Good grief

[skersfan]

That could be true if you truly believe Coach Pelini was fired for failure to win games. I don't believe it had a lot to do with it. Some still forget that at Nebraska it is more than just wins and losses, or at least that is what we have stated for years.

[Enhance]

That could be true if you truly believe Coach Pelini was fired for failure to win games. I don't believe it had a lot to do with it. Some still forget that at Nebraska it is more than just wins and losses, or at least that is what we have stated for years.

I don't think it matters too much whether we believe it to be true or not. I think we all know BP was fired for more than just his W/L record. But, you can't say statistics played a part in firing someone and then have their replacement do no better. It will be a worthy critique of SE if that happens.

 

And, if we're honest, the AD at Nebraska lives and dies by the football program.

[Moiraine]

 

 

That could be true if you truly believe Coach Pelini was fired for failure to win games. I don't believe it had a lot to do with it. Some still forget that at Nebraska it is more than just wins and losses, or at least that is what we have stated for years.

you can't say statistics played a part in firing someone and then have their replacement do no better.

Yes you can.

 

Let's say Riley has an identical record to Pelini after his 7th year here and everything else with the games won and lost is identical (cept he needs more 10 win seasons to make up for his record last year).

 

In that case, Riley should get more time than Pelini had, because Riley doesn't have the other negatives that Pelini had.

 

Record being a factor doesn't mean having the same record gets him fired, because there are other factors that put Riley above Pelini. Where record being a factor matters is if Riley's is more than marginally worse than Pelini's. Then the W-L record would outweigh the positives with Riley.

[Making Chimichangas]

 

 

 

Nobody is discounting it - but you are naaive if you think it still wont take him a little time to turn area the program from what Bo and others did.

A lot of people are discounting it but they shouldn't. He doesn't need this magical 7 years...he knows what he is doing it his experience that gave us big hope. That is why his 5-7 season last year freaked out a lot of fans...a 20 year HC should not have been losing games like that.

 

See...he came into a spot that did not really need "turning around" it needed a little make over.

 

SE told us all that the pieces were pretty much in place that things were great and that we just needed a leadership change.

 

 

All the conversations, talk, and discussion that has occurred on this board, other sites, in the media, on sports talk radio, etc regarding lack of depth across the entire roster, the weak S&C under James Dobson, and the toxic fan hating culture the former coach instilled in his players.

 

Despite all that, you actually believe the Nebraska football team just needed a "little makeover?" You serious Clark? That would be like me being a real estate agent and saying, "Teacher, buy this house..."

 

 

"...all it needs is a new paint job."

 

SE told us that...why would he lie?

 

Why was the team able to win 9 or 10 games a year with an inferior and experienced staff and with a SC staff that clearly did not know what they were doing...

 

So yes, I believe that Riley just needs a makeover...this was not UCF that just went 0-12.

 

Don't forget, Vegas had them favored in 9 games this year...they won them all.

 

 

I don't look at it as Shawn Eichorst lying. I look at as his being very circumspect in what he says. For example, someone asks you, "How are you?" Do you go into a long spiel about literally everything that's wrong with your life? No, you don't. You say, "I'm doing well. How are you?" Are you lying? Not really, you just choose to limit what you say. Shawn Eichorst is absolutely no different than any other public figure. He is going to purposefully downplay publically what is wrong, because letting all that stuff out causes more problems.

 

I suppose the team was able to win 9-10 games a year because they scored at least one more point than the other teams.

 

Remember one thing: Bo actually WANTED to be fired. he literally did everything he could until he got what he wanted. Clearly, he didn't want to be here and his actions, blowups, temper-tantrums, and publically insulting his boss proved that.

 

Suffice it to say, Bo Pelini left Nebraska a literal wreck, and Riley has spent the last two seasons trying to RECRUIT to fill all the holes in our roster.

 

But it takes time and with scholarship limitations, it often takes 2-3 years.

[whateveritis1224]

 

 

 

 

Nobody is discounting it - but you are naaive if you think it still wont take him a little time to turn area the program from what Bo and others did.

A lot of people are discounting it but they shouldn't. He doesn't need this magical 7 years...he knows what he is doing it his experience that gave us big hope. That is why his 5-7 season last year freaked out a lot of fans...a 20 year HC should not have been losing games like that.

 

See...he came into a spot that did not really need "turning around" it needed a little make over.

 

SE told us all that the pieces were pretty much in place that things were great and that we just needed a leadership change.

 

 

All the conversations, talk, and discussion that has occurred on this board, other sites, in the media, on sports talk radio, etc regarding lack of depth across the entire roster, the weak S&C under James Dobson, and the toxic fan hating culture the former coach instilled in his players.

 

Despite all that, you actually believe the Nebraska football team just needed a "little makeover?" You serious Clark? That would be like me being a real estate agent and saying, "Teacher, buy this house..."

 

 

"...all it needs is a new paint job."

 

SE told us that...why would he lie?

 

Why was the team able to win 9 or 10 games a year with an inferior and experienced staff and with a SC staff that clearly did not know what they were doing...

 

So yes, I believe that Riley just needs a makeover...this was not UCF that just went 0-12.

 

Don't forget, Vegas had them favored in 9 games this year...they won them all.

 

 

I don't look at it as Shawn Eichorst lying. I look at as his being very circumspect in what he says. For example, someone asks you, "How are you?" Do you go into a long spiel about literally everything that's wrong with your life? No, you don't. You say, "I'm doing well. How are you?" Are you lying? Not really, you just choose to limit what you say. Shawn Eichorst is absolutely no different than any other public figure. He is going to purposefully downplay publically what is wrong, because letting all that stuff out causes more problems.

 

I suppose the team was able to win 9-10 games a year because they scored at least one more point than the other teams.

 

Remember one thing: Bo actually WANTED to be fired. he literally did everything he could until he got what he wanted. Clearly, he didn't want to be here and his actions, blowups, temper-tantrums, and publically insulting his boss proved that.

 

Suffice it to say, Bo Pelini left Nebraska a literal wreck, and Riley has spent the last two seasons trying to RECRUIT to fill all the holes in our roster.

 

But it takes time and with scholarship limitations, it often takes 2-3 years.

 

Bottom line is Eichorst should have fired Pelini after 2013 when he got on the mic and publicly asked to be fired. Hardly anyone would have had a problem then.

[huskered17]

Maybe he should have been kept and let him burn his chances at getting the next job, instead of having to pay him for the next few season's while he coaches else where.

I doubt he would have tanked it, and would have given everything he had to win as many games as he could, looking to find that next job.

All thou I think the money the Univ is paying him, doesn't really hurt the pocket book of Neb.

 

GBR!!!

[Saunders]

 

Cornstar said: Where did I say that I didn't like this staff? The actual facts are that most of these guys have a lengthy track record, and all are a question mark at best. We've seen what they've done at other stops, and we've seen what they've done here.

 

I don't see good coaches making some of the excuses you are making. They come in, they coach who they have, they win.

 

Yes there were some depth issues but 2 years later and there has been no progress. The depth issues certainly didn't cause most of the losses over the past 2 years, not with those easy schedules. I'll give you Ohio state, even though it never should have been a 59 point beat down.

 

Seeing what these guys have done over their careers, to consider them very good would be a big exaggeration. Some of them I liked and have disappointed, some I didn't like and have done nothing to change that opinion. A couple I didn't like should be given another year or two to prove their worth.

 

 

Well your statement that "many" coaches on this staff are question marks, implies you don't think they are capable.

 

I am not saying you dislike them on a personal level

 

You do realize that we have scholarship limitation right? And can only sign the number of players +3 that leave the following year. So if we have 20 open scholarships for the '17 class, then the max we can sign is 23. Even then, that number will have to come down to 20 through attrition. Nebraska's lack of depth was so bad, for several games this year, we had as many as 4 walk-ons starting along the OL. Factor in literally no backup QB, no depth at DT, DE, or LB.

 

Furthermore, our strength and conditioning program under Pelini and Dobson was so weak, that Boyd Epley commented that it would take 2-3 years of improved S&C to begin to get our players where they need to be.

 

Point is, you're asking for the kind of miracle turnaround that isn't realistic at all given the plethora of issues this program is currently facing.

 

In my opinion, Mike Riley should get at the minimum 2 more years.

 

Holy flippin' cow.... Not wanting to see the second worst loss in program history, and or avoid getting thumped by an average Iowa team is not "asking for a miracle."

 

And good lord your exaggerations are hyperbolic.

[Making Chimichangas]

 

 

 

 

 

Nobody is discounting it - but you are naaive if you think it still wont take him a little time to turn area the program from what Bo and others did.

A lot of people are discounting it but they shouldn't. He doesn't need this magical 7 years...he knows what he is doing it his experience that gave us big hope. That is why his 5-7 season last year freaked out a lot of fans...a 20 year HC should not have been losing games like that.

 

See...he came into a spot that did not really need "turning around" it needed a little make over.

 

SE told us all that the pieces were pretty much in place that things were great and that we just needed a leadership change.

 

 

All the conversations, talk, and discussion that has occurred on this board, other sites, in the media, on sports talk radio, etc regarding lack of depth across the entire roster, the weak S&C under James Dobson, and the toxic fan hating culture the former coach instilled in his players.

 

Despite all that, you actually believe the Nebraska football team just needed a "little makeover?" You serious Clark? That would be like me being a real estate agent and saying, "Teacher, buy this house..."

 

 

"...all it needs is a new paint job."

 

SE told us that...why would he lie?

 

Why was the team able to win 9 or 10 games a year with an inferior and experienced staff and with a SC staff that clearly did not know what they were doing...

 

So yes, I believe that Riley just needs a makeover...this was not UCF that just went 0-12.

 

Don't forget, Vegas had them favored in 9 games this year...they won them all.

 

 

I don't look at it as Shawn Eichorst lying. I look at as his being very circumspect in what he says. For example, someone asks you, "How are you?" Do you go into a long spiel about literally everything that's wrong with your life? No, you don't. You say, "I'm doing well. How are you?" Are you lying? Not really, you just choose to limit what you say. Shawn Eichorst is absolutely no different than any other public figure. He is going to purposefully downplay publically what is wrong, because letting all that stuff out causes more problems.

 

I suppose the team was able to win 9-10 games a year because they scored at least one more point than the other teams.

 

Remember one thing: Bo actually WANTED to be fired. he literally did everything he could until he got what he wanted. Clearly, he didn't want to be here and his actions, blowups, temper-tantrums, and publically insulting his boss proved that.

 

Suffice it to say, Bo Pelini left Nebraska a literal wreck, and Riley has spent the last two seasons trying to RECRUIT to fill all the holes in our roster.

 

But it takes time and with scholarship limitations, it often takes 2-3 years.

 

Bottom line is Eichorst should have fired Pelini after 2013 when he got on the mic and publicly asked to be fired. Hardly anyone would have had a problem then.

 

100% agree.

[Making Chimichangas]

 

 

Cornstar said: Where did I say that I didn't like this staff? The actual facts are that most of these guys have a lengthy track record, and all are a question mark at best. We've seen what they've done at other stops, and we've seen what they've done here.

 

I don't see good coaches making some of the excuses you are making. They come in, they coach who they have, they win.

 

Yes there were some depth issues but 2 years later and there has been no progress. The depth issues certainly didn't cause most of the losses over the past 2 years, not with those easy schedules. I'll give you Ohio state, even though it never should have been a 59 point beat down.

 

Seeing what these guys have done over their careers, to consider them very good would be a big exaggeration. Some of them I liked and have disappointed, some I didn't like and have done nothing to change that opinion. A couple I didn't like should be given another year or two to prove their worth.

 

 

Well your statement that "many" coaches on this staff are question marks, implies you don't think they are capable.

 

I am not saying you dislike them on a personal level

 

You do realize that we have scholarship limitation right? And can only sign the number of players +3 that leave the following year. So if we have 20 open scholarships for the '17 class, then the max we can sign is 23. Even then, that number will have to come down to 20 through attrition. Nebraska's lack of depth was so bad, for several games this year, we had as many as 4 walk-ons starting along the OL. Factor in literally no backup QB, no depth at DT, DE, or LB.

 

Furthermore, our strength and conditioning program under Pelini and Dobson was so weak, that Boyd Epley commented that it would take 2-3 years of improved S&C to begin to get our players where they need to be.

 

Point is, you're asking for the kind of miracle turnaround that isn't realistic at all given the plethora of issues this program is currently facing.

 

In my opinion, Mike Riley should get at the minimum 2 more years.

 

Holy flippin' cow.... Not wanting to see the second worst loss in program history, and or avoid getting thumped by an average Iowa team is not "asking for a miracle."

 

And good lord your exaggerations are hyperbolic.

 

How did I exaggerate anything? Am I exaggerating our lack of depth? What about the media reports where Boyd Epley stated when he came back to Nebraska the players weren't even close, physically, to what was needed, did I exaggerate that also? I know, perhaps I exaggerated Bo Pelini's completely unprofessional conduct, petulant blowups, and utterly lazy recruiting. Yes, I "exaggerated" that has to be the answer.

 

And ya, nobody wants to see Nebraska lose by 30, 59, etc.

 

But there are a segment of fans who have the "just win to my satisfaction" regardless if what they're demanding is actually possible.

 

I think Mike Riley is on track and the program is trending in the right direction.

 

Now, if huge blow-out losses continue in season 3, then the seat will definitely start to warm up.

 

But dang, we gave Bo Pelini 7 seasons and all he did was: a) go 0-3 in conference championship games, b) embarrass the university publically, and c) basically taunted his his boss to try and get fired.

 

The absolute least we can do is give Mike Riley another 2 years.

[marko polo]

 

 

That could be true if you truly believe Coach Pelini was fired for failure to win games. I don't believe it had a lot to do with it. Some still forget that at Nebraska it is more than just wins and losses, or at least that is what we have stated for years.

you can't say statistics played a part in firing someone and then have their replacement do no better.

Yes you can.

 

Let's say Riley has an identical record to Pelini after his 7th year here and everything else with the games won and lost is identical (cept he needs more 10 win seasons to make up for his record last year).

 

In that case, Riley should get more time than Pelini had, because Riley doesn't have the other negatives that Pelini had.

 

Record being a factor doesn't mean having the same record gets him fired, because there are other factors that put Riley above Pelini. Where record being a factor matters is if Riley's is more than marginally worse than Pelini's. Then the W-L record would outweigh the positives with Riley.

 

there is the other thing, like let's not make the same mistake twice and wait another 7 long miserable yrs if that is the way it is going.

[Making Chimichangas]

 

 

 

That could be true if you truly believe Coach Pelini was fired for failure to win games. I don't believe it had a lot to do with it. Some still forget that at Nebraska it is more than just wins and losses, or at least that is what we have stated for years.

you can't say statistics played a part in firing someone and then have their replacement do no better.

Yes you can.

 

Let's say Riley has an identical record to Pelini after his 7th year here and everything else with the games won and lost is identical (cept he needs more 10 win seasons to make up for his record last year).

 

In that case, Riley should get more time than Pelini had, because Riley doesn't have the other negatives that Pelini had.

 

Record being a factor doesn't mean having the same record gets him fired, because there are other factors that put Riley above Pelini. Where record being a factor matters is if Riley's is more than marginally worse than Pelini's. Then the W-L record would outweigh the positives with Riley.

 

there is the other thing, like let's not make the same mistake twice and wait another 7 long miserable yrs if that is the way it is going.

 

If Mike Riley somehow wins 9/10 games every year, and doesn't ever have any "Pelini" moments, he'll be here as long as he wants and I'll be happy with that.

 

Mike Riley will probably never have any "Pelini" moments so for him to be relieved of his coaching duties, it will be about the W/L record.

[NebraskaHarry]

 

 

 

 

 

Cornstar said: Where did I say that I didn't like this staff? The actual facts are that most of these guys have a lengthy track record, and all are a question mark at best. We've seen what they've done at other stops, and we've seen what they've done here.

 

I don't see good coaches making some of the excuses you are making. They come in, they coach who they have, they win.

 

Yes there were some depth issues but 2 years later and there has been no progress. The depth issues certainly didn't cause most of the losses over the past 2 years, not with those easy schedules. I'll give you Ohio state, even though it never should have been a 59 point beat down.

 

Seeing what these guys have done over their careers, to consider them very good would be a big exaggeration. Some of them I liked and have disappointed, some I didn't like and have done nothing to change that opinion. A couple I didn't like should be given another year or two to prove their worth.

 

Well your statement that "many" coaches on this staff are question marks, implies you don't think they are capable.

 

I am not saying you dislike them on a personal level

 

You do realize that we have scholarship limitation right? And can only sign the number of players +3 that leave the following year. So if we have 20 open scholarships for the '17 class, then the max we can sign is 23. Even then, that number will have to come down to 20 through attrition. Nebraska's lack of depth was so bad, for several games this year, we had as many as 4 walk-ons starting along the OL. Factor in literally no backup QB, no depth at DT, DE, or LB.

 

Furthermore, our strength and conditioning program under Pelini and Dobson was so weak, that Boyd Epley commented that it would take 2-3 years of improved S&C to begin to get our players where they need to be.

 

Point is, you're asking for the kind of miracle turnaround that isn't realistic at all given the plethora of issues this program is currently facing.

 

In my opinion, Mike Riley should get at the minimum 2 more years.

Holy flippin' cow.... Not wanting to see the second worst loss in program history, and or avoid getting thumped by an average Iowa team is not "asking for a miracle."

 

And good lord your exaggerations are hyperbolic.

How did I exaggerate anything? Am I exaggerating our lack of depth? What about the media reports where Boyd Epley stated when he came back to Nebraska the players weren't even close, physically, to what was needed, did I exaggerate that also? I know, perhaps I exaggerated Bo Pelini's completely unprofessional conduct, petulant blowups, and utterly lazy recruiting. Yes, I "exaggerated" that has to be the answer.

 

And ya, nobody wants to see Nebraska lose by 30, 59, etc.

 

But there are a segment of fans who have the "just win to my satisfaction" regardless if what they're demanding is actually possible.

 

I think Mike Riley is on track and the program is trending in the right direction.

 

Now, if huge blow-out losses continue in season 3, then the seat will definitely start to warm up.

 

But dang, we gave Bo Pelini 7 seasons and all he did was: a) go 0-3 in conference championship games, b) embarrass the university publically, and c) basically taunted his his boss to try and get fired.

 

The absolute least we can do is give Mike Riley another 2 years.

That absolute least would be to give Riley next season to prove himself. If he loses every game or only wins 1 to 3 games then there should be a serious conversation of termination. Even then, Shawn's seat would have to be getting pretty toasty for him to consider firing Riley. Even with that horrible of a record I think Shawn would have a hard time admitting he made a bad decision at this point.

 

That said, maybe Riley wins 11 or more games. Then we're talking contract extensions. But imo, I would say Riley wins 7 - 8 games next year with year 4 being the decision year on extension or termination. The schedule and the talent just don't seem to be in his favor for the next 2 to 3 years.

[Making Chimichangas]

Nebraska Harry, said: That absolute least would be to give Riley next season to prove himself. If he loses every game or only wins 1 to 3 games then there should be a serious conversation of termination. Even then, Shawn's seat would have to be getting pretty toasty for him to consider firing Riley. Even with that horrible of a record I think Shawn would have a hard time admitting he made a bad decision at this point.

 

That said, maybe Riley wins 11 or more games. Then we're talking contract extensions. But imo, I would say Riley wins 7 - 8 games next year with year 4 being the decision year on extension or termination. The schedule and the talent just don't seem to be in his favor for the next 2 to 3 years.

 

 

Of course the caveat to what I am saying is: if Nebraska somehow goes 2-10, 3-9, or some other similar dismal record in '17, then yes the conversation about letting the axe fall will definitely be warranted.

 

But I am optimistic. Our recruiting is better than at any time, at least on paper, since Bill Callahan was here.

 

Mike Riley is slowly bringing far more optimism into the program, there's more positive energy, and I believe that as more of the players that Bo recruited leave the program, things will only get better.

 

Now I will say this, in 2017, Mike Riley will have 3 QBs eligible to play who were specifically recruited to play in his offensive system. If we do not see much improved QB play, there will be trouble.

 

And I am of the belief that if we can get better, more consistent, play out of our QB, and keep improving on turnover ratio, yards allowed defensively, etc...I think Nebraska will be in a terrific position to return to the elite of college football.

[NebraskaHarry]

 

Nebraska Harry, said: That absolute least would be to give Riley next season to prove himself. If he loses every game or only wins 1 to 3 games then there should be a serious conversation of termination. Even then, Shawn's seat would have to be getting pretty toasty for him to consider firing Riley. Even with that horrible of a record I think Shawn would have a hard time admitting he made a bad decision at this point.

 

That said, maybe Riley wins 11 or more games. Then we're talking contract extensions. But imo, I would say Riley wins 7 - 8 games next year with year 4 being the decision year on extension or termination. The schedule and the talent just don't seem to be in his favor for the next 2 to 3 years.

 

Of course the caveat to what I am saying is: if Nebraska somehow goes 2-10, 3-9, or some other similar dismal record in '17, then yes the conversation about letting the axe fall will definitely be warranted.

 

But I am optimistic. Our recruiting is better than at any time, at least on paper, since Bill Callahan was here.

 

Mike Riley is slowly bringing far more optimism into the program, there's more positive energy, and I believe that as more of the players that Bo recruited leave the program, things will only get better.

 

Now I will say this, in 2017, Mike Riley will have 3 QBs eligible to play who were specifically recruited to play in his offensive system. If we do not see much improved QB play, there will be trouble.

 

And I am of the belief that if we can get better, more consistent, play out of our QB, and keep improving on turnover ratio, yards allowed defensively, etc...I think Nebraska will be in a terrific position to return to the elite of college football.

Im not what you would consider a recruiting expect, but what makes you say that recruiting is better on paper since Callahan? To me it looks pretty similar between Pelini and Riley. If Riley actually hits on the big fish this year yet I'll agree, but that has yet to be determined. Pelini always had big fish he failed to reel in in the end, but he had them nibbling. Looks the same for Riley so far, but maybe I'm not seeing things the same. I don't know.. maybe it's just me.

[Making Chimichangas]

 

 

Nebraska Harry, said: That absolute least would be to give Riley next season to prove himself. If he loses every game or only wins 1 to 3 games then there should be a serious conversation of termination. Even then, Shawn's seat would have to be getting pretty toasty for him to consider firing Riley. Even with that horrible of a record I think Shawn would have a hard time admitting he made a bad decision at this point.

 

That said, maybe Riley wins 11 or more games. Then we're talking contract extensions. But imo, I would say Riley wins 7 - 8 games next year with year 4 being the decision year on extension or termination. The schedule and the talent just don't seem to be in his favor for the next 2 to 3 years.

 

Of course the caveat to what I am saying is: if Nebraska somehow goes 2-10, 3-9, or some other similar dismal record in '17, then yes the conversation about letting the axe fall will definitely be warranted.

 

But I am optimistic. Our recruiting is better than at any time, at least on paper, since Bill Callahan was here.

 

Mike Riley is slowly bringing far more optimism into the program, there's more positive energy, and I believe that as more of the players that Bo recruited leave the program, things will only get better.

 

Now I will say this, in 2017, Mike Riley will have 3 QBs eligible to play who were specifically recruited to play in his offensive system. If we do not see much improved QB play, there will be trouble.

 

And I am of the belief that if we can get better, more consistent, play out of our QB, and keep improving on turnover ratio, yards allowed defensively, etc...I think Nebraska will be in a terrific position to return to the elite of college football.

Im not what you would consider a recruiting expect, but what makes you say that recruiting is better on paper since Callahan? To me it looks pretty similar between Pelini and Riley. If Riley actually hits on the big fish this year yet I'll agree, but that has yet to be determined. Pelini always had big fish he failed to reel in in the end, but he had them nibbling. Looks the same for Riley so far, but maybe I'm not seeing things the same. I don't know.. maybe it's just me.

 

 

I am no recruiting expert either. But I suspect that with players like Holmes, the WR out of California, Sarrell the 5 star OT, Chuck Filiaga who is a (I believe very highly rated 4 star) just to name a few, that recruiting is better.

 

Perhaps someone who follows our recruiting more closely can say yea or nay...

 

But I don't ever remember Nebraska having a legit shot at so many elite prospects this late in process under Bo Pelini.