The Nebraska Way

[Elf]

 

 

Bo had a wife beater on his staff, I never saw the out pouring of hate toward him. What if he had killed her right before the bowl game? Would that have left a stain on our image?? Nobody is perfect in this life. A little fender bender nearly 10 years after his last offense does not need to get him discarded for someone else that likely has skeletons in their closet.

 

This is easily fixable. Riley suspends him for a few months to send a message to him and the players that nobody is above the rules and the AD redoes his contract to stipulate NO Alcohol consumption for the remainder of the time he is employed by the University, or it is automatic dismissal.

Different scenarios because the offense occurred later. And not relevant.

 

We already talked about TO. You have your facts wrong. It's a bad idea going with a version of events based on a single prosecutor's press release.

 

Tom hid a gun in his desk for Abdul Muhammad, he wrote about it in his book. My facts are facts. You just deny and put your opinion out as fact.

 

Saying Tom hid the gun in his desk for Muhammad makes it sound as if Osborne knew the weapon had been used in the commission of a crime and helped cover it up by "hiding" the weapon. This is a false narrative. While Osborne never "hid" weapons for his players he did hold onto them for his players from time to time. There is a huge difference between the two.

[NM11046]

 

 

 

Bo had a wife beater on his staff, I never saw the out pouring of hate toward him. What if he had killed her right before the bowl game? Would that have left a stain on our image?? Nobody is perfect in this life. A little fender bender nearly 10 years after his last offense does not need to get him discarded for someone else that likely has skeletons in their closet.

 

This is easily fixable. Riley suspends him for a few months to send a message to him and the players that nobody is above the rules and the AD redoes his contract to stipulate NO Alcohol consumption for the remainder of the time he is employed by the University, or it is automatic dismissal.

Different scenarios because the offense occurred later. And not relevant.

 

We already talked about TO. You have your facts wrong. It's a bad idea going with a version of events based on a single prosecutor's press release.

 

Tom hid a gun in his desk for Abdul Muhammad, he wrote about it in his book. My facts are facts. You just deny and put your opinion out as fact.

 

Saying Tom hid the gun in his desk for Muhammad makes it sound as if Osborne knew the weapon had been used in the commission of a crime and helped cover it up by "hiding" the weapon. This is a false narrative. While Osborne never "hid" weapons for his players he did hold onto them for his players from time to time. There is a huge difference between the two.

 

I didn't want to get into this pissing match, but I have to question ... why would TO "hold onto" weapons for his players?

[cm husker]

 

 

 

 

Bo had a wife beater on his staff, I never saw the out pouring of hate toward him. What if he had killed her right before the bowl game? Would that have left a stain on our image?? Nobody is perfect in this life. A little fender bender nearly 10 years after his last offense does not need to get him discarded for someone else that likely has skeletons in their closet.

 

This is easily fixable. Riley suspends him for a few months to send a message to him and the players that nobody is above the rules and the AD redoes his contract to stipulate NO Alcohol consumption for the remainder of the time he is employed by the University, or it is automatic dismissal.

Different scenarios because the offense occurred later. And not relevant.

 

We already talked about TO. You have your facts wrong. It's a bad idea going with a version of events based on a single prosecutor's press release.

 

Tom hid a gun in his desk for Abdul Muhammad, he wrote about it in his book. My facts are facts. You just deny and put your opinion out as fact.

 

Saying Tom hid the gun in his desk for Muhammad makes it sound as if Osborne knew the weapon had been used in the commission of a crime and helped cover it up by "hiding" the weapon. This is a false narrative. While Osborne never "hid" weapons for his players he did hold onto them for his players from time to time. There is a huge difference between the two.

 

I didn't want to get into this pissing match, but I have to question ... why would TO "hold onto" weapons for his players?

 

 

It was a player and it wasn't Muhammad. And he wasn't holding it for him with the intention of giving it back to the player.

 

It was brought to him by a staff member after questions were raised that the player had been involved in a shooting (eventually that player was determined to be not guilty). They "held it" for two days in a secure place between the time they notified campus police that it had been turned in and the day that police came to retrieve it.

 

He didn't hide it or obstruct justice. No one ever questioned, investigated or even considered charging him or his assistant with such actions.

 

A zealous prosecutor gave a quote that fit the narrative of a "nice coach corrupted by a win at all costs attitude." That narrative is easy to understand so people ran with it. Unfortunately, prosecutors are rarely punished for what would be defamatory statements if made against a private citizen.

 

This episode has been rehashed and reexamined numerous times, but the myths persist, just like they do around "county scholarships" because they fit a more interesting narrative than the actual story.

[knapplc]

It's a false equivalency to say that people who think Osborne was a man of integrity in the LP situation also think that he, or other "founding fathers" of the football program were some type of infallible angels. I don't think Osborne, and especially not Devaney, were angels. I also think TO acted highly improperly in the gun hiding incident. But to claim TO played LP just to win ignores all sorts of available information and would indicate some type of hidden agenda. Personally I find it rather disgusting. I hope it is because those persons just don't know any better or just can't get beyond the wrong thing(s) LP has done. Most of it seems to be centered on the harm done to Kate and the idea that abusing women should not be tolerated. I can respect that. But then making the logic leap that TO had no integrity for trying to help LP and only did it to win. That's some serious bullsh#t right there. If you feel that way, you just plain don't know what you're talking about or are unwilling to acknowledge all of the available information. But please feel free to continue sharing your foolish thoughts. I don't expect it to change with some of you but I'll never understand why.

There's a lot of truth and cobbled together misinformation going on here.

 

Every effort to reasonably point out that Osborne made mistakes has been rebutted, in this very thread. Reasonable assertions that Osborne is human, even. It's a leap to claim that those people think Osborne is "an infallible angel," but there's good evidence of it.

 

Osborne and Devaney were not angels, and Osborne did act improperly with the gun incident (the public one).

 

To claim Osborne played Phillips "just to win" is supported by as much available information as it would take to believe that Osborne solely had benign intentions. It takes no more "hidden agenda" to believe either story. Personally, I think Osborne wanted to win, and wanted to help Phillips. The world is hardly ever black and white.

 

It is not disgusting to think Osborne played Phillips out of a desire to win a national championship. It is, perhaps, disgusting to have minimized the brutality of what Phillips did to Kate McEwen, and to obfuscate the situation, and to have played Phillips at all. Those are all very possibly disgusting actions on the part of Osborne - and he could have had a hidden agenda. Again, it's likely not the case, and Dr. Tom was doing what he thought was best. But again, he's not a perfect man.

 

It is not a big leap to think a college coach whose job has routinely been threatened would play an unsavory but talented player. It's the kind of thing that Nebraska Fan has no problem thinking of someone like, say, Art Briles. It's "disgusting" to think that of Osborne for Husker Fans, but they're alone in that.

 

I have a pretty good idea what I'm talking about, when I bother to talk around here. I'm not forcing any agenda, I don't dislike Osborne (see my avatar), and I don't want to besmirch this program, Osborne or the fans. But there are realities to face, and while it may be uncomfortable for some to face those, labeling people who are willing as "disgusting" isn't really productive.

 

I will continue to share my thoughts. You're welcome to consider them foolish. So it goes.

[NM11046]

 

 

 

 

 

Bo had a wife beater on his staff, I never saw the out pouring of hate toward him. What if he had killed her right before the bowl game? Would that have left a stain on our image?? Nobody is perfect in this life. A little fender bender nearly 10 years after his last offense does not need to get him discarded for someone else that likely has skeletons in their closet.

 

This is easily fixable. Riley suspends him for a few months to send a message to him and the players that nobody is above the rules and the AD redoes his contract to stipulate NO Alcohol consumption for the remainder of the time he is employed by the University, or it is automatic dismissal.

Different scenarios because the offense occurred later. And not relevant.

 

We already talked about TO. You have your facts wrong. It's a bad idea going with a version of events based on a single prosecutor's press release.

 

Tom hid a gun in his desk for Abdul Muhammad, he wrote about it in his book. My facts are facts. You just deny and put your opinion out as fact.

 

Saying Tom hid the gun in his desk for Muhammad makes it sound as if Osborne knew the weapon had been used in the commission of a crime and helped cover it up by "hiding" the weapon. This is a false narrative. While Osborne never "hid" weapons for his players he did hold onto them for his players from time to time. There is a huge difference between the two.

 

I didn't want to get into this pissing match, but I have to question ... why would TO "hold onto" weapons for his players?

 

 

It was a player and it wasn't Muhammad. And he wasn't holding it for him with the intention of giving it back to the player.

 

It was brought to him by a staff member after questions were raised that the player had been involved in a shooting (eventually that player was determined to be not guilty). They "held it" for two days in a secure place between the time they notified campus police that it had been turned in and the day that police came to retrieve it.

 

He didn't hide it or obstruct justice. No one ever questioned, investigated or even considered charging him or his assistant with such actions.

 

A zealous prosecutor gave a quote that fit the narrative of a "nice coach corrupted by a win at all costs attitude." That narrative is easy to understand so people ran with it. Unfortunately, prosecutors are rarely punished for what would be defamatory statements if made against a private citizen.

 

This episode has been rehashed and reexamined numerous times, but the myths persist, just like they do around "county scholarships" because they fit a more interesting narrative than the actual story.

 

I read the comments above to say that unrelated to the Muhammad situation he held weapons "from time to time". Did I misunderstand Elf?

[Elf]

 

 

 

 

Bo had a wife beater on his staff, I never saw the out pouring of hate toward him. What if he had killed her right before the bowl game? Would that have left a stain on our image?? Nobody is perfect in this life. A little fender bender nearly 10 years after his last offense does not need to get him discarded for someone else that likely has skeletons in their closet.

 

This is easily fixable. Riley suspends him for a few months to send a message to him and the players that nobody is above the rules and the AD redoes his contract to stipulate NO Alcohol consumption for the remainder of the time he is employed by the University, or it is automatic dismissal.

Different scenarios because the offense occurred later. And not relevant.

 

We already talked about TO. You have your facts wrong. It's a bad idea going with a version of events based on a single prosecutor's press release.

 

Tom hid a gun in his desk for Abdul Muhammad, he wrote about it in his book. My facts are facts. You just deny and put your opinion out as fact.

 

Saying Tom hid the gun in his desk for Muhammad makes it sound as if Osborne knew the weapon had been used in the commission of a crime and helped cover it up by "hiding" the weapon. This is a false narrative. While Osborne never "hid" weapons for his players he did hold onto them for his players from time to time. There is a huge difference between the two.

 

I didn't want to get into this pissing match, but I have to question ... why would TO "hold onto" weapons for his players?

 

 

When I was in the service you could live in base housing with dependents and keep weapons in your home but if you lived in the barracks (aka dorm) the rules were different (none allowed). While I don't know for sure, I suspect the rules are similar for living in a University dorm as opposed to living off campus.

[Red Five]

I hope for damn sure that guns aren't allowed in the dorms.

 

And why would anyone living in the dorm need a gun?

[JJ Husker]

 

It's a false equivalency to say that people who think Osborne was a man of integrity in the LP situation also think that he, or other "founding fathers" of the football program were some type of infallible angels. I don't think Osborne, and especially not Devaney, were angels. I also think TO acted highly improperly in the gun hiding incident. But to claim TO played LP just to win ignores all sorts of available information and would indicate some type of hidden agenda. Personally I find it rather disgusting. I hope it is because those persons just don't know any better or just can't get beyond the wrong thing(s) LP has done. Most of it seems to be centered on the harm done to Kate and the idea that abusing women should not be tolerated. I can respect that. But then making the logic leap that TO had no integrity for trying to help LP and only did it to win. That's some serious bullsh#t right there. If you feel that way, you just plain don't know what you're talking about or are unwilling to acknowledge all of the available information. But please feel free to continue sharing your foolish thoughts. I don't expect it to change with some of you but I'll never understand why.

There's a lot of truth and cobbled together misinformation going on here.

 

Every effort to reasonably point out that Osborne made mistakes has been rebutted, in this very thread. Reasonable assertions that Osborne is human, even. It's a leap to claim that those people think Osborne is "an infallible angel," but there's good evidence of it.

 

Osborne and Devaney were not angels, and Osborne did act improperly with the gun incident (the public one).

 

To claim Osborne played Phillips "just to win" is supported by as much available information as it would take to believe that Osborne solely had benign intentions. It takes no more "hidden agenda" to believe either story. Personally, I think Osborne wanted to win, and wanted to help Phillips. The world is hardly ever black and white.

 

It is not disgusting to think Osborne played Phillips out of a desire to win a national championship. It is, perhaps, disgusting to have minimized the brutality of what Phillips did to Kate McEwen, and to obfuscate the situation, and to have played Phillips at all. Those are all very possibly disgusting actions on the part of Osborne - and he could have had a hidden agenda. Again, it's likely not the case, and Dr. Tom was doing what he thought was best. But again, he's not a perfect man.

 

It is not a big leap to think a college coach whose job has routinely been threatened would play an unsavory but talented player. It's the kind of thing that Nebraska Fan has no problem thinking of someone like, say, Art Briles. It's "disgusting" to think that of Osborne for Husker Fans, but they're alone in that.

 

I have a pretty good idea what I'm talking about, when I bother to talk around here. I'm not forcing any agenda, I don't dislike Osborne (see my avatar), and I don't want to besmirch this program, Osborne or the fans. But there are realities to face, and while it may be uncomfortable for some to face those, labeling people who are willing as "disgusting" isn't really productive.

 

I will continue to share my thoughts. You're welcome to consider them foolish. So it goes.

 

Knapp, you at least admit that he did it to help Phillips, among other reasons. I also acknowledge he wanted to win and that factored into playing LP. But, when a person says he only I did what he did to win, that is when I start to have a problem with it. Yes, that has been proven wrong in hindsight, and it is debatable that it may have been wrong at the time, and yes he is not perfect. But until the day I die I will believe that his primary concern, even more important than winning (aka the book "More than Winning") was to help LP. I do not believe he would have played him without that reasoning or for the sole purpose of winning at all costs. To me that motivation makes all the difference in the world in considering if he acted with integrity in that situation.

 

I think one of the components people forget to consider is that TO laid out an action plan for LP to follow. Part of that plan was the reward of earning back playing time if he followed through and didn't screw up any more. By all accounts LP met the requirements, was a stellar team mate, and did what was stipulated. TO may have screwed the pooch by making that offer or by trying to help him at all but can we blame him for keeping his word with LP and subsequently playing him?

 

Look, I've got no dog in the fight on his actions or legacy either way. I just hate to see people, notably Husker fans, skew it into some extreme, knowingly distasteful action all predicated on winning at all costs. I just don't see it that way and I don't think you do either. If you really felt that way, I doubt you would use his avatar. I just cannot read all that Tom has written on the situation and come away thinking that he did it just to win. That is what some people claim and I think they are dead wrong about it.

 

Anyway /rant. Been through this one way too many times.

[knapplc]

+1, JJ. I think in general we agree on the situation.

 

 

 

My theory on "The Nebraska Way" is that people project their best good intentions on the program. They want to cheer for something respectable and good because they feel they are respectable and good.

It's why people take it so personally when bad things happen to our coaches or players. It is personal, because they've chosen this team to reflect a portion of themselves. Their sports teams are a mirror.

It's good that people argue so passionately about this or that aspect of the team. It means they have strong feelings of self-worth, and in moderation that's admirable.

As long as we realize we're all fans of the same team in the end, conversations like this can be OK.

[Cdog923]

Christ on a crutch, is it Sept. 3rd yet?

[Stumpy1]

cm during this whole entertaining discussion!!!

 

[fb30]

The only thing TO is guilty of is careing for his players to much. He had Scott Baldwin living with him and his family.

[hskrfan4life]

I hope for damn sure that guns aren't allowed in the dorms.

 

And why would anyone living in the dorm need a gun?

Because of the wild and rabid chickens that were captured, tested on and tourtered 50 years ago in a sacrifice to make Nebraska good in football.

 

IT'S A DAMN FACT!

 

source: www.rickrolled.com

Other other source: www.huskers.com/chickens

[Elf]

I hope for damn sure that guns aren't allowed in the dorms.

 

And why would anyone living in the dorm need a gun?

Ideally, you wouldn't but we live in a world that is far from ideal.

[Elf]

cm during this whole entertaining discussion!!!

 

goalposts.gif

I just swiped your emoticon.