Trump's America

[zoogs]

Btw, spending on those health needs doesn't seem unwarranted either. I understand why the comparison is drawn now, but it's comparing the relative scales of two necessary sources of spending.

[Landlord]

Is there much peer reviewed study of transgendered people and the nature of gender dysphoria, and the effectiveness of gender reassignment? Just out of curiosity.

[Danny Bateman]

The corollary I found interesting is the GI Bill. Loads of people joined up in the military so they could get school paid for when they get out. We can't pretend we're in a vacuum and incentives to enlist don't exist.

 

How is gender reassignment surgery any different than that?

[NM11046]

^^ Couldn't disagree more.

 

I think transgender citizens have every right too be in the military, but how is it the government's responsibility too cover the cost of a procedure that, relative to your physical health, is unnecessary?

I think the difference is how it's viewed. If you view it as a mental issue or a physical one. But I can challenge you on both.

 

• Does the military not allow clinically depressed, but treated people serve? Do they withhold antidepressents? Alcoholics?
• Does the military not allow people with diabetes to serve? Do they withhold insulin? Allergies?

 

At some point there has to be acknowledgement that those employed by "America" especially those who serve in the most sacrificial of ways deserve our support. We can not determine what we will and what we won't cover. If you enroll at 18 healthy, male and at age 35 you get cancer you should be covered. If you get diabetes as 42 it should be covered. If you get injured and have to get a limb amputated you should be covered (for the surgery and recovery) and if you are transgendered you should be covered.

 

The data I found (attached) states that approximately 0.6% Americans identify as transgendered. Most of those people begin to identify between ages 25-64 - prime military time.

 

What I'd like to know if the percentage of those who actually take the steps to medically support their identity. Some people I know have identified as transgendered, changed their name, grew their hair etc but take no hormones and haven't had any surgery. Others obviously have done those things. So to assume that their health costs are any different than an average american is truly an assumption. There are those who only do hormones and they are costing no more to the system than a woman on birth control or one in menopause.

 

And BB - to say that it isn't "necessary to their health" is simply not true. I appreciate that you're open minded enough to recognize their ability and desire to serve is equal, but you need to learn a bit more about the issue on a personal level.

 

https://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/wp-content/uploads/How-Many-Adults-Identify-as-Transgender-in-the-United-States.pdf

[NM11046]

Is there much peer reviewed study of transgendered people and the nature of gender dysphoria, and the effectiveness of gender reassignment? Just out of curiosity.

It's a good question that I'd like to learn more about - I'll try to look stuff up in the coming days.

[NM11046]

The corollary I found interesting is the GI Bill. Loads of people joined up in the military so they could get school paid for when they get out. We can't pretend we're in a vacuum and incentives to enlist don't exist.

 

How is gender reassignment surgery any different than that?

I'm not sure I'm understanding you dude, so to clarify are you suggesting that transgendered people sign up to serve in the military to get their transition paid for?

 

If so, if they are capable of serving and qualified and do so - why is this a problem? Incentive or not, if they do the work for our country shouldn't they receive the same health benefits as others who do so?

[QMany]

[B.B. Hemingway]

 

^^ Couldn't disagree more.

 

I think transgender citizens have every right too be in the military, but how is it the government's responsibility too cover the cost of a procedure that, relative to your physical health, is unnecessary?

I think the difference is how it's viewed. If you view it as a mental issue or a physical one. But I can challenge you on both.

 

• Does the military not allow clinically depressed, but treated people serve? Do they withhold antidepressents? Alcoholics?
• Does the military not allow people with diabetes to serve? Do they withhold insulin? Allergies?

 

At some point there has to be acknowledgement that those employed by "America" especially those who serve in the most sacrificial of ways deserve our support. We can not determine what we will and what we won't cover. If you enroll at 18 healthy, male and at age 35 you get cancer you should be covered. If you get diabetes as 42 it should be covered. If you get injured and have to get a limb amputated you should be covered (for the surgery and recovery) and if you are transgendered you should be covered.

 

The data I found (attached) states that approximately 0.6% Americans identify as transgendered. Most of those people begin to identify between ages 25-64 - prime military time.

 

What I'd like to know if the percentage of those who actually take the steps to medically support their identity. Some people I know have identified as transgendered, changed their name, grew their hair etc but take no hormones and haven't had any surgery. Others obviously have done those things. So to assume that their health costs are any different than an average american is truly an assumption. There are those who only do hormones and they are costing no more to the system than a woman on birth control or one in menopause.

 

And BB - to say that it isn't "necessary to their health" is simply not true. I appreciate that you're open minded enough to recognize their ability and desire to serve is equal, but you need to learn a bit more about the issue on a personal level.

 

https://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/wp-content/uploads/How-Many-Adults-Identify-as-Transgender-in-the-United-States.pdf

 

 

If it's a mental health issue then they should have access to the same medications/treatment that other mental health patients get. However, if you start paying for the actual operation, a cosmetic surgery, you're potentially opening pandora's box in my opinion. What's too stop a person from saying the look of their nose causes them too be depressed, therefore affecting their ability to perform their duty? How do you tell that person you can't cover their needs?

 

(And for the record I don't think the government should be spending $46 million annually on Viagra).

[knapplc]

 

The corollary I found interesting is the GI Bill. Loads of people joined up in the military so they could get school paid for when they get out. We can't pretend we're in a vacuum and incentives to enlist don't exist.

 

How is gender reassignment surgery any different than that?

I'm not sure I'm understanding you dude, so to clarify are you suggesting that transgendered people sign up to serve in the military to get their transition paid for?

 

If so, if they are capable of serving and qualified and do so - why is this a problem? Incentive or not, if they do the work for our country shouldn't they receive the same health benefits as others who do so?

 

 

It'd be waaaaay easier to just get a job at Starbucks, whose healthcare coverage makes getting gender transformation much, much more affordable even on their wages (I presume they're not making much money pouring coffee).

[zoogs]

It'd be waaaaay easier to just get a job at Starbucks, whose healthcare coverage makes getting gender transformation much, much more affordable even on their wages (I presume they're not making much money pouring coffee).

Precisely. I can't fathom having to navigate life, period, as a transgender person with all the fear, hate, and stigma out there. I can't begin to imagine enlisting in military service from that position.

 

I'm in awe of the people who do.

 

And if years of loyal service in the United States Armed Forces is their devious "trick" to obtaining the care they need, then I'd say it's more than a fair exchange.

[StPaulHusker]

 

^^ Couldn't disagree more.

 

I think transgender citizens have every right too be in the military, but how is it the government's responsibility too cover the cost of a procedure that, relative to your physical health, is unnecessary?

relative to your physical health? maybe the government should stop spending $60,000,000 a year on ed drugs as they dont improve any physical health (maybe mental health is improved?) but woudn't mental health for transgenders be the same then?

 

ED can be an early warning sign of heart disease. So it is a physical thing as much as it is mental.

 

And I will reiterate what I said a few times before. Don't single out one cost of a product being used unless you know it's full context.

[Fru]

[NM11046]

I wanted to add perspective here cuz it makes it even funnier ... Dowd is responding to Tomi's tweet:

[Fru]

Gratzi, NM.

[zoogs]

"Kill Muslims, Demean LGBT Americans."

 

Wonderful slogan for a wonderful Party.