Thoughts and Prayers!!!

[DevoHusker]

37 minutes ago, commando said:

what is your simple solution besides to allow the mass shootings to continue unabated?

 

I've never claimed to have one. I have stated, several times, that I believe some common sense legislation is due, but have no strong ideas as to what that needs to look like.

 

[commando]

11 minutes ago, DevoHusker said:

 

I've never claimed to have one. I have stated, several times, that I believe some common sense legislation is due, but have no strong ideas as to what that needs to look like.

 

the republican party won't ever allow anything to happen towards any common sense solutions towards this problem.    obama in 8 years implemented 1 item towards solving this.....i forget if it was an EO or how it passed....but he had a system to allow government agencies to better communicate on who shouldn't have guns.   it was hailed as a huge victory by the NRA and the republican party when trump overturned that limited action.    we are going to continue with the onslaught because the NRA and gun manufacturers make huge money from gun sales and the republican party gets a lot of that money donated to them to continue to allow the slaughter...er...umm...profits...... to continue.

[Dr. Strangelove]

2 hours ago, DevoHusker said:

Speechless? Because I believe the US is a great Country 

 

What is your simple solution that harms no one? Or are you just passing along platitudes?

Ban and confiscate guns, don't act like it's complicated. 

 

The Founding Fathers didn't exactly intend to have automatic weapons with armor piercing bullets in the hands of citizens. 

[DevoHusker]

4 hours ago, Dr. Strangelove said:

Ban and confiscate guns, don't act like it's complicated. 

This is where it gets complicated.

[BigRedBuster]

5 hours ago, commando said:

we are going to continue with the onslaught because the NRA and gun manufacturers make huge money from gun sales and the republican party gets a lot of that money donated to them to continue to allow the slaughter...er...umm...profits...... to continue.

Yep....this is all one huge marketing scheme. 
 

A Democrat is voted in. Gun and ammo sales go crazy. 
 

The fear of anything getting passed, is a win for gun and ammo manufacturers. That why they donate to NRA and huge political marketing schemes creating fear around any type of legislation. 

[Dr. Strangelove]

16 hours ago, DevoHusker said:

This is where it gets complicated.

It isn't. 

 

Guns kill people. The 2nd amendment was designed so a well armed militia would be available for self defense in lieu of a standing army. We have a standing army.

 

The problem is that the soon-to-be-dissolved NRA convinced old white guys that owning guns is really just a way to express conservative identity. But they kill people, thousands each year. Make most guns illegal, and make the ownership a punishable offense.

 

If you love guns, find a new hobby. I don't feel bad for you. Call me when a hobby like knitting blankets kills 14 kids at a school (like the founding fathers intended, God bless).

[DevoHusker]

1 hour ago, Dr. Strangelove said:

It isn't. 

 

Guns kill people. The 2nd amendment was designed so a well armed militia would be available for self defense in lieu of a standing army. We have a standing army.

 

The problem is that the soon-to-be-dissolved NRA convinced old white guys that owning guns is really just a way to express conservative identity. But they kill people, thousands each year. Make most guns illegal, and make the ownership a punishable offense.

 

If you love guns, find a new hobby. I don't feel bad for you. Call me when a hobby like knitting blankets kills 14 kids at a school (like the founding fathers intended, God bless).

 

It is though.

 

I won't start with the typical "people with guns kill people" because that argument is cyclical. I know you mean well, as should we all, so that 14 kids at a school don't get shot. Your point of the archaic portion of the 2nd Amendment is valid with regards to outside threats. The part that true 2A zealots hang on to is in regards to threats from within. And there are hard core gun owners from the entire political spectrum, with the exception of the far left, so it is not just a conservative thing.

 

My point is more towards your earlier quote of "ban and confiscate". Here you say ban "most guns" and endorse making gun ownership illegal. What do you plan to do with/regards to the 400 million guns already in circulation? Who will you have confiscate those weapons? What guns would be acceptable to own, in your view? Do you think gun owners should be reimbursed, should the Government decide to seize them? Do you feel that the hard right folks will really forfeit them willingly should the other 80% of the population agree to go along? These are just a few of the questions that no one seems to be able to answer.

 

That is why I say this is where it gets complicated. 

[Decoy73]

A fact that I would hope we all can agree on is that with our current system, bad and/or at risk people have easy access to guns and that needs to change.  I'm pretty sure the 2A drafters didn't intend for this to happen.

 

For those known to be bad:  Universal background checks and red-flag laws Will help---seems like a no-brainer, right?  Why all the resistance from the GOP for something that's pretty damn common sense.

 

For those NOT previously known to be bad, how do we prevent them from committing gun violence????   This is where many of us disagree.

 

@DevoHusker is right.  There are so many guns already out in circulation, it would be impossible to know who has them or how many or what type.  We need to focus on gun sales and access going forward.

 

 

 

[DevoHusker]

2 minutes ago, Decoy73 said:

A fact that I would hope we all can agree on is that with our current system, bad and/or at risk people have easy access to guns and that needs to change.  I'm pretty sure the 2A drafters didn't intend for this to happen.

 

For those known to be bad:  Universal background checks and red-flag laws Will help---seems like a no-brainer, right?  Why all the resistance from the GOP for something that's pretty damn common sense.

 

For those NOT previously known to be bad, how do we prevent them from committing gun violence????   This is where many of us disagree.

 

@DevoHusker is right.  There are so many guns already out in circulation, it would be impossible to know who has them or how many or what type.  We need to focus on gun sales and access going forward.

 

 

 

Very similar to my views

[Archy1221]

On 5/27/2021 at 2:33 PM, commando said:

the republican party won't ever allow anything to happen towards any common sense solutions towards this problem.    obama in 8 years implemented 1 item towards solving this.....i forget if it was an EO or how it passed....but he had a system to allow government agencies to better communicate on who shouldn't have guns.   it was hailed as a huge victory by the NRA and the republican party when trump overturned that limited action.    we are going to continue with the onslaught because the NRA and gun manufacturers make huge money from gun sales and the republican party gets a lot of that money donated to them to continue to allow the slaughter...er...umm...profits...... to continue.

How does the NRA make money from gun sales? 

[Decoy73]

1 hour ago, Archy1221 said:

How does the NRA make money from gun sales? 

Gun and ammunition Advertisements from their media and publications.  Gun reviewers on YouTube and the like beat viewers with “please join the NRA”, blah, blah, blah.  I’ve seen it hundreds of times.  

[Archy1221]

8 hours ago, Decoy73 said:

Gun and ammunition Advertisements from their media and publications.  Gun reviewers on YouTube and the like beat viewers with “please join the NRA”, blah, blah, blah.  I’ve seen it hundreds of times.  

So what you are telling me is they don’t make money from actual gun sales and mostly from donations and advertisements if I read you correctly. 

[Decoy73]

2 hours ago, Archy1221 said:

So what you are telling me is they don’t make money from actual gun sales and mostly from donations and advertisements if I read you correctly. 

I have no idea if they make money directly through sales of guns.  While paying for a gun purchase in the past, I've been asked if I want to donate the the NRA.  That's just one example.  Directly or indirectly, the NRA benefits from guns sales.

[Guy Chamberlin]

It may have been posted on this thread already, or maybe I read it on Facebook, but somebody suggested introducing mandatory insurance for gun owners, essentially the way we mandate insurance for cars.  So your freedoms are entirely intact, but you and your insurance company will bear financial responsibility for any misdeeds of the machine while in your possession.  Now at least part of enforcement is turned over to insurance companies, which are very diligent, motivated, and apolitical about this sort of thing. You can think of a hundred ways this wouldn't work, but at the same time it would shift the debate to actuarial tables and personal responsibility, where real change might occur. The NRA would fight it, of course, but gun owners as portrayed by the NRA wouldn't have anything to worry about. 

 

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

On 5/28/2021 at 1:52 PM, DevoHusker said:

 

It is though.

 

I won't start with the typical "people with guns kill people" because that argument is cyclical. I know you mean well, as should we all, so that 14 kids at a school don't get shot. Your point of the archaic portion of the 2nd Amendment is valid with regards to outside threats. The part that true 2A zealots hang on to is in regards to threats from within. And there are hard core gun owners from the entire political spectrum, with the exception of the far left, so it is not just a conservative thing.

 

My point is more towards your earlier quote of "ban and confiscate". Here you say ban "most guns" and endorse making gun ownership illegal. What do you plan to do with/regards to the 400 million guns already in circulation? Who will you have confiscate those weapons? What guns would be acceptable to own, in your view? Do you think gun owners should be reimbursed, should the Government decide to seize them? Do you feel that the hard right folks will really forfeit them willingly should the other 80% of the population agree to go along? These are just a few of the questions that no one seems to be able to answer.

 

That is why I say this is where it gets complicated. 

I guess I don't see it as complicated. Owing 2 pounds of Marijuana is illegal, and if I'm found with that I will be punished. There's nothing stopping laws existing from preventing the ownership of guns. 

 

The government could provide a buyback program, although I'm apathetic on that personally. I'm not going to shed a tear for a guy who spent thousands on a gun collection. That person should've tied their white-consevative-identity to baseball cards instead.

 

As far as the insane maniac militia groups, take their guns. If they don't give them up, fine and incarcerate them.  It's super-duper scary to knock on their door because they think they're defending themselves from tyranny? Too bad. If a psychopath shoots a guy, prosecute them. 

 

It's only hard because Americans lack the political will power to actually try and form a more perfect union.