Proposed New Rule: Fair Catch on Kickoffs - Ball at the 25

[Scarlet Overkill]

13 hours ago, JimmyBuckets said:

Pretty entertaining video on kickoffs

 

 

Very interesting video, now that i've had time to watch.  I'll have to trust what he's saying b/c I am not going to go and validate any of his data.  

[Red Five]

Football need to do something to adapt.  There will be more rules like this moving forward to try to "fix" the game. 

 

Numbers are dwindling at the youth level.  I was talking to a guy on the board of my local youth football association.  He said the number of kids playing are about 2/3 of what it was 5 years ago, and continues to drop.  The way they have been operating in the past was flag football in 2nd/3rd grades, the tackle in 4th-6th.  He is 90% sure this coming year they will be eliminating tackle for 4th graders and switching to flag (trying to keep number up, because there is a severe drop in participation once it becomes tackle).  And he said he wouldn't be surprised to see tackle completely gone (all moved to flag or 7 on 7) at the grade school level in the next couple years.

[Moiraine]

1 hour ago, dvdcrr said:

It only needs to change if participation is compulsory.

 

 

That argument might be good if we weren't talking about people aged 14-23.

 

And I don't care that 18 is considered an adult. I definitely wasn't mature at 18. These are essentially kids. They're making a decision that could lead to them later dying at a young age due to brain damage but kids aren't really known for thinking 20-30 years in advance.

 

Most things that have a fair chance of leading to death in one's 40s or 50s have legal age limits or are illegal altogether.

Edited April 14, 2018 by Moiraine

[Moiraine]

30 minutes ago, Red Five said:

Football need to do something to adapt.  There will be more rules like this moving forward to try to "fix" the game. 

 

Numbers are dwindling at the youth level.  I was talking to a guy on the board of my local youth football association.  He said the number of kids playing are about 2/3 of what it was 5 years ago, and continues to drop.  The way they have been operating in the past was flag football in 2nd/3rd grades, the tackle in 4th-6th.  He is 90% sure this coming year they will be eliminating tackle for 4th graders and switching to flag (trying to keep number up, because there is a severe drop in participation once it becomes tackle).  And he said he wouldn't be surprised to see tackle completely gone (all moved to flag or 7 on 7) at the grade school level in the next couple years.

 

 

I really think that should happen. It just seems logical that hits to the head area would be even worse for a developing brain. Have them start in 7th grade. 

[dvdcrr]

1 minute ago, Moiraine said:

 

 

That argument might be good if we weren't talking about people aged 14-23.

 

And I don't care that 18 is considered an adult. I definitely wasn't mature at 18. These are essentially kids. They're making a decision that could lead to them later dying at a young age due to brain damage but kids aren't really known for thinking 20-30 years in advance.

That's fair

[dvdcrr]

44 minutes ago, HS_Coach_C said:

What I mean is it needs to keep changing in terms of eliminating hits to the head, through better coaching and rule changes like targeting. If you have no problem seeing guys with multiple concussions being affected for the rest of their lives, I don't know what to say.

Right?  Well nobody wants a bunch of drooling driveling invalids walking around...  But there is also this notion of a free country, that all the good things should not be legislated away.  America has become a nation of entitlements.  The NFL players say they are entitled to a lifetime of full compensation from a league that they themselves chose to join.  

"You pays your money you takes your chances."

Or go work at the lumberyard or at the hospital, law office etc...

[HS_Coach_C]

11 minutes ago, Red Five said:

Football need to do something to adapt.  There will be more rules like this moving forward to try to "fix" the game. 

 

Numbers are dwindling at the youth level.  I was talking to a guy on the board of my local youth football association.  He said the number of kids playing are about 2/3 of what it was 5 years ago, and continues to drop.  The way they have been operating in the past was flag football in 2nd/3rd grades, the tackle in 4th-6th.  He is 90% sure this coming year they will be eliminating tackle for 4th graders and switching to flag (trying to keep number up, because there is a severe drop in participation once it becomes tackle).  And he said he wouldn't be surprised to see tackle completely gone (all moved to flag or 7 on 7) at the grade school level in the next couple years.

 

I know a lot of people don't like hearing things like this, but personally I think it is the best thing for the game and these kids. While they are still developing and getting better with hand-eye coordination, let them learn the non contact side of the sport. They can still learn to tackle once they are more coordinated and more developed.

[HS_Coach_C]

43 minutes ago, dvdcrr said:

Right?  Well nobody wants a bunch of drooling driveling invalids walking around...  But there is also this notion of a free country, that all the good things should not be legislated away.  America has become a nation of entitlements.  The NFL players say they are entitled to a lifetime of full compensation from a league that they themselves chose to join.  

"You pays your money you takes your chances."

Or go work at the lumberyard or at the hospital, law office etc...

I'm not saying make football illegal...

I'm saying adapt it to make it safer. I'm completely against eliminating tackle football altogether.

It's not that different than a seatbelt law. It doesn't hurt you to follow it and it can have major consequences if you don't.

[dvdcrr]

1 hour ago, HS_Coach_C said:

I'm not saying make football illegal...

I'm saying adapt it to make it safer. I'm completely against eliminating tackle football altogether.

It's not that different than a seatbelt law. It doesn't hurt you to follow it and it can have major consequences if you don't.

Right, and I am with New Hampshire on that one.  It is not the role of the government in a free society to require optimal behavior.

[The Dude]

I agree consenting adults should be free to do whatever they please, so long as it's not interfering with the rights of others.  Where it gets tricky is children who can't consent bashing each others brains in. 

[Landlord]

18 hours ago, dvdcrr said:

I don't know why they dont just go get a copy of the 1997 rule book, have it inscribed in stone, as being an untouchable American icon, then gold plated.  Then anyone who even mentions of changing the rules is shunned, branded a communist, and promptly expatriated.

 

 

Because people are dying? :shrug: 

 

 

57 minutes ago, The Dude said:

I agree consenting adults should be free to do whatever they please, so long as it's not interfering with the rights of others.  Where it gets tricky is children who can't consent bashing each others brains in. 

 

 

There's also nothing stopping consenting adults from strapping up and spearing each other on kickoffs at the local park. You're still free to do that if you want, just like the NFL/NCAA are free to make whatever rules they want for their version of football.

[HS_Coach_C]

1 hour ago, dvdcrr said:

Right, and I am with New Hampshire on that one.  It is not the role of the government in a free society to require optimal behavior.

Well I also don't think we need laws making tackle football illegal for kids under a certain age. The leagues themselves and the parent organizations can make these decisions all on their own. 

 

I'm saying that new research and new technology can lead to decisions made for safety reasons. We can be smarter about contact in football, just as we figured out that tapeworms weren't exactly the best weight loss solutions.

[URSS]

With the lawyers going after head injuries and the recent changes for blocking and targeting; I think we are a long term trend that ends with Div 1 Flag Football teams.  

[In the Deed the Glory]

On 4/14/2018 at 2:56 PM, HS_Coach_C said:

Well I also don't think we need laws making tackle football illegal for kids under a certain age. The leagues themselves and the parent organizations can make these decisions all on their own. 

 

I'm saying that new research and new technology can lead to decisions made for safety reasons. We can be smarter about contact in football, just as we figured out that tapeworms weren't exactly the best weight loss solutions.

 

The market will determine this.  As stated above, it appears it may be happening already with the drop in participation.

[brophog]

The problem with a rule like this is it can often backfire because it doesn't take into account how coaches will react. 

 

Coaches will ill try to change tactics to get around this, one must know that when creating the rule. If you can't kick it out of bounds (illegal), and you can't kick it in the air (fair catch), then the only other option is to kick it on the ground. Teams will try to experiment with hard, directed squib kicks. They have to, you've taken away any other option.

 

From a safety aspect, you'd rather the predictable kick being caught near the goal line rather than the chaos of a squib. I understand what they're trying to do, but I'm not sure this is the answer.