Trump's America

[Enhance]

 

The video of the shooting is on YouTube. I don't usually look for that kind of stuff, but had trouble ignoring what's happening. Absolutely shocking.

[Moiraine]

1 minute ago, RedDenver said:

The 25th Amendment says otherwise.

 

 

I'm surprised we would potentially have this argument again given today's events. I mean I suppose they could escape the building and do a vote over zoom, but afterward Trump would have to willingly leave.

[RedDenver]

2 minutes ago, Moiraine said:

 

 

I'm surprised we would potentially have this argument again given today's events. I mean I suppose they could escape the building and do a vote over zoom, but afterward Trump would have to willingly leave.

Trump's Cabinet can enact the 25th Amendment. 2/3rds of Congress would be needed later to make it permanent. And it doesn't involve Trump leaving - the Presidency would leave him no matter where he is.

[Moiraine]

Just now, RedDenver said:

Trump's Cabinet can enact the 25th Amendment. 2/3rds of Congress would be needed later to make it permanent. And it doesn't involve Trump leaving - the Presidency would leave him no matter where he is.

 

 

Ok, so they could maybe do that vote on the internet. Then the military, if they accept it, could act on Pence's orders. Right?

[RedDenver]

Just now, Moiraine said:

 

 

Ok, so they could maybe do that vote on the internet. Then the military, if they accept it, could act on Pence's orders. Right?

Congress can vote from anywhere they have quorum including wherever they are stashed now. The Cabinet can enact the 25th Amendment from anywhere presumably.

 

https://www.constituteproject.org/constitution/United_States_of_America_1992

Quote

 

Whenever the Vice President and a majority of either the principal officers of the executive departments or of such other body as Congress may by law provide, transmit to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House of Representatives their written declaration that the President is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office, the Vice President shall immediately assume the powers and duties of the office as Acting President.

 

Thereafter, when the President transmits to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House of Representatives his written declaration that no inability exists, he shall resume the powers and duties of his office unless the Vice President and a majority of either the principal officers of the executive department or of such other body as Congress may by law provide, transmit within four days to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House of Representatives their written declaration that the President is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office. Thereupon Congress shall decide the issue, assembling within forty-eight hours for that purpose if not in session. If the Congress, within twenty-one days after receipt of the latter written declaration, or, if Congress is not in session, within twenty-one days after Congress is required to assemble, determines by two-thirds vote of both Houses that the President is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office, the Vice President shall continue to discharge the same as Acting President; otherwise, the President shall resume the powers and duties of his office.

 

 

[Moiraine]

Just now, RedDenver said:

Congress can vote from anywhere they have quorum including wherever they are stashed now. The Cabinet can enact the 25th Amendment from anywhere presumably.

 

https://www.constituteproject.org/constitution/United_States_of_America_1992

 

 

 

Could they also convict him and have it be immediate? He's already been impeached. I just don't trust his cabinet to do it. Whatever it is the military has to also accept it. 

[RedDenver]

Just now, Moiraine said:

 

 

Could they also convict him and have it be immediate? He's already been impeached. I just don't trust his cabinet to do it. Whatever it is the military has to also accept it. 

What's your obsession with the military here? They're sworn to the Constitution and they don't provide protection for the President anyway.

[Moiraine]

5 minutes ago, RedDenver said:

What's your obsession with the military here? They're sworn to the Constitution and they don't provide protection for the President anyway.

 

 

What's your obsession with the rules always applying? Governments have been overthrown many times before. Rules don't apply when that happens. Right now we are in a situation where there's hesitation or even denial of sending the national guard in to protect the top leaders in our country. The national guard may be required to step in and right now they're possibly being told not to. The military accepting Biden's orders once a conviction happens or the 25th amendment is used, or January 20th arrives after the vote certification, is obviously a huge piece of the puzzle. They are humans and have a will of their own. There's an extremely high chance they will do what they're supposed to but let's not pretend there's a 100% chance that will happen.

Edit: I see Trump has supposedly, finally ordered the national guard in... but hopefully for the right purpose.

[knapplc]

I've been called a "never trumper" on this here website by several members. 

 

You're damned right I am. We told you what he was in 2015. We told you he needed to be reined in in 2018. 

 

You ignored us, or called us "libruls" or whatever else you thought was an epithet. 

 

Here's the fruit of all your bulls#!t. This is trump's America.

 

 

[RedDenver]

45 minutes ago, Moiraine said:

 

 

What's your obsession with the rules always applying? Governments have been overthrown many times before. Rules don't apply when that happens. Right now we are in a situation where there's hesitation or even denial of sending the national guard in to protect the top leaders in our country. The national guard may be required to step in and right now they're possibly being told not to. The military accepting Biden's orders once a conviction happens or the 25th amendment is used, or January 20th arrives after the vote certification, is obviously a huge piece of the puzzle. They are humans and have a will of their own. There's an extremely high chance they will do what they're supposed to but let's not pretend there's a 100% chance that will happen.

Edit: I see Trump has supposedly, finally ordered the national guard in... but hopefully for the right purpose.

I think you're jumping to conclusions on issues that haven't arrived yet. Capitol Police were already clearing the building long before National Guards will show up. There are very, very few democracies that have been overthrown by military coup - it's the voters who vote to overthrow their own democracy.

 

Trump is done, and it won't take the military to do it. The issue is the damage being done in his name by these terrorists, but they are less numerous than the rest of us.

[SECHusker]

 

[ZRod]

29 minutes ago, SECHusker said:

 

Uh... Does that mean????

[Omaha-Husker]

Don't they say leave it better than you found it?

 

Edit: I guess that is Obama's inauguration. Lets call it Before Trump/Post Trump America.

 

Trump's 1st day:

 

One of his last days:

 

[RedDenver]

 

[BigRedBuster]

I’m old enough to remember a time when Hillary was mocked for describing some Trump supporters as “baskets of deplorables “. 
 

I think we are seeing who she was talking about.