Biden's America

[Guy Chamberlin]

54 minutes ago, nic said:

I will have to use google to find out who that is. Biden was supposed to unite. 

 

If Biden was supposed to unite by doing everything conservatives wanted him to do, that was never going to happen. 

 

If Biden had done everything conservatives wanted him to do, they would have found fresh reasons to hate him.

 

Maybe we should take this over to the Divisiveness Thread.

[nic]

36 minutes ago, JJ Husker said:

Somebody is taking an election campaign talking point way too seriously. Nobody can unite this country completely, that is about as possible as herding cats.

 

How do you unite people who ignore facts, reject science, blindly follow an autocrat and attempt to dismantle and overthrow our government?  There will be no uniting until MAGA and Trump supporters pull their head out of their a$$.

I have two neighbors (both female) who switched from Trump (2016) to Biden (2020) because they thought he would be moderate and less polarizing. Neither are happy with Him yet, although the SCOTUS abortion ruling turned one of them back to the Dems for 2022 anyway. She is a libertarian…or so she says. I am pretty sure she doesn’t want pot sold in Douglas county.  

[Guy Chamberlin]

Seriously. Let's have a legit national discussion about the cost of higher education. There actually is a sea change going on. The stigmas against trade schools and community colleges are falling, and the "value" of expensive four year universities are being openly questioned by folks of all political persuasions. You don't need anecdotal observations to know college costs are vastly greater than they've been for previous generations, and college loans have taken on a predatory nature they didn't have before. Student loan forgiveness may piss some people off, but at the very least we can take it as a flash point to start figuring out better alternatives. 

[JJ Husker]

8 minutes ago, nic said:

I have two neighbors (both female) who switched from Trump (2016) to Biden (2020) because they thought he would be moderate and less polarizing. Neither are happy with Him yet, although the SCOTUS abortion ruling turned one of them back to the Dems for 2022 anyway. She is a libertarian…or so she says. I am pretty sure she doesn’t want pot sold in Douglas county.  

That anecdote does nothing to address the claims of “Biden isn’t being a uniter”. It’s just another check in the con column being pushed by Rs.

 

For what it’s worth, I am no fan of Biden’s either. But he is certainly the lesser of evils compared to the leading voices in the GOP.

[JJ Husker]

10 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

Seriously. Let's have a legit national discussion about the cost of higher education. There actually is a sea change going on. The stigmas against trade schools and community colleges are falling, and the "value" of expensive four year universities are being openly questioned by folks of all political persuasions. You don't need anecdotal observations to know college costs are vastly greater than they've been for previous generations, and college loans have taken on a predatory nature they didn't have before. Student loan forgiveness may piss some people off, but at the very least we can take it as a flash point to start figuring out better alternatives. 

I agree. I’ve been saying this for as long as I can remember. A 4 year college degree is not for everyone and is truly required in very few situations. The catch will be getting businesses to acknowledge it and to quit requiring 4 year degrees for pencil pusher jobs, and then stop our secondary schools from advancing the idea that one is necessary to survive.

 

Maybe if the feds would stop guaranteeing student loans and making it so easy to go into smothering debt, maybe then schools couldn’t charge whatever the hell they feel like charging. The spigot has to get turned off somewhere along the way.

[Born N Bled Red]

1 hour ago, nic said:

I will have to use google to find out who that is. Biden was supposed to unite. 

 

He is uniting. - He is uniting the decent commonsense Republicans who view Trump for what he is (a crook and a national security threat) and what he's not (a uniter, a savior, a person who looks out for the good of America) with and the rest of the country against those who worship and idolize Trump, and would legitimately seat him as King of the United States if they had the chance. - He's uniting TRUE PATRIOTS that love America against those who would have all our institutions, our Constitution, our principles, and our place of leadership in the world burned to the ground in pursuit of their own power and money. It's pretty damn clear he's acting as a Uniting force. Inviting Republicans in the vein of Romney, Cheney, Reagan, and Eisenhower to join a coalition to take back America and their party from the Trumpists and their worshippers. 

 

I hope you and Archy accept the invitation and recognize what a clear and present danger Trump and his band of sycophants are. We can disagree and debate policy all day long. But when it comes down to it, love this great country Trumps any policy disagreement I have with anyone, and I'd gladly put those differences aside and work alongside anyone willing to prevent the actions of this would be usurper, the golden cow, and his authoritarian enablers that would sell our national security and the future of this great nation to the highest bidder in an effort to cement their own wealth and power. 

[Born N Bled Red]

14 minutes ago, JJ Husker said:

I agree. I’ve been saying this for as long as I can remember. A 4 year college degree is not for everyone and is truly required in very few situations. The catch will be getting businesses to acknowledge it and to quit requiring 4 year degrees for pencil pusher jobs, and then stop our secondary schools from advancing the idea that one is necessary to survive.

 

Maybe if the feds would stop guaranteeing student loans and making it so easy to go into smothering debt, maybe then schools couldn’t charge whatever the hell they feel like charging. The spigot has to get turned off somewhere along the way.

 

This! HR in companies across the spectrum eschew experience, knowledge and skill in favor of a degree every time.  Individuals with 40 years experience leading organizations in their career field now get told by job postings, they need not apply if they did not jump through the hoops to get a degree. I once had a I girlfriend I was supporting as she was out of work. I was in the mall and was approached by the staff at Hollister as they were recruiting assistant manager positions. I explained that I was not interested but my girlfriend would love to discuss the role. Their first question- does she have a four-year degree? They wouldn't even consider her application without one - to be a friggin ASSISTANT MANAGER at Hollister without one. - Insanity. 

 

How can you even question why people feel they "HAVE" to take on debt and go to college when this is the reality of the job market they face. My parents bought a 12 acre acreage with a 5 bedroom 2 bath house on it, with 9 excellent outbuildings in 1993 for $64,000 in their late 20s. It was the largest purchase they made in their lives. For the last 20 years, if you want a CAREER - not a job, but a CAREER, you have been expected to take on that level of debt for a 4 year degree before even being considered qualified for most jobs. 

[Archy1221]

29 minutes ago, Born N Bled Red said:

Inviting Republicans in the vein of Romney, Cheney, Reagan, and Eisenhower to join a coalition to take back America and their party from the Trumpists and their worshippers.

Biden told us that Romney was going to put people “back in chains” in 2012

[Guy Chamberlin]

I mean, while we're at it, we can discuss why the visible signs of American middle-class prosperity are hiding a huge disparity in what we can actually afford, and who is profiting from the collapse in our buying power. 

[Guy Chamberlin]

Just now, Archy1221 said:

Biden told us that Romney was going to put people “back in chains” in 2012

 

The only thing that has changed, Archy, is that 2022 Mitt Romney is now considered a RINO by the party base. 

[Guy Chamberlin]

16 minutes ago, Born N Bled Red said:

 

How can you even question why people feel they "HAVE" to take on debt and go to college when this is the reality of the job market they face. My parents bought a 12 acre acreage with a 5 bedroom 2 bath house on it, with 9 excellent outbuildings in 1993 for $64,000 in their late 20s. It was the largest purchase they made in their lives. For the last 20 years, if you want a CAREER - not a job, but a CAREER, you have been expected to take on that level of debt for a 4 year degree before even being considered qualified for most jobs. 

 

Then let's talk about a predatory housing market increasingly dominated by a handful of wealthy financial institutions.

[Born N Bled Red]

19 hours ago, Archy1221 said:

good try on the bolded.  
 

Ummm, I have a recent college grad as a daughter who was involved in a sorority and came to know many many people on that campus.   I currently have a son attending same school in a frat and have come to know many of those kids and parents also.   
 

I’ve had four kids go through public education and personally know each of their teachers and coaches.  I know a few cops, not many but a few, and the ones I know are pissed about the debt plan.   I work with nurses EVERY SINGLE DAY.   
 

Still waiting for those facts and figures in response to actual facts and figures I posted.  Can’t wait to see them.  @BigRedBuster asked too.  

 

Alright - I'll play. First off, congrats on getting your kids through college, truly an achievement to be proud of. No snark.

 

But... I'm betting you didn't help them at all, and they did it all themselves and pulled themselves up by their bootstraps. I bet that you didn't provide them a vehicle, fuel, car insurance, health insurance, or have them on your phone plan. I bet that you didn't pay for any of their lodging or food needs, and that they never once asked you for money to help make ends meet. You also NEVER used any of your connections to help them get a decent summer job or part time job during school. Its against your creed that everyone should make it on their own. - I am also certain that after college, you will not provide any down payment assistance for a house or a security deposit on an apartment or help them with medical bills or a place to stay as they transition to "the real world."

 

And I am sure that the sorority and frat life is fully encompasses the experience of every college student in the nation and the everyone can afford that way of life. The kids in those frats that you've come to know so well all come from impoverished or lower middleclass families and magically afford that lifestyle, and that all of their parents that you've meet come from a socio-economic status the same or higher than yours. 

 

The availability of scholarships in the last 10 years has SIGNIFICANTLY increased due to the recognition that student loans are an issue. Go do some actual research and see what was available 15-30 years ago, which is when these loans being forgiven were originated. - You won't. Because in doing so you'd prove yourself wrong. 

 

Again- what are the ages of those "teachers and coaches and cops that are so pissed about the debt plan?" I guarantee they graduated prior to 2000, because I don't know a SINGLE public worker who is not barely getting by, paycheck to paycheck, younger than 40, unless they have a spouse that is in a much higher paying role outside the public sector. 

 

My primary disagreement in your post I originally responded to was your make believe magic school payoff plan. Made me laugh out loud, literally. 

 

Do yourself a favor and get outside your bubble, and quit assuming that just because someone doesn't clue you in to their financial struggles, that they have none. People don't talk about that crap in public or to the parents of their students. 

 

 

 

[Archy1221]

23 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

 

The only thing that has changed, Archy, is that 2022 Mitt Romney is now considered a RINO by the party base. 

I don’t know that to be the case.   I know I’ve referred to him as Rino once in awhile, more out of frustration on certain things but he would get my vote against any Dem.  
 

The bigger question is why would Biden work to unite the Romney’s of the world as another poster said when Biden believes Romney would put people back in chains??

[Guy Chamberlin]

5 minutes ago, Archy1221 said:

I don’t know that to be the case.   I know I’ve referred to him as Rino once in awhile, more out of frustration on certain things but he would get my vote against any Dem.  
 

The bigger question is why would Biden work to unite the Romney’s of the world as another poster said when Biden believes Romney would put people back in chains??

 

Because he's a politician and it's the smart play. If he suddenly finds himself running against Romney, he will pull out the "corporations are people, my friends" line, because that will also be the smart play. 

 

And maybe, just maybe, Mitt Romney has softened a bit since his attempts to placate the right wing of the GOP in his unsuccessful 2012 campaign. 

 

I know you weren't asking an honest question, but I gave you an honest answer anyway. 

[Guy Chamberlin]

My dad truly pulled himself up by the bootstraps. Dirt poor farm boy in a family that never sent anyone to college, and didn't WANT him to go to college. He worked three jobs throughout high school. Went to UNL, earned a doctorate, and created generational wealth that is now benefitting his grandchildren.

 

It wasn't until about 10 years ago he told me that story wasn't entirely true. He did work his a$$ off, but no matter how many after-school jobs he had, he could never have gone to college without the funding and leverage the GI Bill gave him. Also, he met my mother as an undergrad, and her father helped pay for dental school.

 

So I didn't have to pull myself up by my bootstraps. But I did excel in my own way and paid my own way for everything. Except for all the places where I didn't. That was an awfully nice safety net I had, and it allowed me to take risks that weren't really risks. 

 

Fun fact: I just learned this week that the phrase "pull yourself up by the bootstraps" originally had the opposite connotation: it is physically impossible to lift yourself up by pulling on your boots, and the phrase is meant to mock the idea it's that simple.