Triaging the QB room

[ZRod]

21 minutes ago, Red Five said:

Haarberg climbing the NU single season fumbles chart (data only goes back to 2006).

 

2012 Taylor Martinez 16

2010 Taylor Martinez 16

2011 Taylor Martinez 14

2018 Adrian Martinez 12

2023 Heinrich Haarberg 11

2014 Tommy Armstrong 10

2019 Adrian Martinez 8

2020 Adrian Martinez 7

2007 Sam Keller 7

2006 Zac Taylor 7

 

He currently leads the NCAA in fumbles, despite only really playing in 7 of 9 games.  (KJ Jefferson of Arkansas is 2nd with 10, then 3 are tied with 9).

 

He's also 4th in fumbles lost at 4 (3 are tied with 5 lost).

It's so weird that this happened through three different regimes.

[Guy Chamberlin]

On 11/5/2023 at 12:08 AM, floridacorn said:

That was a brutal outing, but 1 play in particular would drive me nuts if I'm the coaching staff.  I believe it was in the 3rd quarter, but the play was a shallow cross screen.  Fidone blocks Lloyd's man off the LOS, Lloyd comes underneath Fidone and crosses down the LOS, and the receiver running a shallow cross from the opposite side also blocks coverage LB's.  All legal because Lloyd is crossing at the LOS.  HH dropped back in a clean pocket & just as Lloyd is about to break free & into a ton of open space, HH inexplicably climbs in the clean pocket and runs himself into a sack with eyes down field the entire time.  

 

Any pass that doesn't go to Lloyd turns all those blocks into penalties, because they were blatant blocks, not subtle picks.  So what in the world was HH looking at, and why did he abandon a clean pocket while the screen was being set up?  IMO, you can only assume he wasn't aware what they were running & that the receiver down field was just clearing out coverage.    As frustrating as the endless array of the inaccurate passes were, they can be accounted for.  That play isn't mechanics, it's between the ears.  

 

Yeah, and I fixated on a very minor play (possibly a called QB draw but you never know) where Haarberg has committed to the run and is staring straight down a hole in the right side and a good six yards before the first linebacker. He freezes in the moment, then runs back to the center and into a crowded line for no gain. 

 

If you are depending on HH's legs to make the difference, it's not gonna happen. 

[Mavric]

21 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

Yeah, and I fixated on a very minor play (possibly a called QB draw but you never know) where Haarberg has committed to the run and is staring straight down a hole in the right side and a good six yards before the first linebacker. He freezes in the moment, then runs back to the center and into a crowded line for no gain. 

 

If you are depending on HH's legs to make the difference, it's not gonna happen. 

 

I mean ... he's made quite a difference with his legs this year.  Including setting up our last touchdown Saturday.

[Guy Chamberlin]

16 minutes ago, Mavric said:

 

I mean ... he's made quite a difference with his legs this year.  Including setting up our last touchdown Saturday.

 

I'm talking about the difference between being a legitimate starting quarterback, and not. The long runs don't really offset the other issues, which seem more about decision-making than passing mechanics.

 

It's the classic defensive coordinator decision; stack the box and/or assign a spy to Haarberg and dare him to beat you with his arm. The announcers were trying to give Haarberg the benefit of the doubt by comparing him to Tim Tebow, but Haarberg is looking more like a good athlete who can't make the admittedly difficult transition to P5 quarterback. 

 

I think the successful dual-threat quarterbacks are good passers who aren't afraid to run, moreso than good runners with a limited passing repertoire. 

[Mavric]

 

[gossamorharpy]

1 hour ago, ZRod said:

It's so weird that this happened through three different regimes.

Its weird until we all realize that Nebraska seemingly decided to abandon the RB first run game for 3 different regimes now.  Not sure when this progrum is gonna wake up and realize running your qb as your primary option is a disaster waiting to happen between getting banged up, injured all together, and overall limiting your effectiveness as an offense via fumbles and stalled drives.

 

This started in 2010 when TM was a huge breath of relief after the zac lee inept offense.  At that time we still had the Helu/Burkhead/Ameer reigns on the horizon though the beginning of the qb first took hold.  

 

Tommy armstrong was more of a thrower than TM but such a gamer and took his fair share of hits.

 

brief pause on this strategy with mike riley

 

I dont need to go into great detail on how frosty ran 2am into the ground.  2am peaked in week 2-3 of his freshman year and was never the same athletically due to how often he got his s#!t beat up

 

We as a progrum need to stop revolving our offense around the qb.  It prevents our RBs from developing any sort of rhythm and basically ignores any form of consistent passing game intentionally. 

[Toe]

2 hours ago, gossamorharpy said:

Not sure when this progrum is gonna wake up and realize running your qb as your primary option is a disaster waiting to happen

 

Maybe when 2 of our top 3 RBs aren't out for the season...

[gossamorharpy]

Just now, Toe said:

 

Maybe when 2 of our top 3 RBs aren't out for the season...

definitely a factor but we came out week 1 running the qb more than any 1 back prior to the injuries 

[admo]

As this year winds down, I think it is best to stick with Haarberg for the final 3 games.  

 

He's a backup QB, but the team doesn't have a legit QB1.  And no matter how we see the offense go through ups and downs, highs and lows, you still stick with him for THIS YEAR.

 

Sims is done, he is out of here.  He's probably known it for a few weeks by now (his future).  He's been a good teammate and is happy when HH makes good plays.  But don't hold your breath on him coming into a game, especially with Wisconsin and Iowa lurking.  It's not fair to him to have to play the first 2 road games (Minn & Colo) and then be asked to go beat Maryland, Wisc & Iowa.  Sims fresh year was 2020, so he got a Covid year of extra eligibility.  Officially he is a JR, but has played 4 games and has never redshirted.  Like I said, after the season he will go somewhere else.  And I wouldn't blame him.  Just didn't work out like we all hoped.  

 

As for Purdy..... goodness people.  Why would any fan think about trying him with a lot on the line?  Why would you insert your 3rd string quarterback who hasn't played?  And think that "just try it" means that he can beat Wisconsin on the road, and then Iowa at home?  He hasn't really played since last year.  It would only take a few series with him and fans would think "WTH is this?!!! - We suck!!! - get Haarberg back in!!!" 

 

We won 5 games.  We have bettered our results from the past few seasons while trying to implement a new direction and toughness.  We have Haarberg.  Learning on the job, week to week.  When it's ugly, we know it.  When he plays clean, we can move the chains and be effective.  That is all we have, and it is the best we got.  And personally, I think playing Iowa at home is our best chance to win that 6th game and make a bowl game, with HH.  As for Maryland, it is a lot to ask the offense to play clean, score 25-30 points and defend their passing game.  It is possible.  But it is a lot to expect to happen.

[Hayseed]

Are they thinking of putting a robotic arm on Haarberg so he can throw better passes?

[Mavric]

Just now, Hayseed said:

Are they thinking of putting a robotic arm on Haarberg so he can throw better passes?

[Undone]

I wonder if Haarberg is not being coached to tuck it & run after making a couple reads like it seems like the two Martinez's were. Seems like there's maybe more yards and some more 1st down conversions out there if he just runs it after making two reads.

[Red Five]

TANYA = Total Adjusted Net Yards per Attempt 

 

 

 

[admo]

4 hours ago, Undone said:

I wonder if Haarberg is not being coached to tuck it & run after making a couple reads like it seems like the two Martinez's were. Seems like there's maybe more yards and some more 1st down conversions out there if he just runs it after making two reads.

No don't think so.  He looks at the defense pre-snap.  He then looks to the sidelines for the audible call if there is one (since he doesn't quite read defenses too good).  

 

From there, he drops back.... and things become all sorts of bluey for him (Sometimes.  Or a lot of times.  And sometimes it goes smoothly).  

 

If things are calm, like in practice after a "do-over", he can complete that 5 yard pass downfield. Or 8 yard pass.   

 

Having said that, ultimately, when he does decide to run on passing plays, it is because his decision-making ability to throw the ball (to a spot that they practiced) is mentally a step or two late.  Sometimes it's the TE/WR running the route slower than normal.  Sometimes he feels pressure from the DLine caving in.  Sometimes he just freezes and isn't sure what to do. 

 

It's when he can't decide where to throw that he abandons the pass play, and tries to evacuate the pocket.  He runs because it's more natural to him than throwing the ball... it's his go-to reaction. 

 

Only a few special quarterbacks across the college football realm can do the that unique quarterback thing..... like, reading defenses, making quick decisions, getting rid of the ball, throwing to a spot, hitting the receiver in the face mask so he can catch it (like it's taught) and run after the catch, on most passing plays called. Some of these special quarterbacks throw it to a spot almost immediately after receiving the snap. Like it's been taught.  Like they know where to throw to.... Throw to X if this happens; Throw to Y if that happens. Dump off to RB if that happens. It's almost like an internal clock and with knowledge and reps.  Most QBs are not thinking "I'm going to run and truck the linebacker!!!!" because they know their throwing shoulder is very important to the offense.  So is their wrist and knees and back.  

[Guy Chamberlin]

4 hours ago, Undone said:

I wonder if Haarberg is not being coached to tuck it & run after making a couple reads like it seems like the two Martinez's were. Seems like there's maybe more yards and some more 1st down conversions out there if he just runs it after making two reads.

 

Totally agree. It's easy from my couch, but I see plenty of available green that Haarberg is not taking.