What would make people feel less ostracized from P&R?

[knapplc]

 

 

 

 

 

 

I do...I simply don't have faith in some of the mods that ban and suspend.

You feel unsafe at HuskerBoard?

 

I do at times feel like I might be cyber kicked.

 

If you're afraid you may be banned, why stay?

 

Because you guys need me!

 

I'm glad we got an answer to this thread. It just took a little logic, is all.

 

That thread exposed more than any other thread ever.

 

Thank goodness the Mods cleaned that up. Nobody wants to be mooned by BRB.

[teachercd]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I do...I simply don't have faith in some of the mods that ban and suspend.

You feel unsafe at HuskerBoard?

 

I do at times feel like I might be cyber kicked.

 

If you're afraid you may be banned, why stay?

 

Because you guys need me!

 

I'm glad we got an answer to this thread. It just took a little logic, is all.

 

That thread exposed more than any other thread ever.

 

Thank goodness the Mods cleaned that up. Nobody wants to be mooned by BRB.

 

Could you imagine some of the horrible butts!

[Enhance]

I want to comment on 'whiny'. This is the specific, and often warned about danger of a Trump presidency that is patently abnormal on every level.

I should clarify that, at least in my opinion, there's a difference between being whiny and regularly calling attention to serious issues.

 

From my perspective, I think many left-leaning people and liberals have been doing more of the former i.e. being whiny about relatively minuscule contrivances in the face of real, pertinent matters.

[Landlord]

 

I want to comment on 'whiny'. This is the specific, and often warned about danger of a Trump presidency that is patently abnormal on every level.

I should clarify that, at least in my opinion, there's a difference between being whiny and regularly calling attention to serious issues.

 

From my perspective, I think many left-leaning people and liberals have been doing more of the former i.e. being whiny about relatively minuscule contrivances in the face of real, pertinent matters.

 

 

 

Could you provide examples of this? Either specifically from HB members or just in general, but the former would be more helpful.

[teachercd]

The problem with examples of "whiny" is that it is different for everyone. I can name the posters and posts I think are whiny but others might say they are passionate.

[Enhance]

 

 

I want to comment on 'whiny'. This is the specific, and often warned about danger of a Trump presidency that is patently abnormal on every level.

I should clarify that, at least in my opinion, there's a difference between being whiny and regularly calling attention to serious issues.

 

From my perspective, I think many left-leaning people and liberals have been doing more of the former i.e. being whiny about relatively minuscule contrivances in the face of real, pertinent matters.

 

 

 

Could you provide examples of this? Either specifically from HB members or just in general, but the former would be more helpful.

Most of my examples come from social media and I don't want to put those people on blast here just to prove a point. Teach brings up a good point, too - what's whiny to some may not be whiny to you.

 

I'm just saying I think that this is a commonly held conception of liberals and left-leaning people right now because of the manner in which some address their complaints. It's pretty common fodder around much of my family (many of whom are Republican) and some of my friend circles.

[JJ Husker]

 

Knapp, I know your not directing your comment specifically towards me, but for 84 and Bnls comments were theirs alone and there were more than enough posters who lambasted them for their views. Those I speak of did not side one way or the other, they simply have an opinion they feel should be heard. Heck, we have a mod who sees the issue to which I speak, you have JJ and Teach cringing at trying to share an honest opinion and neither of them would be considered supporters of DT.

Nobody is stopping them from voicing their opinions. They are crying because people show, through facts, that what they're saying is wrong. They don't want to have a conversation, they want to be agreed with and told that their opinions are correct.

 

This is not a safe space for people who only want to listen to their echo chamber opinions. If that's what they want, they need to go somewhere else. This is a healthy place of good conversation, where opinions are challenged by sharp people.

 

I can handle being told I'm wrong, being shown I'm wrong. It's one of the best parts of this forum. In just the past ten days I've been shown, through solid arguments & sourced material, that opinions I've held are either factually incorrect or outright wrong. Should I complain that I'm being oppressed? Nope. I learned from it and thanked the guy who showed me - even encouraged him to post more.

 

If people aren't capable of handling that, that's their problem, not this forum's.

 

I dragged this over from the Immigration Ban topic so as not to clutter it up over there.

 

I'm glad you can handle being told you're wrong cuz here comes a healthy dose of it.

 

I haven't claimed anyone is stopping me from voicing my opinion.

I haven't been crying about anything. I was simply fed up with some of the discussion and I really have nothing worthwhile to add or any impetus to do so.

I don't recall being shown I was "wrong" but I have changed my mind/opinion about a few things which I have openly admitted to.

When I do participate, I most surely want to have a conversation. Can you provide proof of your claim that "they want to be agreed with and told that their opinions are correct"?

 

I agree that this is generally a place of healthy conversation. But, it also can be a place where people can post a simple opinion or statement and 2 or 3 others will jump on it, twist and contort it, and then wrongly restate what it must really mean. Sorry, but too much of that can get old real fast. If you fail to perceive that view of things, it is only because possibly you agree with the people doing it and want to see it that way. As an example, if a person says it makes sense to review vetting procedures and possibly that could reveal a way to make them better, it really could be just that simple. Logic dictates that is a truthful statement and it doesn't require debunking through showing how safe we have been or repeatedly posting the vetting procedures we are currently using. Plus, it doesn't mean that person supports the ban or Trump or that they must think all Muslims are a problem. But that is exactly what was happening in that thread. Sorry but it can get rather tiresome trying to participate in a conversation like that when so much time and effort has to be put into to explaining how the way some people chose to interpret a simple statement is just plain wrong.

I'm sure most people thought our airline security could not be improved upon prior to 911 just like many now seem to think there is not one thing we could possibly do to improve our vetting of immigrants or refugees. Sure, it's a valid point that since we have not had any serious problems that what is currently going on is excessive but that is why I changed my mind about the ban being a good idea. Since the vetting procedures seem to be doing a good job, I'm now of the opinion that simply reviewing them without instituting the ban would be a better way to go. I also assumed, wrongly apparently, that when the ban was introduced that measures would be taken to prevent some of the problems we've seen with legitimate US citizens being detained or delayed. I never once considered that US student traveling overseas to visit family might be prevented re-entry to the country. All these things played a role in me changing my mind. It really had nothing to do with being shown I was "wrong" or desiring a safe place where my opinions would be validated.

 

So, in a nutshell, the post of yours' I just replied to is 98% bullsh#t.

I'm glad we got that cleared up.

[teachercd]

Bravo!

[RedRedJarvisRedwine]

People who are feeling ostracized just have their heads in the sand.

[knapplc]

 

 

Knapp, I know your not directing your comment specifically towards me, but for 84 and Bnls comments were theirs alone and there were more than enough posters who lambasted them for their views. Those I speak of did not side one way or the other, they simply have an opinion they feel should be heard. Heck, we have a mod who sees the issue to which I speak, you have JJ and Teach cringing at trying to share an honest opinion and neither of them would be considered supporters of DT.

Nobody is stopping them from voicing their opinions. They are crying because people show, through facts, that what they're saying is wrong. They don't want to have a conversation, they want to be agreed with and told that their opinions are correct.

 

This is not a safe space for people who only want to listen to their echo chamber opinions. If that's what they want, they need to go somewhere else. This is a healthy place of good conversation, where opinions are challenged by sharp people.

 

I can handle being told I'm wrong, being shown I'm wrong. It's one of the best parts of this forum. In just the past ten days I've been shown, through solid arguments & sourced material, that opinions I've held are either factually incorrect or outright wrong. Should I complain that I'm being oppressed? Nope. I learned from it and thanked the guy who showed me - even encouraged him to post more.

 

If people aren't capable of handling that, that's their problem, not this forum's.

 

I dragged this over from the Immigration Ban topic so as not to clutter it up over there.

 

I'm glad you can handle being told you're wrong cuz here comes a healthy dose of it.

 

I haven't claimed anyone is stopping me from voicing my opinion.

I haven't been crying about anything. I was simply fed up with some of the discussion and I really have nothing worthwhile to add or any impetus to do so.

I don't recall being shown I was "wrong" but I have changed my mind/opinion about a few things which I have openly admitted to.

When I do participate, I most surely want to have a conversation. Can you provide proof of your claim that "they want to be agreed with and told that their opinions are correct"?

 

I agree that this is generally a place of healthy conversation. But, it also can be a place where people can post a simple opinion or statement and 2 or 3 others will jump on it, twist and contort it, and then wrongly restate what it must really mean. Sorry, but too much of that can get old real fast. If you fail to perceive that view of things, it is only because possibly you agree with the people doing it and want to see it that way. As an example, if a person says it makes sense to review vetting procedures and possibly that could reveal a way to make them better, it really could be just that simple. Logic dictates that is a truthful statement and it doesn't require debunking through showing how safe we have been or repeatedly posting the vetting procedures we are currently using. Plus, it doesn't mean that person supports the ban or Trump or that they must think all Muslims are a problem. But that is exactly what was happening in that thread. Sorry but it can get rather tiresome trying to participate in a conversation like that when so much time and effort has to be put into to explaining how the way some people chose to interpret a simple statement is just plain wrong.

I'm sure most people thought our airline security could not be improved upon prior to 911 just like many now seem to think there is not one thing we could possibly do to improve our vetting of immigrants or refugees. Sure, it's a valid point that since we have not had any serious problems that what is currently going on is excessive but that is why I changed my mind about the ban being a good idea. Since the vetting procedures seem to be doing a good job, I'm now of the opinion that simply reviewing them without instituting the ban would be a better way to go. I also assumed, wrongly apparently, that when the ban was introduced that measures would be taken to prevent some of the problems we've seen with legitimate US citizens being detained or delayed. I never once considered that US student traveling overseas to visit family might be prevented re-entry to the country. All these things played a role in me changing my mind. It really had nothing to do with being shown I was "wrong" or desiring a safe place where my opinions would be validated.

 

So, in a nutshell, the post of yours' I just replied to is 98% bullsh#t.

I'm glad we got that cleared up.

 

 

I absolutely can handle you thinking I'm wrong. I also don't have a problem poking holes in your logic.

 

To the bold - TAKODA said that you were "cringing at trying to share an honest opinion." I didn't say YOU said anyone was stopping you. But the other bold statement sure seems to indicate you feel discouraged. If you have a concern about your name being dragged into this, respond to TAKODA, not me.

 

You think I twist what you're saying? So do you. It's a matter of opinion. You let that "get old real fast," that's not my fault.

 

What do you mean when you say "2 or 3 others will jump on it" regarding their opinion? Are you referring to fact-checking, which seems to be at the center of this argument? Isn't that what people really are upset about? They don't want their opinion shown to be baseless, as in the argument over vetting procedures? We have a stringent vetting process, but over and over and over the argument comes up that we have to shut down immigration to recheck the vetting process. THAT is bullsh#t, JJ. You do not shut down an entire plant that operates at 99% efficiency to check one process. If you have a problem with that kind of fact-checking, that's on you.

 

You can drop your mic all you want. All this amounts to is proving my point, the bold/underlined in my post above.

 

 

Bravo!

 

It's nice to see JJ helping you get over your fear of too many words.

[BIGREDIOWAN]

 

 

I think the conservative posters on this board would feel less excluded if they just admitted that they were wrong about Trump. Admit that the man is crazy, and has absolutely no clue how to run a government, or manage equal egos around the globe. I consider myself an Independent, with a slight conservative lean (Voted for Obama both terms, however). As a Republican, you can say that Trump may stand for your party, but he doesn't stand for you personally. Denouncing Trump isn't to side with the left, it's to side with America, at this point.

At this point, I think a lot of Trump "supporters" prefer to give everyone the double-bird and spout off on how great things are, just because "their team won".

 

 

Their ignorance is astounding, really. A lack of success in life because of racism, or "systematic equality" isn't something I put a lot of stock into (I think circumstances that some African-Americans find themselves in are as much an indictment on their culture, as anything else), BUT, I have no doubt that Trump's election, and his supporter's reaction to his candidacy, are a response to having a black President these past 8 years.... If McCain would of been our President these last 8 years you wouldn't have seen the rise of Trump.

 

Here's a few examples right here in this thread. Understanding and listening needs to be a two way street. It's not just those of us who may be considered right leaning that are the ones that need to listen. I'm gathering that's the thought process from what I'm reading in these topics. Of course I should probably cite a few scientific studies on the matter rather than just talking about it to prove my point I suppose.

 

I suppose I'm considered uninformed and I've personally admitted that before, but it's not because I don't care, it's because I'm simply not going to take the time to make sure everyone knows I'm right by posting link to article after article to get my point across. It's countered with a link to article after article telling me I'm wrong by 3 or 4 or 5 different folks since I might not follow the popular opinion at the time.

 

And knapp your continued veiled attacks that you must assume is you being sly and skirting the rules aren't going unnoticed either. Be a man and just say my name and get it over with. Of course that may be considered a personal attack and we can't have that. But you have a knack for just sliding that stuff in to different threads from time-to-time hoping they go unnoticed while your posse of followers +1's your fun.

 

That sounds an awful lot like you're implying that people should take responsibility for the votes they cast, Moiraine, and we all know what a shipstorm that causes when you imply that.

 

 

Tell me about it.

 

Of course Cdog923 then had to make sure he was included shortly after blaming me personally for some of these things. Don't think because I voted for someone I'm going to agree with everything they've done. You folks try and push that because that's what you think and argue circles without listening to the other side of the argument.

 

Folks can take this as a personal attack if they'd like or they can look at it for what it is.......part of what's wrong with this part of the board. You want discussion yet you folks jump on someone who has a different opinion than you and then proceed to pile it on and pile it on while feeding off of one another. It's rather sad to see if I'm being honest because it doesn't promote good discussion when it's not going both ways.

[BIGREDIOWAN]

People who are feeling ostracized just have their heads in the sand.

Or maybe they just decide it's not worth it and give up?

[knapplc]

And knapp your continued veiled attacks that you must assume is you being sly and skirting the rules aren't going unnoticed either. Be a man and just say my name and get it over with. Of course that may be considered a personal attack and we can't have that. But you have a knack for just sliding that stuff in to different threads from time-to-time hoping they go unnoticed while your posse of followers +1's your fun.

 

 

I have ZERO problem calling you out by name when it's part of the conversation, BRI. None. I'm not breaking a single rule in anything I post. NOTHING I have posted refers to you. If you think so, that's on you.

 

Frankly, I don't think about you or your opinions when I post this stuff.

[RedRedJarvisRedwine]

 

People who are feeling ostracized just have their heads in the sand.

 

Or maybe they just decide it's not worth it and give up?

Yeeeeeeaaaaaaaahhhhh, mines just a play on the word ostracize. Nothing more, nothing less.

[Moiraine]

The funniest thing about all this is Carlfense isn't even here anymore.