The Democrat Utopia

[Guy Chamberlin]

All I know is that California just suffered a simultaneous earthquake and hurricane, and there goes Sunny Joe BIden jetting off to Hawaii!

[Archy1221]

Democrat Utopia in action. 
 

 

[Archy1221]

This is the kind of BS bills that I’ve been talking about.  Why in the world does disaster relief have to be tied to Ukraine funding.   Utter horsesh$&.   Yet when someone doesn’t vote a for a bill like that, the other side (Dem’s) will be happy to say……see the R’s don’t support disaster relief for these poor Americans.   
 

 

[suh_fan93]

 

[nic]

Do most liberals believe what Bill Maher said below? I certainly consider him liberal, but I have made similar comments on this board, and have only received pushback for saying we should be colorblind. Is Maher no longer considered a liberal or even leaning left?

"You can be woke, with all the nonsense that that now implies, but don’t say that somehow it’s an extension of liberalism. Because it’s most often actually an undoing of liberalism. You can have your points of view and your positions on these things but don’t try and piggyback on what I always believe. I have always believed, as liberals do for example, in a colorblind society," Maher said. 

"That the goal is to not see race at all, anywhere for any reason," Maher continued. "That’s what liberals always believed all the way through Obama, going back [to] Kennedy, everybody, Martin Luther King. That’s not what the woke believe."

[Lorewarn]

MLK categorically did not believe in a colorblind society. He dreamt of a utopian colorblind future, and used it as an ideal to frame in contrast to where we are and always have been which demands for color to be seen and taken into account.

[Guy Chamberlin]

2 hours ago, nic said:

Do most liberals believe what Bill Maher said below? I certainly consider him liberal, but I have made similar comments on this board, and have only received pushback for saying we should be colorblind. Is Maher no longer considered a liberal or even leaning left?

 

To his credit, Maher makes trenchant and often comedic observations that cut both ways. Because he's taken swipes at liberals and liberalism, the rightwing has embraced him as one of them, ignoring that Maher is a crusading atheist among other inconvenient things. Liberals are less likely to ignore his wandering ideology. Not sure how or if Maher classifies himself. 

 

Maher is basically a freedom of speech purist and that has him leaning right on political correctness and cancel culture. Sometimes he has a point. But this take, where Maher equates woke-ism as obsessing over racial inequity, and that somehow that's at odds with the liberal goal of a colorblind society, is a pretty bad take at face value. 

 

Bill also has a reputation for being an a$$h@!e in real life, and that sometimes colors opinions of him. 

[Moiraine]

13 hours ago, nic said:

Do most liberals believe what Bill Maher said below? I certainly consider him liberal, but I have made similar comments on this board, and have only received pushback for saying we should be colorblind. Is Maher no longer considered a liberal or even leaning left?

"You can be woke, with all the nonsense that that now implies, but don’t say that somehow it’s an extension of liberalism. Because it’s most often actually an undoing of liberalism. You can have your points of view and your positions on these things but don’t try and piggyback on what I always believe. I have always believed, as liberals do for example, in a colorblind society," Maher said. 

"That the goal is to not see race at all, anywhere for any reason," Maher continued. "That’s what liberals always believed all the way through Obama, going back [to] Kennedy, everybody, Martin Luther King. That’s not what the woke believe."

 

 

He's been saying a lot of stupid s#!t lately. Maybe he's just getting old. What he's saying about not seeing race is a bunch of horses#!t, and I don't think he knows what woke means.

[Archy1221]

23 hours ago, nic said:

Do most liberals believe what Bill Maher said below? I certainly consider him liberal, but I have made similar comments on this board, and have only received pushback for saying we should be colorblind. Is Maher no longer considered a liberal or even leaning left?

"You can be woke, with all the nonsense that that now implies, but don’t say that somehow it’s an extension of liberalism. Because it’s most often actually an undoing of liberalism. You can have your points of view and your positions on these things but don’t try and piggyback on what I always believe. I have always believed, as liberals do for example, in a colorblind society," Maher said. 

"That the goal is to not see race at all, anywhere for any reason," Maher continued. "That’s what liberals always believed all the way through Obama, going back [to] Kennedy, everybody, Martin Luther King. That’s not what the woke believe."

You are right, we should be colorblind and Maher is right that the far left continually fantasizes about dividing people by race and that is increasingly becoming a part of the normal left too.   Unfortunately.  

[Guy Chamberlin]

1 hour ago, Archy1221 said:

You are right, we should be colorblind and Maher is right that the far left continually fantasizes about dividing people by race and that is increasingly becoming a part of the normal left too.   Unfortunately.  

 

I see no evidence of that. None. Of course you are conflating the "far left" way beyond their influence, but even then I challenge you to find a far lefty who wants to divide by race. What you will find is people who insist on bringing race into issues that involve race, and how irritating that is to people who want to pretend that race is no longer an issue. 

 

If you think we should be a colorblind society, be a sport and help us get there. 

[Archy1221]

43 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

 

I see no evidence of that. None. Of course you are conflating the "far left" way beyond their influence, but even then I challenge you to find a far lefty who wants to divide by race. What you will find is people who insist on bringing race into issues that involve race, and how irritating that is to people who want to pretend that race is no longer an issue. 

 

If you think we should be a colorblind society, be a sport and help us get there. 

 

[Guy Chamberlin]

s#!t. I forgot about the Jacobins. They hate liberals even more than conservatives hate liberals. 

 

It's still not about racial division. It's about hiding behind racism when the real issue is classism, and a system mainstream liberals really don't want to retool. If you're fighting structural racism, like these guys advocate, you're still fighting for inclusion, not division. 

 

If you want to know how much mainstream influence the Jacobin wing wields, they now consider Bernie Sanders a traitor to the cause. If you give any part of that two hour show a listen, these people are very smart and well-reasoned. They acknowledge the complexities that make smart, well-reasoned debate virtually impossible in this country.

[nic]

On 9/5/2023 at 12:49 PM, Guy Chamberlin said:

 

To his credit, Maher makes trenchant and often comedic observations that cut both ways. Because he's taken swipes at liberals and liberalism, the rightwing has embraced him as one of them, ignoring that Maher is a crusading atheist among other inconvenient things. Liberals are less likely to ignore his wandering ideology. Not sure how or if Maher classifies himself. 

 

Maher is basically a freedom of speech purist and that has him leaning right on political correctness and cancel culture. Sometimes he has a point. But this take, where Maher equates woke-ism as obsessing over racial inequity, and that somehow that's at odds with the liberal goal of a colorblind society, is a pretty bad take at face value. 

 

Bill also has a reputation for being an a$$h@!e in real life, and that sometimes colors opinions of him. 

Is he a comedian? ...or maybe a late night host. Either way, it makes sense that he is a free speech purist. It helps his rating...or maybe hurts. He complains about wokeism in all sorts of areas. Gender identity, free speech as you mentioned, new justice policies, you name it. He almost sounds like a conservative or maybe liberaterian.

[nic]

4 hours ago, Archy1221 said:

You are right, we should be colorblind and Maher is right that the far left continually fantasizes about dividing people by race and that is increasingly becoming a part of the normal left too.   Unfortunately.  

It certainly seems like there is more division based on race than there was even 5 years ago. 

[Guy Chamberlin]

1 hour ago, nic said:

It certainly seems like there is more division based on race than there was even 5 years ago. 

 

One might ask why a campaign for greater equity and inclusion is being called divisive. 

 

Also a bit jarring to see confederate flags, anti-semitism, and white Christian nationalism being openly displayed and endorsed as they haven't been in years, not to mention the rhetoric of the man who became president six years ago. 

 

TBH, Black Lives Matter may not have existed without cell phone cameras, graphically proving there was more division based on race than we wanted to believe. The fact that a lot of people don't want to talk about it is a pretty good reason to talk about it.