The General Election

[BigRedBuster]

 

 

 

What cover-up or smearing are you referencing in regards to Hillary's actions?

 

Are you saying those actions are more reprehensible than Donald cheating on and raping Ivana? Have you read her deposition excerpt?

 

Umm...have you been living under a rock. Hillary knew about all of Bill's affairs and rapes and was central to ensuring it was swept under the rug.

 

http://thefederalist.com/2015/09/21/hillary-clinton-is-no-friend-to-sexual-assault-survivors/

 

http://www.thepoliticalinsider.com/every-clinton-sex-assault-victim/

 

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/juanita-broaddrick-hillary-clinton-hid-bills-infidelities/article/2592109

 

Meanwhile, the "rape" and deposition you are referring true has been proven to be unfounded in Ivana's own words. Here is what she said at the end of 2015. You are trying to diffuse the real tragedy of Bill's abuse of many women with this accusation by a spouse who was preparing to get divorced. Do you really think that Juanita Brodderick and Paula Jones will be coming out to release a similar statement?

 

Update 7/28/15 9:50 AM: Ivana Trump released a statement Tuesday morning to CNN.

“I have recently read some comments attributed to me from nearly 30 years ago at a time of very high tension during my divorce from Donald. The story is totally without merit. Donald and I are the best of friends and together have raised three children that we love and are very proud of. I have nothing but fondness for Donald and wish him the best of luck on his campaign. Incidentally, I think he would make an incredible president.”

Ironically, Ivana says a story based on her own words in a divorce deposition are “totally without merit.”

In further irony, Trump is distancing himself from his lawyer.

“Mr. Trump speaks for Mr. Trump and nobody but Mr. Trump speaks for him,” a campaign source told CNN.

 

I personally think everyone involved in this...."Bill, HIllary, Trump, Ivana......are really really screwed up people and are extremely out of touch with reality. Good Lord....why don't we just elect one of the Kardashians?

 

Both Bill and Donald are total pieces of sh#t and I for the life of me can't understand why anyone (especially women) would defend their actions.

 

 

BRB-I would rather be discussing other topics but was responding to a post made earlier on this topic. I find Bill's action and Trumps words indefensible, but I also find Hillary's actions toward these women indefensible too. She is claiming the mantle of being a champion for women's rights, and for years women have been victimized, yet when she had the opportunity to accept what Bill had done and get away from him, she chose otherwise, stuck by his side, and smeared these women. I've stated in other posts in prior weeks that, of all that I have disagreements with Hillary about, this is perhaps what sticks the most.

 

You and I agree about having very little respect for both Trump and Hillary. My "defend" comment wasn't as much towards you as towards others.

[huKSer]

 

 

 

 

What cover-up or smearing are you referencing in regards to Hillary's actions?

 

Are you saying those actions are more reprehensible than Donald cheating on and raping Ivana? Have you read her deposition excerpt?

 

Umm...have you been living under a rock. Hillary knew about all of Bill's affairs and rapes and was central to ensuring it was swept under the rug.

 

http://thefederalist.com/2015/09/21/hillary-clinton-is-no-friend-to-sexual-assault-survivors/

 

http://www.thepoliticalinsider.com/every-clinton-sex-assault-victim/

 

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/juanita-broaddrick-hillary-clinton-hid-bills-infidelities/article/2592109

 

Meanwhile, the "rape" and deposition you are referring true has been proven to be unfounded in Ivana's own words. Here is what she said at the end of 2015. You are trying to diffuse the real tragedy of Bill's abuse of many women with this accusation by a spouse who was preparing to get divorced. Do you really think that Juanita Brodderick and Paula Jones will be coming out to release a similar statement?

 

Update 7/28/15 9:50 AM: Ivana Trump released a statement Tuesday morning to CNN.

“I have recently read some comments attributed to me from nearly 30 years ago at a time of very high tension during my divorce from Donald. The story is totally without merit. Donald and I are the best of friends and together have raised three children that we love and are very proud of. I have nothing but fondness for Donald and wish him the best of luck on his campaign. Incidentally, I think he would make an incredible president.”

Ironically, Ivana says a story based on her own words in a divorce deposition are “totally without merit.”

In further irony, Trump is distancing himself from his lawyer.

“Mr. Trump speaks for Mr. Trump and nobody but Mr. Trump speaks for him,” a campaign source told CNN.

 

I personally think everyone involved in this...."Bill, HIllary, Trump, Ivana......are really really screwed up people and are extremely out of touch with reality. Good Lord....why don't we just elect one of the Kardashians?

 

Both Bill and Donald are total pieces of sh#t and I for the life of me can't understand why anyone (especially women) would defend their actions.

 

 

BRB-I would rather be discussing other topics but was responding to a post made earlier on this topic. I find Bill's action and Trumps words indefensible, but I also find Hillary's actions toward these women indefensible too. She is claiming the mantle of being a champion for women's rights, and for years women have been victimized, yet when she had the opportunity to accept what Bill had done and get away from him, she chose otherwise, stuck by his side, and smeared these women. I've stated in other posts in prior weeks that, of all that I have disagreements with Hillary about, this is perhaps what sticks the most.

 

You and I agree about having very little respect for both Trump and Hillary. My "defend" comment wasn't as much towards you as towards others.

 

Along with 60-80% of the country. Yuck.

[Enhance]

 

 

 

 

 

 

Shark, you just did what is Trump's response to criticism in a bottle: he resorts to ad hominem attacks and tries his best to undermine the integrity and honesty of the source of the criticism. He rarely ever address the criticism itself, he just tries to slander whoever is levying it as dishonest or disgusting or what have you.

 

At what point does reporting a candidates own words and actions become disgusting and dishonest? It seems to me that particular line of a attack has a distinct fascist flavor to it. It's dishonest and disgusting simply because he doesn't like it.

 

Here is a brief history of Trump's stifling of free press during this election cycle.

I simply don't see it the same way as you. I've made my point multiple times in this thread, as well as the Republican election thread, and I'd be better off talking to a plant. It's funny what you say, because that's the only form of response I've gotten. No one knows why they think what they think, but they criticize my views because on this board, they're not popular. It's bullsh*t, but whatever.

 

I'm sorry he's not politically correct enough to fit into the narrow little "presidential" box that people expect him to fit into, but that's exactly his appeal to people right off hand. I've spelled out my understanding of his weaknesses, but his strengths far outweigh his weaknesses IMO. Sorry the radical opinions on this board (or however you could categorize it) don't accept that and decide to respond to me in excessively harsh ways. You people are allowed to have your opinions, but I'm tired of being sh*t on for supporting Trump. I (and millions of others in this country) think that people who support Bernie or Hillary are idiots too, so... Not sure what to say to closed-minded, overly PC people...

Shark-I wouldn't worry too much about some of the lefties on here. They have the same fear of Trump now that we had of Obama in 2008. We said Obama would expand the size and scope of government, increase government dependence, and make us less safe against terrorism, and unfortunately all of that has come to fruition. The leftists are afraid of the country moving back to a center-right nation and will continue to demonize Trump as much as possible. Now I don't agree with some of Trump's provocative statements, but I know he'll be a thousand times better than Hillary.

But that's not it at all. Trump is a loud mouth jackass that has a tenuous grasp of the truth and people can't understand how he's this close to becoming the next POTUS. If Kasich, Johnson, Rubio, or even Bush were the nominee we would be talking about actual issues. We fear Trump becoming the President because he's not qualified for the job.

And nearly half the country felt in 2008 a one-term Senator that had no real world job experience was qualified to be out POTUS and these past 7 years have proven he was not ready for the job. Meanwhile, Hillary is a one-term Senator that had no major accomplishments in that role (unless you count voting for the Iraq war an accomplishment) and was one of the worst and most deceptive secretary of states we've ever had.

 

Obama is likely to go down as one of the better presidents in U.S. history, certainly ahead of the last three presidents we had. Better than the likes of Ford and Grant. Obama has been nowhere near perfect, but he has had several objectively good accomplishments. So, this notion that he has proven himself inadequate over the last 7 years is very misleading, and this is coming from a person who didn't even vote for him in '08.

 

 

I agree with the other posters comments that you must give time before doing a full evaluation of Presidents, but judging by what I have seen these past 7 years, I think Obama will go down as one of the worst we've had in modern times. What "objectively good" accomplishments has he delivered on? I think we are likely to see in the next 5 to 10 years just how bad his approach to foreign policy and terrorism has been. We've already seen 2 homeland attacks in the past 10 months. And CBO projections from his spending are expected to jump drastically in the coming years.

Obama has done well with the economy, lowering the unemployment rate to 5 percent at the end of 2015. After the stimulus package, 3.7 million private sector jobs were created. Cuba relations. Ended the war in Iraq. He also helped break down the horrendous No Child Left Behind system.

 

There are dozens of other things he is given credit for, but depending on your perspective, they may or may not be good things (i.e. the Affordable Healthcare Act).

 

While I can agree that a full, worthy evaluation should probably take place a couple decades from now, I feel very confident suggesting he will not be considered one of the worst in modern times.

[QMany]

I agree with the other posters comments that you must give time before doing a full evaluation of Presidents, but judging by what I have seen these past 7 years, I think Obama will go down as one of the worst we've had in modern times. What "objectively good" accomplishments has he delivered on? I think we are likely to see in the next 5 to 10 years just how bad his approach to foreign policy and terrorism has been. We've already seen 2 homeland attacks in the past 10 months. And CBO projections from his spending are expected to jump drastically in the coming years.

How would you evaluate George W. Bush?

[BigRedBuster]

 

What cover-up or smearing are you referencing in regards to Hillary's actions?

 

Are you saying those actions are more reprehensible than Donald cheating on and raping Ivana? Have you read her deposition excerpt?

 

Umm...have you been living under a rock. Hillary knew about all of Bill's affairs and rapes and was central to ensuring it was swept under the rug.

 

http://thefederalist.com/2015/09/21/hillary-clinton-is-no-friend-to-sexual-assault-survivors/

 

http://www.thepoliticalinsider.com/every-clinton-sex-assault-victim/

 

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/juanita-broaddrick-hillary-clinton-hid-bills-infidelities/article/2592109

 

Meanwhile, the "rape" and deposition you are referring true has been proven to be unfounded in Ivana's own words. Here is what she said at the end of 2015. You are trying to diffuse the real tragedy of Bill's abuse of many women with this accusation by a spouse who was preparing to get divorced. Do you really think that Juanita Brodderick and Paula Jones will be coming out to release a similar statement?

 

Update 7/28/15 9:50 AM: Ivana Trump released a statement Tuesday morning to CNN.

“I have recently read some comments attributed to me from nearly 30 years ago at a time of very high tension during my divorce from Donald. The story is totally without merit. Donald and I are the best of friends and together have raised three children that we love and are very proud of. I have nothing but fondness for Donald and wish him the best of luck on his campaign. Incidentally, I think he would make an incredible president.”

Ironically, Ivana says a story based on her own words in a divorce deposition are “totally without merit.”

In further irony, Trump is distancing himself from his lawyer.

“Mr. Trump speaks for Mr. Trump and nobody but Mr. Trump speaks for him,” a campaign source told CNN.

 

OK....I just want to point out something that struck me about this.

 

One of two things are true here:

 

a) Ivana is a piece of sh#t for accusing Trump of things in a court deposition that aren't true.

 

b) Ivana is a piece of sh#t for now for covering up what Trump really did now because he is a candidate for President. Now....an deposition is taken under oath. So....now is she admitting she lied under oath?????

 

Now....I'm very uncomfortable with these feelings towards her because she claimed she was raped but, I can't see any other truth that can be had here.

[QMany]

One statement was said under oath. Another statement was said to the news after a sizable settlement and gag order...

[TGHusker]

 

 

 

 

 

Shark, you just did what is Trump's response to criticism in a bottle: he resorts to ad hominem attacks and tries his best to undermine the integrity and honesty of the source of the criticism. He rarely ever address the criticism itself, he just tries to slander whoever is levying it as dishonest or disgusting or what have you.

 

At what point does reporting a candidates own words and actions become disgusting and dishonest? It seems to me that particular line of a attack has a distinct fascist flavor to it. It's dishonest and disgusting simply because he doesn't like it.

 

Here is a brief history of Trump's stifling of free press during this election cycle.

I simply don't see it the same way as you. I've made my point multiple times in this thread, as well as the Republican election thread, and I'd be better off talking to a plant. It's funny what you say, because that's the only form of response I've gotten. No one knows why they think what they think, but they criticize my views because on this board, they're not popular. It's bullsh*t, but whatever.

 

I'm sorry he's not politically correct enough to fit into the narrow little "presidential" box that people expect him to fit into, but that's exactly his appeal to people right off hand. I've spelled out my understanding of his weaknesses, but his strengths far outweigh his weaknesses IMO. Sorry the radical opinions on this board (or however you could categorize it) don't accept that and decide to respond to me in excessively harsh ways. You people are allowed to have your opinions, but I'm tired of being sh*t on for supporting Trump. I (and millions of others in this country) think that people who support Bernie or Hillary are idiots too, so... Not sure what to say to closed-minded, overly PC people...

Shark-I wouldn't worry too much about some of the lefties on here. They have the same fear of Trump now that we had of Obama in 2008. We said Obama would expand the size and scope of government, increase government dependence, and make us less safe against terrorism, and unfortunately all of that has come to fruition. The leftists are afraid of the country moving back to a center-right nation and will continue to demonize Trump as much as possible. Now I don't agree with some of Trump's provocative statements, but I know he'll be a thousand times better than Hillary.

But that's not it at all. Trump is a loud mouth jackass that has a tenuous grasp of the truth and people can't understand how he's this close to becoming the next POTUS. If Kasich, Johnson, Rubio, or even Bush were the nominee we would be talking about actual issues. We fear Trump becoming the President because he's not qualified for the job.

And nearly half the country felt in 2008 a one-term Senator that had no real world job experience was qualified to be out POTUS and these past 7 years have proven he was not ready for the job. Meanwhile, Hillary is a one-term Senator that had no major accomplishments in that role (unless you count voting for the Iraq war an accomplishment) and was one of the worst and most deceptive secretary of states we've ever had.

 

Obama is likely to go down as one of the better presidents in U.S. history, certainly ahead of the last three presidents we had. Better than the likes of Ford and Grant. Obama has been nowhere near perfect, but he has had several objectively good accomplishments. So, this notion that he has proven himself inadequate over the last 7 years is very misleading, and this is coming from a person who didn't even vote for him in '08.

 

I'm not a Trump fan as you know, but I have to ask What have you been drinking? It is way too soon to judge his place as one of the 'better' presidents. Will he be better than GWB IMHO - yes long term I think so. GWB would have been better if he just went to Afgan and didn't try to nation build in Iraq. Just like LBJ would be held in much higher regard outside of his blundering, political war in Vietnam. LBJ was still transformative. Like LBJ, FDR, Reagan, I think Obama can be called a transformative president if his legacy remains in tack and ISIS doesn't blow up into a bigger mess. To be transformative doesn't mean everything the president did was largely popular. LBJ is transformative for the Great Society policies & Civil Rights laws, FDR - well for about everything he did, Reagan for foreign affairs and ushering in a generational conservative movement. Obama could be transformative for ACA (if it survives the next president), and a number of social issues - including gay rights. Will those things cause him to be considered 'one of the better' presidents - only time will tell. While I have moderated some of my opinion of him I think he still ends up in the bottom 1/2 of presidents. Ahead of Carter, GWB, Ford, and who knows maybe ahead of Clinton (wouldn't that drive Bill nuts) to list a few modern presidents. He'd be ahead of Harding, Buchanan, Harrison, Pierce, A. Johnson, Grant, Q Adams, McKinley as well and maybe a couple of others. It all depends on how one ranks the president and the criteria they deem to be important.

[QMany]

[HuskerNation1]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Shark, you just did what is Trump's response to criticism in a bottle: he resorts to ad hominem attacks and tries his best to undermine the integrity and honesty of the source of the criticism. He rarely ever address the criticism itself, he just tries to slander whoever is levying it as dishonest or disgusting or what have you.

 

At what point does reporting a candidates own words and actions become disgusting and dishonest? It seems to me that particular line of a attack has a distinct fascist flavor to it. It's dishonest and disgusting simply because he doesn't like it.

 

Here is a brief history of Trump's stifling of free press during this election cycle.

I simply don't see it the same way as you. I've made my point multiple times in this thread, as well as the Republican election thread, and I'd be better off talking to a plant. It's funny what you say, because that's the only form of response I've gotten. No one knows why they think what they think, but they criticize my views because on this board, they're not popular. It's bullsh*t, but whatever.

 

I'm sorry he's not politically correct enough to fit into the narrow little "presidential" box that people expect him to fit into, but that's exactly his appeal to people right off hand. I've spelled out my understanding of his weaknesses, but his strengths far outweigh his weaknesses IMO. Sorry the radical opinions on this board (or however you could categorize it) don't accept that and decide to respond to me in excessively harsh ways. You people are allowed to have your opinions, but I'm tired of being sh*t on for supporting Trump. I (and millions of others in this country) think that people who support Bernie or Hillary are idiots too, so... Not sure what to say to closed-minded, overly PC people...

Shark-I wouldn't worry too much about some of the lefties on here. They have the same fear of Trump now that we had of Obama in 2008. We said Obama would expand the size and scope of government, increase government dependence, and make us less safe against terrorism, and unfortunately all of that has come to fruition. The leftists are afraid of the country moving back to a center-right nation and will continue to demonize Trump as much as possible. Now I don't agree with some of Trump's provocative statements, but I know he'll be a thousand times better than Hillary.

But that's not it at all. Trump is a loud mouth jackass that has a tenuous grasp of the truth and people can't understand how he's this close to becoming the next POTUS. If Kasich, Johnson, Rubio, or even Bush were the nominee we would be talking about actual issues. We fear Trump becoming the President because he's not qualified for the job.

And nearly half the country felt in 2008 a one-term Senator that had no real world job experience was qualified to be out POTUS and these past 7 years have proven he was not ready for the job. Meanwhile, Hillary is a one-term Senator that had no major accomplishments in that role (unless you count voting for the Iraq war an accomplishment) and was one of the worst and most deceptive secretary of states we've ever had.

 

Obama is likely to go down as one of the better presidents in U.S. history, certainly ahead of the last three presidents we had. Better than the likes of Ford and Grant. Obama has been nowhere near perfect, but he has had several objectively good accomplishments. So, this notion that he has proven himself inadequate over the last 7 years is very misleading, and this is coming from a person who didn't even vote for him in '08.

 

 

I agree with the other posters comments that you must give time before doing a full evaluation of Presidents, but judging by what I have seen these past 7 years, I think Obama will go down as one of the worst we've had in modern times. What "objectively good" accomplishments has he delivered on? I think we are likely to see in the next 5 to 10 years just how bad his approach to foreign policy and terrorism has been. We've already seen 2 homeland attacks in the past 10 months. And CBO projections from his spending are expected to jump drastically in the coming years.

Obama has done well with the economy, lowering the unemployment rate to 5 percent at the end of 2015. After the stimulus package, 3.7 million private sector jobs were created. Cuba relations. Ended the war in Iraq. He also helped break down the horrendous No Child Left Behind system.

 

There are dozens of other things he is given credit for, but depending on your perspective, they may or may not be good things (i.e. the Affordable Healthcare Act).

 

While I can agree that a full, worthy evaluation should probably take place a couple decades from now, I feel very confident suggesting he will not be considered one of the worst in modern times.

 

 

We just had a good discussion on the unemployment rate and the fact that it does not include the reality that we have the lowest labor participation rate since the 70s. The monthly quoted rate which is around 5% does not reflect those who could work and have stopped looking for work as well as those who are underemployed. If you look at the unemployment rate which includes those underemployed, its around 15% which is a 2% improvement from when Obama took office, but is far higher than most of the 2nd term of Bush when the underemployment rate was around 7.5%. I agree the job market has gotten better since the world financial meltdown which is a result of many domestic and foreign factors, but I don't believe enough has been done in this space to put this as a drastic improvement. Bush 43 inherited a far worse situation his first couple years in office with the recession Clinton left him, the Enron scandal, and 9/11.

 

Ending the Iraq war without the goal of winning the war on terrorism is in my mind Obama's biggest failure. By pulling out of Iraq without a plan to keep terrorists at bay, Obama has allowed ISIS to grow by 4400% under his watch (according to his own FBI director). I personally think his failure in foreign policy and the fight against terrorism is Obama's biggest black eye, even moreso than the Obamacare debacle. If I were to sum up his Presidency 15 years from now, I would say that Obama was the first Black President, passed Obamacare under extreme controversy, was POTUS when gay marriage was approved by the Supreme Court, and saw the rise of ISIS and instability across the globe.

[HuskerNation1]

 

I agree with the other posters comments that you must give time before doing a full evaluation of Presidents, but judging by what I have seen these past 7 years, I think Obama will go down as one of the worst we've had in modern times. What "objectively good" accomplishments has he delivered on? I think we are likely to see in the next 5 to 10 years just how bad his approach to foreign policy and terrorism has been. We've already seen 2 homeland attacks in the past 10 months. And CBO projections from his spending are expected to jump drastically in the coming years.

How would you evaluate George W. Bush?

 

 

I would rate Bush somewhere in the middle to be honest. While he and nearly every member of Congress voted to go into Iraq under faulty intelligence, he will always be remembered as the President during 9/11 that helped this country heal during a difficult time and kept America safe against terrorism once the 9/11 wake-up call transpired. We can't forget the fear that American's had in the years after 9/11, and his policies kept us safe. He will also be remembered for Katrina and the poor response to that tragedy, and I think as a POTUS that has refused to criticize his predecessor despite his predecessor constantly sticking it to him after taking office.

[mrandyk]

 

 

I agree with the other posters comments that you must give time before doing a full evaluation of Presidents, but judging by what I have seen these past 7 years, I think Obama will go down as one of the worst we've had in modern times. What "objectively good" accomplishments has he delivered on? I think we are likely to see in the next 5 to 10 years just how bad his approach to foreign policy and terrorism has been. We've already seen 2 homeland attacks in the past 10 months. And CBO projections from his spending are expected to jump drastically in the coming years.

How would you evaluate George W. Bush?

 

 

I would rate Bush somewhere in the middle to be honest. While he and nearly every member of Congress voted to go into Iraq under faulty intelligence, he will always be remembered as the President during 9/11 that helped this country heal during a difficult time and kept America safe against terrorism once the 9/11 wake-up call transpired. We can't forget the fear that American's had in the years after 9/11, and his policies kept us safe. He will also be remembered for Katrina and the poor response to that tragedy, and I think as a POTUS that has refused to criticize his predecessor despite his predecessor constantly sticking it to him after taking office.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ytCEuuW2_A

[HuskerShark]

All this talk of how wonderful president Obama is has me pretty much floored and confused about what you all feel the role of the government should be, so I'll just leave this here and wait...

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRLcGqtzv2E

[huKSer]

All this talk of how wonderful president Obama is has me pretty much floored and confused about what you all feel the role of the government should be, so I'll just leave this here and wait...

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRLcGqtzv2E

 

What floored me was that he won the Nobel Peace Prize for getting elected President. He had accomplished literally nothing.

[Danny Bateman]

 

 

 

I agree with the other posters comments that you must give time before doing a full evaluation of Presidents, but judging by what I have seen these past 7 years, I think Obama will go down as one of the worst we've had in modern times. What "objectively good" accomplishments has he delivered on? I think we are likely to see in the next 5 to 10 years just how bad his approach to foreign policy and terrorism has been. We've already seen 2 homeland attacks in the past 10 months. And CBO projections from his spending are expected to jump drastically in the coming years.

How would you evaluate George W. Bush?

 

 

I would rate Bush somewhere in the middle to be honest. While he and nearly every member of Congress voted to go into Iraq under faulty intelligence, he will always be remembered as the President during 9/11 that helped this country heal during a difficult time and kept America safe against terrorism once the 9/11 wake-up call transpired. We can't forget the fear that American's had in the years after 9/11, and his policies kept us safe. He will also be remembered for Katrina and the poor response to that tragedy, and I think as a POTUS that has refused to criticize his predecessor despite his predecessor constantly sticking it to him after taking office.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ytCEuuW2_A

 

 

Snarky as hell. But the Price is Right losing horn will always elicit a +1 from me.

[Danny Bateman]

Trump seems to have come unglued.

 

He's doubling down on trying to suggest that he was right about President Obama supporting terrorists.

 

Nevermind the fact he's tweeting a Breitbart article citing a Judicial Watch memo, which is like Republicanception. It's what's effectively a Trump echo chamber inside of a Trump echo chamber.

 

I get that there are those of you who will gladly take him over Clinton, but elected Republicans have to be crying into their Cheerios every morning.