Immigration Ban

[GM_Tood]

12 hours ago, Clifford Franklin said:

 

How do you think Syria keeps track of their own citizens?

 

Suggesting that they have no system in place whatsoever seems unfathomable. Do you have anything that explains how little identifying information is available and why it is such a problem?

From 2015 but gives an explanation. I could not find any recent article that states there is now an accurate database that contains Syrian nationals information that would be used in the vetting process.  

 

https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/no-databases-exist-to-vet-syrian-refugees/

 

Under grilling from GOP Sen. Jeff Sessions, head of the Senate subcommittee on immigration, the Homeland Security official in charge of vetting Syrian and other foreign Muslim refugees confessed that no police or intelligence databases exist to check the backgrounds of incoming refugees against criminal and terrorist records.

 

"Does Syria have any?" Sessions asked. "The government does not, no sir," answered Matthew Emrich, associate director for fraud detection and national security at DHS' U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services.

Sessions further inquired: "You don't have their criminal records, you don't have the computer database that you can check?" Confessed Emrich: "In many countries the U.S. accepts refugees from, the country did not have extensive data holdings."

While a startling admission, it confirms previous reporting. Senior FBI officials recently testified that they have no idea who these people are, and they can't find out what type of backgrounds they have — criminal, terrorist or otherwise — because there are no vetting opportunities in those war-torn countries.

 

Syria and Iraq, along with Somalia and Sudan, are failed states where police records aren't even kept. Agents can't vet somebody if they don't have documentation and don't even have the criminal databases to screen applicants.

[knapplc]

America can send a man to the moon, but this administration and the right-wingers would have us believe that we can't possibly allow refugees into our country & keep them safe but confined while this crisis sorts itself out. 

 

So much for believing that America is the greatest country in the world.

[BigRedBuster]

Interesting Op-Ed piece.  It's an Op-Ed piece.  But, it does have some interesting tidbits.

 

Quote

 

Why then dispatch the National Guard?

President Trump is not the first to do so. Both Presidents Bush and Obama dispatched National Guard Units to the border. Under Bush, the Guard was deployed from 2006 to 2008 under Operation Jump Start. Obama sent the National Guard in 2010 during Operation Phalanx. In each case, the Guard was intended to supplement Border Patrol personnel while new recruits were added to increase border protection capability. Trump's initiative can be seen in a similar light.

The intention to deploy the Guard is best understood as symbolic. Both Presidents Bush and Obama deployed the Guard to the border in a run-up to a difficult midterm elections. President Bush's Operation Jump Start began in May 2006, five months before the midterm elections which saw the Democrats retake the House, the Senate and a majority of the governorships from the Republican Party.

 

 

 

I found these two graphs interesting.

 

 

 

Look at what has happened to marijuana smuggling since legalization started in some states in 2014.

Edited April 9, 2018 by BigRedBuster

[ZRod]

32 minutes ago, GM_Tood said:

From 2015 but gives an explanation. I could not find any recent article that states there is now an accurate database that contains Syrian nationals information that would be used in the vetting process.  

 

https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/no-databases-exist-to-vet-syrian-refugees/

 

Under grilling from GOP Sen. Jeff Sessions, head of the Senate subcommittee on immigration, the Homeland Security official in charge of vetting Syrian and other foreign Muslim refugees confessed that no police or intelligence databases exist to check the backgrounds of incoming refugees against criminal and terrorist records.

 

"Does Syria have any?" Sessions asked. "The government does not, no sir," answered Matthew Emrich, associate director for fraud detection and national security at DHS' U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services.

Sessions further inquired: "You don't have their criminal records, you don't have the computer database that you can check?" Confessed Emrich: "In many countries the U.S. accepts refugees from, the country did not have extensive data holdings."

While a startling admission, it confirms previous reporting. Senior FBI officials recently testified that they have no idea who these people are, and they can't find out what type of backgrounds they have — criminal, terrorist or otherwise — because there are no vetting opportunities in those war-torn countries.

 

Syria and Iraq, along with Somalia and Sudan, are failed states where police records aren't even kept. Agents can't vet somebody if they don't have documentation and don't even have the criminal databases to screen applicants.

How many refugees have committed a terrorist act in the US since 9/11?

[GM_Tood]

2 hours ago, ZRod said:

How many refugees have committed a terrorist act in the US since 9/11?

The answer is zero.

 

  

[ZRod]

5 minutes ago, GM_Tood said:

The answer is zero.

 

  

So, what's currently being done seems to be working? And officials say they are constantly refinning the process, so it should be improving. Granted they only have to be wrong once...

[BigRedBuster]

Didn't Trump say he only needed like 90 days to review and fix anything needed with the process?

[ZRod]

28 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

Didn't Trump say he only needed like 90 days to review and fix anything needed with the process?

And 90 days during the court suspension were critical because of a current threat or something...

[Ric Flair]

21 hours ago, Clifford Franklin said:

 

How do you think Syria keeps track of their own citizens?

 

Suggesting that they have no system in place whatsoever seems unfathomable. Do you have anything that explains how little identifying information is available and why it is such a problem?

 

They struggle with it as well. Syria is a failed state in the midst of a civil war. Hiw do you suppose we confirm an alleged Syrian’s identity? Call Assad’s thugs and ask?

9 hours ago, knapplc said:

America can send a man to the moon, but this administration and the right-wingers would have us believe that we can't possibly allow refugees into our country & keep them safe but confined while this crisis sorts itself out. 

 

So much for believing that America is the greatest country in the world.

 

Why not set up a no-fly zone there and establish UN camps? Why is it necessary to bring them here?

[Landlord]

22 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

Let’s say we’re screening a purported refugee who claims to be from Syria. He says his name is Abdul. He claims to be from Damascus, a good guy, fleeing the Assad forces, and who loves America. How do you suppose we go about checking that out to make sure any of it is true? Do you think we call the DMV in Damascus and ask? Or just place a direct call to Assad’s goons to check it out? 

 

 

If Abdul can't prove any of those claims, he doesn't make it through the vetting process, the way that 99% of refugees don't make it through. 

 

DUH. 

 

Good grief.

 

[Ric Flair]

33 minutes ago, Landlord said:

 

 

If Abdul can't prove any of those claims, he doesn't make it through the vetting process, the way that 99% of refugees don't make it through. 

 

DUH. 

 

Good grief.

 

 

Uh yeah. Read the articles I’ve posted again that quote experts talking about what a joke the vetting process is. It’s really not that complicated. Those who want to admit everyone are just in complete denial about the security tradeoffs involved in admitting a bunch of strangers whose identies we can’t verify and whose motives can’t reliably be ascertained.

[ZRod]

7 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

 

Uh yeah. Read the articles I’ve posted again that quote experts talking about what a joke the vetting process is. It’s really not that complicated. Those who want to admit everyone are just in complete denial about the security tradeoffs involved in admitting a bunch of strangers whose identies we can’t verify and whose motives can’t reliably be ascertained.

Literally no one is saying that we should admit everyone. How many of these refugees have committed a terrorist act in the US since 9/11????

Edited April 10, 2018 by ZRod

[Ric Flair]

15 hours ago, ZRod said:

Literally no one is saying that we should admit everyone. How many of these refugees have committed a terrorist act in the US since 9/11????

 

There are absolutely those saying we should admit anyone who wants to come. That’s the end result of the open/no borders crowd. 

 

The simple truth is that we can’t take everyone and have to make decisions about who we allow to come and who we don’t. We also have to balance our desire to help those in need with our responsibility to protect ourselves from those who would do us harm...and who might pretend to be refugees to do so.

[Landlord]

1 hour ago, Ric Flair said:

The simple truth is that we can’t take everyone and have to make decisions about who we allow to come and who we don’t. 

 

 

Thus far, since 9/11, we've been 99.9% accurate in our decisions about who we allow to come and who we don't.

 

So what's the problem? 

[Moiraine]

9 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

 

There are absolutely those saying we should admit anyone who wants to come. That’s the end result of the open/no borders crowd. 

 

The simple truth is that we can’t take everyone and have to make decisions about who we allow to come and who we don’t. We also have to balance our desire to help those in need with our responsibility to protect ourselves from those who would do us harm...and who might pretend to be refugees to do so.

 

 

 

Oh.  Are we taking everyone?