The P&R Plague Thread (Covid-19)

[knapplc]

Just now, Archy1221 said:

How so?  It’s age adjusted data.   Very appropriate to do considering the number #1 risk factor of Covid is age

 

Human life is far more important than economics, one of the three key factors they used. 

 

I posted why they're wrong above. 

[Guy Chamberlin]

2 hours ago, Jason Sitoke said:

Certainly seems to depend on which flavor of COVID you're talking about currently.

 

I think all flavors share some overlap, but the most recent flavor isn't out of the "no worse than the flu" woods yet. 

 

COVID burnout allows us to feel encouraged about 800 deaths a day, but that has never been a good number, just a number that was better than 2,000.  The current spikes in New York, Washington DC and pretty much the whole Northeast remind us it's not over, but if we're smart it should never be as deadly again. 

 

I think it's totally fair game to rethink the efficacy of the shutdowns, figure in the psychological damage of remote learning for kids, even the efficacy of mask-wearing (helpful, but not a panacea).  But the data is in on vaccinated vs. non-vaccinated hospitalizations and deaths, and there is a clear Red State correlation, right down to voter Zip Codes. If we could at least agree on that, America could start getting smarter about a lot of things. 

[Archy1221]

53 minutes ago, knapplc said:

 

Human life is far more important than economics, one of the three key factors they used. 

 

I posted why they're wrong above. 

You also posted a raw number stat on deaths that provide no context to what that number means based on how the virus attacks its most vulnerable host.   
 

If State A has 80% population under age 65and State B has 40% population over age 65, which State is going to have the best per capita death rate (least deaths)???   It’s kinda an important distinction when one looks at a State’s response.    
 

It’s why the numbers you posted have little bearing when looking at a States response.  The other metrics are important just not as important.  A functioning society is vital to human life.   

[Dr. Strangelove]

3 hours ago, Archy1221 said:

Third…I’ll pass on taking voting advice from you.  Especially based on your complete distortion of the vaccine statement you just made.  Especially considering “my party” was in power of the executive branch and responsible for creating an atmosphere that the vaccine could be created AND approved in such record time allowing the country to save hundreds of thousands of lives.   

Example of their attempts to save lives:

 

https://www.npr.org/2021/09/22/1039613351/desantis-florida-surgeon-general-vaccine-mandates

 

Here's a member of your party saying it out loud:

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/07/16/utah-cox-vaccine-propaganda/

 

Your party failed miserably. The biggest accomplishment was developing a vaccine - that a Democrat Administration would've done too - and immediately politicized it in a way that has killed thousands. Congrats! 

[knapplc]

16 minutes ago, Archy1221 said:

You also posted a raw number stat on deaths that provide no context to what that number means based on how the virus attacks its most vulnerable host.   
 

If State A has 80% population under age 65and State B has 40% population over age 65, which State is going to have the best per capita death rate (least deaths)???   It’s kinda an important distinction when one looks at a State’s response.    
 

It’s why the numbers you posted have little bearing when looking at a States response.  The other metrics are important just not as important.  A functioning society is vital to human life.   

 

21% of Floridians are over age 65

17% of New Yorkers are over age 65

 

Despite having only four more percent of their population over age 65, Florida had a whopping 8% more deaths than New York.

[nic]

4 hours ago, knapplc said:

 

 

Nothing like a heavily right-biased source to tell us that right-wingers really nailed Covid while those wacky libs failed utterly.  

I am not sure who NBER is….trying to actually read the report, but didn’t get to it yet. Never mind…I caught up.

[Scarlet]

11 minutes ago, knapplc said:

 

21% of Floridians are over age 65

17% of New Yorkers are over age 65

 

Despite having only four more percent of their population over age 65, Florida had a whopping 8% more deaths than New York.

Let alone Florida is the Sunshine State where you don't have to be cooped up all winter if we're going to pick and choose variables.  

[Jason Sitoke]

55 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

 

I think all flavors share some overlap, but the most recent flavor isn't out of the "no worse than the flu" woods yet. 

 

COVID burnout allows us to feel encouraged about 800 deaths a day, but that has never been a good number, just a number that was better than 2,000.  The current spikes in New York, Washington DC and pretty much the whole Northeast remind us it's not over, but if we're smart it should never be as deadly again. 

 

I think it's totally fair game to rethink the efficacy of the shutdowns, figure in the psychological damage of remote learning for kids, even the efficacy of mask-wearing (helpful, but not a panacea).  But the data is in on vaccinated vs. non-vaccinated hospitalizations and deaths, and there is a clear Red State correlation, right down to voter Zip Codes. If we could at least agree on that, America could start getting smarter about a lot of things. 

Not to get too literal, but if we're talking about infection-mortality...BA.1 was similar if not less deadly than the flu.  I agree that its infectiousness caused it to burden the health care system significantly more than a typical flu would.

 

I've heard you say the northeast is getting 'hammered' and that there is a spike in the northeast.  These are subjective terms, but still I don't see those being indicative descriptors given the case/hospitalization data I see currently.  There is an uptick in incidences as far as I can tell.

[Scarlet]

7 minutes ago, Jason Sitoke said:

Not to get too literal, but if we're talking about infection-mortality...BA.1 was similar if not less deadly than the flu.  I agree that its infectiousness caused it to burden the health care system significantly more than a typical flu would.

 

I've heard you say the northeast is getting 'hammered' and that there is a spike in the northeast.  These are subjective terms, but still I don't see those being indicative descriptors given the case/hospitalization data I see currently.  There is an uptick in incidences as far as I can tell.

Interesting but do you have a link to BA1 being less deadly than the flu?  This link shows it's 40% more lethal but doesn't say which strain of Omicron and the study isn't peer reviewed.  

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/fortune.com/2022/03/03/omicron-less-lethal-covid-19-variants-40-deadlier-than-flu/amp/

[Archy1221]

24 minutes ago, knapplc said:

 

21% of Floridians are over age 65

17% of New Yorkers are over age 65

 

Despite having only four more percent of their population over age 65, Florida had a whopping 8% more deaths than New York.

I understand you used 65 because of my hypothetical, but if you want to factor in age for Covid deaths and compare those populations it would be age 70 as that is where the CFR starts to really climb.   

More deaths with a smaller population.  

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1191568/reported-deaths-from-covid-by-age-us/

Florida percent of 70+yr olds—-14.7%
New York percent of 70+ yr olds—-8.8-%

 

Here is a company that did similar fatality models based on age.    Tell me if they are Koch funded with an agenda as I don’t know. 

https://www.bioinformaticscro.com/blog/states-ranked-by-age-adjusted-covid-deaths/

 

 

Raw death numbers don’t tell you the whole story.  

[Scarlet]

7 minutes ago, Archy1221 said:

I understand you used 65 because of my hypothetical, but if you want to factor in age for Covid deaths and compare those populations it would be age 70 as that is where the CFR starts to really climb.   

More deaths with a smaller population.  

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1191568/reported-deaths-from-covid-by-age-us/

Florida percent of 70+yr olds—-14.7%
New York percent of 70+ yr olds—-8.8-%

 

Here is a company that did similar fatality models based on age.    Tell me if they are Koch funded with an agenda as I don’t know. 

https://www.bioinformaticscro.com/blog/states-ranked-by-age-adjusted-covid-deaths/

 

 

Raw death numbers don’t tell you the whole story.  

The bioinformatics link shows 9 out the top 11 states being red states.  I'm being generous calling Arizona a blue state too.  

[Archy1221]

9 minutes ago, Scarlet said:

The bioinformatics link shows 9 out the top 11 states being red states.  I'm being generous calling Arizona a blue state too.  

Yes that’s correct.   
(AZ has 2 Dem Sen and voted D for President). 

 

The other study presented also takes into account other Covid risk factors along with Age I believe….i.e..diabetes prevelance, possibly minority % of population.    2 different ways of looking at it.   They then added in the other two pillars to come up with an overall assessment.  

[Scarlet]

26 minutes ago, Archy1221 said:

I understand you used 65 because of my hypothetical, but if you want to factor in age for Covid deaths and compare those populations it would be age 70 as that is where the CFR starts to really climb.   

More deaths with a smaller population.  

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1191568/reported-deaths-from-covid-by-age-us/

Florida percent of 70+yr olds—-14.7%
New York percent of 70+ yr olds—-8.8-%

 

Here is a company that did similar fatality models based on age.    Tell me if they are Koch funded with an agenda as I don’t know. 

https://www.bioinformaticscro.com/blog/states-ranked-by-age-adjusted-covid-deaths/

 

 

Raw death numbers don’t tell you the whole story.  

Or another way to look at it is that 10 out the 12 states with the least age related deaths per 100000 were blue states.  

[Scarlet]

5 minutes ago, Archy1221 said:

Yes that’s correct.   
(AZ has 2 Dem Sen and voted D for President). 

 

The other study presented also takes into account other Covid risk factors along with Age I believe….i.e..diabetes prevelance, possibly minority % of population.    2 different ways of looking at it.   They then added in the other two pillars to come up with an overall assessment.  

Vote D for president huh?  Can you please pass that on to those in your party that continue to try to subvert our democracy?  Thanks

[knapplc]

2 minutes ago, Scarlet said:

Or another way to look at it is that 10 out the 12 states with the least age related deaths per 100000 were blue states.  

 

Which is why factors unrelated to keeping people safe from Covid are added in to that right-wing funded "study" that right-wing media is pushing.

 

You have to factor and factor and factor to make Red states look better. Just looking at straight-up responses doesn't cut it.