groups' is to sew the seeds of disintegration and destruction of American society and ultimately to tear us apart as 'one Nation'. We are the "United States of America" and that name means a great deal more than just a convenient name for our country. The Constitution was written carefully in order to create a bond or 'union' of the several states for the common defense and to ensure domestic tranquility.

 

In many ways, Obama's legacy has been to create fractures and division and to de-unify and disintegrate our culture. This is very dangerous to the health, welfare, safety and security of us all. Whether Obama intended this as his legacy (about half of our voting population believes so) or not, it is in fact a big part of whatever legacy he leaves to future Americans to wrestle with. Hopefully, the bonds that have kept this nation together will be repaired and restored soon. Lord knows we can't stand much more division and political hate between liberals and conservatives. If Californians vote to leave the union, I would say let them go. In fact, maybe Trump can simply sell California back to Mexico to fund the wall and then add a thousand or so miles if needed. LOL

Well said 84, especially the part in bold. He has sought to create divisions in this country for his own political gains, and hence we are now more divided than ever, and this was well before the 2016 election got started.

Absolutely delusional... You're going to ignore over 200 years of institutional racism and place the blame on the last 8 years? Did we forget about black sentiments after Katrina? How about after OJ? Rodney King? What about Koreans and black fighting each other during the LA riots? How about how we treated "Muslims", Indians, Mexicans, and any other brown man after 9/11? The Japanese and Germans during WWII? Irish Catholic immigrants and Asian immigrants around the 20th century. Do I even need to mention slavery? Or what about the one nobody wants to talk about. How we continue to treat the people who first called this land home. Native Americans.

 

You want to say that this country, which is infact a melting pot of many peoples from across the world living together, and has been called "The Grand Experiment" by one of its founding fathers (hint: we are actually a social experiment, of democracy and liberty!), has somehow been destabilized and damaged because one of its presidents was willing to acknowledge and bring to light its faults? Not for political gain, but for discourse and progress. That, somehow makes us more divided despite our 240 years of division? Give me a break...

You can make whatever excuses you want on this topic. Nobody is stating that racial tensions suddenly began under Obama, so you are grossly off topic in using this as rationale to deny the evidence that racial tensions have deepened under Obamas tenure, and that this will be a part of his legacy which is what this thread is about. And I have said repeatedly that Obama alone cannot be blamed for this result, just as Bush cannot be solely blamed for Iraq. But I do stand by my belief that Obama used race as a wedge issue to help him gain politically, and it worked for him in 2008 and 2012.

So, let me ask this.

 

Back in 2008 when he was elected, during and after the election, I started hearing jokes and seeing on social media extremely racist stuff from people who opposed him as President. This has not stopped. I have seen very immature and disrespectful racial stuff about the first lady also. This isn't just from a few Neanderthals. These have carried on through the past 8 years from people who are staunch Republican voters and people I would never have guessed would contribute to this.

 

So.......I guess maybe he has been the cause of a lot of the racial tensions over the last 8 years.....but, one heck of a lot of that is simply because he and his wife are black and I personally hold people who have contributed to this as Republican voters responsible i a major way for the racial tensions because obviously, they just couldn't handle the thought of a black president.

 

Am I supposed to just ignore the fact that one heck of a lot of people who voted against Obama the last 8 years constantly pass around and perpetuate these racial jokes and comments?

Hmm... I am a bit surprised to see you using anecdotal social media posts to suggest that is a reason for the decline, especially when the gallup data I provided showed that the longstanding stability of race relations was steady through his first term which completely underscores your argument.

 

There is so much hate in social media on both sides that I dont think it encompasses both parties. I have seen plenty of hate filled comments by the left the past month about Trump and his family, including racist comments about whites that aligns with Van Jones "whitelash" rhetoric.

 

 

Whataboutism is a propaganda technique used by the Soviet Union during the Cold War to deflect criticism.

[zoogs]

That's a great term! "Tu quoque", that's one for the fallacies thread.

 

Hasn't lost its power after all these years.

[BigRedBuster]

 

 

 

 

 

Obama's legacy? Perhaps it has been clearly described by other comments on this board but I have not read every single statement or opinion thereon. But:

 

Obama himself summed up one major consequence of his Presidency just in the last few days when he said "America is becoming a 'browner' nation" suggesting that with the mass influx of Mexicans and other latinos, the color tone of the skin has gotten darker. Not something to really hang one's hat on as far as major accomplishments of a positive nature. Mexicans and the vast majority of foreigners entering the United States over the last 230 years or so of its history have been quite positive contributors to our society. The problem is there are simply 15 or 20 million too many! We don't have room economically, socially, politically and culturally to absorb and assimilate into our unique American culture. Being American is different than being African American or Mexican American or even Irish American. We permit immigration because of NEED and not for any other reason. America is not a great big social 'experiment' or something to be tampered with in a reckless way

 

Historically America has seen substantial immigration (nearly 100% of which was done legally through the established naturalization procedures in an orderly and limited and controlled manner btw) of groups from various places around the world. In large numbers, problems almost always arose and social and political and cultural and even legal consequences followed. However, nearly all those who came in the past, did so for the very purpose of becoming Americans and to live the American dream. They did not come to live the "Mexican American" or the "Irish American" or the Chinese American dream. They came to BECOME Americans with all the rights, virtues, benefits and responsibilities and advantages thereof.

 

I trace the beginnings of the destabilization of American society and culture to the concoction of the terms "multiculturalism" and the deliberate attempts to seperate and divide Americans into racial and ethic groups and to pit them against one another for political purposes. To drive political wedges in between racial and ethic and cultural 'groups' is to sew the seeds of disintegration and destruction of American society and ultimately to tear us apart as 'one Nation'. We are the "United States of America" and that name means a great deal more than just a convenient name for our country. The Constitution was written carefully in order to create a bond or 'union' of the several states for the common defense and to ensure domestic tranquility.

 

In many ways, Obama's legacy has been to create fractures and division and to de-unify and disintegrate our culture. This is very dangerous to the health, welfare, safety and security of us all. Whether Obama intended this as his legacy (about half of our voting population believes so) or not, it is in fact a big part of whatever legacy he leaves to future Americans to wrestle with. Hopefully, the bonds that have kept this nation together will be repaired and restored soon. Lord knows we can't stand much more division and political hate between liberals and conservatives. If Californians vote to leave the union, I would say let them go. In fact, maybe Trump can simply sell California back to Mexico to fund the wall and then add a thousand or so miles if needed. LOL

Well said 84, especially the part in bold. He has sought to create divisions in this country for his own political gains, and hence we are now more divided than ever, and this was well before the 2016 election got started.

Absolutely delusional... You're going to ignore over 200 years of institutional racism and place the blame on the last 8 years? Did we forget about black sentiments after Katrina? How about after OJ? Rodney King? What about Koreans and black fighting each other during the LA riots? How about how we treated "Muslims", Indians, Mexicans, and any other brown man after 9/11? The Japanese and Germans during WWII? Irish Catholic immigrants and Asian immigrants around the 20th century. Do I even need to mention slavery? Or what about the one nobody wants to talk about. How we continue to treat the people who first called this land home. Native Americans.

 

You want to say that this country, which is infact a melting pot of many peoples from across the world living together, and has been called "The Grand Experiment" by one of its founding fathers (hint: we are actually a social experiment, of democracy and liberty!), has somehow been destabilized and damaged because one of its presidents was willing to acknowledge and bring to light its faults? Not for political gain, but for discourse and progress. That, somehow makes us more divided despite our 240 years of division? Give me a break...

You can make whatever excuses you want on this topic. Nobody is stating that racial tensions suddenly began under Obama, so you are grossly off topic in using this as rationale to deny the evidence that racial tensions have deepened under Obamas tenure, and that this will be a part of his legacy which is what this thread is about. And I have said repeatedly that Obama alone cannot be blamed for this result, just as Bush cannot be solely blamed for Iraq. But I do stand by my belief that Obama used race as a wedge issue to help him gain politically, and it worked for him in 2008 and 2012.

So, let me ask this.

 

Back in 2008 when he was elected, during and after the election, I started hearing jokes and seeing on social media extremely racist stuff from people who opposed him as President. This has not stopped. I have seen very immature and disrespectful racial stuff about the first lady also. This isn't just from a few Neanderthals. These have carried on through the past 8 years from people who are staunch Republican voters and people I would never have guessed would contribute to this.

 

So.......I guess maybe he has been the cause of a lot of the racial tensions over the last 8 years.....but, one heck of a lot of that is simply because he and his wife are black and I personally hold people who have contributed to this as Republican voters responsible i a major way for the racial tensions because obviously, they just couldn't handle the thought of a black president.

 

Am I supposed to just ignore the fact that one heck of a lot of people who voted against Obama the last 8 years constantly pass around and perpetuate these racial jokes and comments?

Hmm... I am a bit surprised to see you using anecdotal social media posts to suggest that is a reason for the decline, especially when the gallup data I provided showed that the longstanding stability of race relations was steady through his first term which completely underscores your argument.

 

There is so much hate in social media on both sides that I dont think it encompasses both parties. I have seen plenty of hate filled comments by the left the past month about Trump and his family, including racist comments about whites that aligns with Van Jones "whitelash" rhetoric.

 

My point is, racism came out of the shadows when a black man actually ran for office and won. That racism was open to the public all through his first term and has never stopped. A few things happened within the black community and policing (right or wrong) which caused black people to protest what was going on.

 

White people then turn around and look at the black President and say..."AH HA.....YOU caused this."

 

So....white people are fine with chuckling and laughing while passing around racist jokes and commentary around the internet. But....gosh darnit.....it's just going too far if black people actually protest what they see is happening within their community.....BLAME THE BLACK GUY AT THE TOP!!!! Why should we look at ourselves as part of the problem....those jokes and comments were funny.

[zoogs]

Great point. And if race relations in a country would have been better off had that first black president not been elected just yet -- I don't doubt that this is true -- then that's a fairly strong indicator of a country where racism is alive and well.

[84HuskerLaw]

 

 

Obama's legacy? Perhaps it has been clearly described by other comments on this board but I have not read every single statement or opinion thereon. But:

 

Obama himself summed up one major consequence of his Presidency just in the last few days when he said "America is becoming a 'browner' nation" suggesting that with the mass influx of Mexicans and other latinos, the color tone of the skin has gotten darker. Not something to really hang one's hat on as far as major accomplishments of a positive nature. Mexicans and the vast majority of foreigners entering the United States over the last 230 years or so of its history have been quite positive contributors to our society. The problem is there are simply 15 or 20 million too many! We don't have room economically, socially, politically and culturally to absorb and assimilate into our unique American culture. Being American is different than being African American or Mexican American or even Irish American. We permit immigration because of NEED and not for any other reason. America is not a great big social 'experiment' or something to be tampered with in a reckless way

 

Historically America has seen substantial immigration (nearly 100% of which was done legally through the established naturalization procedures in an orderly and limited and controlled manner btw) of groups from various places around the world. In large numbers, problems almost always arose and social and political and cultural and even legal consequences followed. However, nearly all those who came in the past, did so for the very purpose of becoming Americans and to live the American dream. They did not come to live the "Mexican American" or the "Irish American" or the Chinese American dream. They came to BECOME Americans with all the rights, virtues, benefits and responsibilities and advantages thereof.

 

I trace the beginnings of the destabilization of American society and culture to the concoction of the terms "multiculturalism" and the deliberate attempts to seperate and divide Americans into racial and ethic groups and to pit them against one another for political purposes. To drive political wedges in between racial and ethic and cultural 'groups' is to sew the seeds of disintegration and destruction of American society and ultimately to tear us apart as 'one Nation'. We are the "United States of America" and that name means a great deal more than just a convenient name for our country. The Constitution was written carefully in order to create a bond or 'union' of the several states for the common defense and to ensure domestic tranquility.

 

In many ways, Obama's legacy has been to create fractures and division and to de-unify and disintegrate our culture. This is very dangerous to the health, welfare, safety and security of us all. Whether Obama intended this as his legacy (about half of our voting population believes so) or not, it is in fact a big part of whatever legacy he leaves to future Americans to wrestle with. Hopefully, the bonds that have kept this nation together will be repaired and restored soon. Lord knows we can't stand much more division and political hate between liberals and conservatives. If Californians vote to leave the union, I would say let them go. In fact, maybe Trump can simply sell California back to Mexico to fund the wall and then add a thousand or so miles if needed. LOL

Well said 84, especially the part in bold. He has sought to create divisions in this country for his own political gains, and hence we are now more divided than ever, and this was well before the 2016 election got started.

Gee, who else could we apply this description to?

 

Good question. Who? Certainly not conservatives. Just the opposite. Conservatives decry this divisions and segregation. Divdie and conquer is the modus operandi of the Dems and at the very core of the social/communist manifestos which form the spiritual and philosophical foundation of liberalism in general.

 

It is sad that Obama was the first Black person elected to the Presidency rather than one of the many millions who truly love America and want to patriotically lead us to a better future for ALL. It is not just Black Lives that matter but American lives that matter most. America has been the world's leader in making the world a better place for everyone to live and live better, until the Obama years. It is truly hard to identify any place on the planet that has been made better as a result of Obama's Presidency. Certainly not in the United States where there has been unquestionably a decline in the standard of living for the great majority of people with huge increases in poverty and declines in household incomes in nominal terms. When adjusted for real economic inflation, household living standards have declined dramatically. If the nation had paid down on the national debt, one could atleast somewhat understand the 'pain' suffered by most people during this time but frankly the debt has skyrocketed up despite deep cuts in military and other national government obligations (those obligations first and foremost the responsibility of the Federal government). In simple terms we have borrowed 10 trillion dollars in just 8 years and really have nothing to show for it but a population of poorer people that are getting older and many have lost decades of life savings in the process. Not a legacy to be proud of in my book

[Moiraine]

When someone is so over-the-top batsh#t crazy/wrong in the complete opposite direction of reality I don't put them on ignore because it just becomes pure entertainment.