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Breakout: Ron Brown and religion


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I'm still trying to figure out how you can supposedly be 100% supportive of UNL's anti-discrimination rules, yet still be vehemently opposed to similar anti-discrimination rules up in Omaha... :dunno

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In honesty, some of the anti-gay rhetoric from conservative Christians essentially locks the gays in the burning building, then shakes its head sadly at the fate they chose.

Don't like the idea that the University would hire someone proactively against civil rights, but you have to work with people who have different opinions sometimes. Just the way things are. Hopefully

You have spectacularly missed the point. 

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1 hour ago, 84HuskerLaw said:

Again, this is not a sports related debate but all the Ron Brown bashers are advocating discrimination against Christians is good because apparently NU ought not hire a Christian.   Discrimination against a protected class is not a good thing but it is one's right to like or dislike anybody for any reason.   However, the University may not choose to discriminate against Ron Brown's religion and his free exercise thereof without consequences.   Ron Brown has the exact same responsibility.   Those who seem to hate Christians need to get a life and do unto others as they would have done to them.   

I don't feel that way at all.  I think Ron Brown shouldn't be hired as a mentor because of his words at the Omaha City Council.  Sorry, but that guy can't be a mentor.  

 

 

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1 hour ago, southernoregonhusker said:

I don't feel that way at all.  I think Ron Brown shouldn't be hired as a mentor because of his words at the Omaha City Council.  Sorry, but that guy can't be a mentor.  

 

 

I'm sure the hundreds of former athletes that he coached at nebraska that voiced their appreciation about the higher agree with you on this sentiment /s

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1 hour ago, FearAmeer said:

I'm sure the hundreds of former athletes that he coached at nebraska that voiced their appreciation about the higher agree with you on this sentiment /s

I couldn't care less.  The man is a bigot.  The man advocated for the legal firing of gays from jobs and the legal discrimiination against gay renters.  He further threatened eternal damnation to the council members.  There's no defending that.  People try to defend it with their "faith," but that faith was used to defend slavery.  I wonder what Ron Brown thinks about that.

 

I did snicker when I read "higher" in your post though.  

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5 hours ago, Landlord said:

 

I'd imagine Ron doesn't even know this debate is happening or in unrest. Probably has no exposure to it whatsoever and hasn't had any thought of it being an issue or something people are talking about.

 

 

 

 

 

I completely 100% (as a Christian, even) allow for Ron Brown to voice his differing opinion as a private citizen, and then to say that I think it's wrong. That's what I'm doing. That's what everyone is doing.

 

 

Is that not what we are also all doing right now?

 

 

You mean, other than expressing his Christian views, and also pleading to the government in opposition of actual laws put in place to protect those with differing views from discrimination. Right?

 

 

 

 

As usual, you are wrong.

 

 

 

 

I mean I don't know about anyone else, but I'm personally not trying to fight for legislation that harms Ron Brown legally, or fight against legislation that would protect Ron Brown's freedoms and equality. Ron Brown did that. I'm not doing that.

 

Your view of tolerance is confusing. I'm not trying to hurt anyone I disagree with - I'm glad to grab a beer and have a conversation with 99% of them, and I'm for them as people. That doesn't mean I can't think they act inappropriately, or can't think that they're idiots, or that they're misguided, or that their worldview causes other people suffering and hurt. 

No, I am correct, as usual.  I am not familiar with the specifics of the Omaha city council proposals or Brown's public advocacy against new laws restricting landlords and employers' rights to hire and lease to those they may choose.  But prohibiting practicing Christians from exercising their 200 plus years long Constitutional rights to free religious views is certainly NOT somethingh that any public employer has a right or obligation to do.   And why, if all the Brown bashers do not object to his rehiring by NU, is there all the discussion?    Either you approve of Ron Brown being employed or you do not. 

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1 hour ago, 84HuskerLaw said:

No, I am correct, as usual.  I am not familiar with the specifics of the Omaha city council proposals or Brown's public advocacy against new laws restricting landlords and employers' rights to hire and lease to those they may choose.  But prohibiting practicing Christians from exercising their 200 plus years long Constitutional rights to free religious views is certainly NOT somethingh that any public employer has a right or obligation to do.   And why, if all the Brown bashers do not object to his rehiring by NU, is there all the discussion?    Either you approve of Ron Brown being employed or you do not. 

 

You’re absolutely correct. None of us are arguing otherwise.

 

I suggest you read through the thread again if you think that we are.

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2 hours ago, 84HuskerLaw said:

No, I am correct, as usual.  I am not familiar with the specifics of the Omaha city council proposals or Brown's public advocacy against new laws restricting landlords and employers' rights to hire and lease to those they may choose.  But prohibiting practicing Christians from exercising their 200 plus years long Constitutional rights to free religious views is certainly NOT somethingh that any public employer has a right or obligation to do.   And why, if all the Brown bashers do not object to his rehiring by NU, is there all the discussion?    Either you approve of Ron Brown being employed or you do not. 

 

 

I don't think you have any idea what happened or what people are saying in the topic.

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Kind of aside on the Muslim conversation:

 

I talked to a member of the Omaha Islamic Center a while back.  I can't remember what his title was, he wasn't an Imam, but similar to a church elder.  When asked about gay marriage he surprised a lot of people in the group.  He of course admitted that he didn't ever see a mosque holding a same-sex marriage, but that wasn't the issue.  He made a point to say that secular people should be able to live a homosexual lifestyle and marry his/her partner if they choose.  Even though he, and his understanding of Islam, think it is a sin, he said it is a sin between the person and God.  

 

Maybe we would be surprised by the thoughts of mainstream Muslims.

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3 hours ago, 84HuskerLaw said:

No, I am correct, as usual.  I am not familiar with the specifics of the Omaha city council proposals or Brown's public advocacy against new laws restricting landlords and employers' rights to hire and lease to those they may choose.  But prohibiting practicing Christians from exercising their 200 plus years long Constitutional rights to free religious views is certainly NOT somethingh that any public employer has a right or obligation to do.   And why, if all the Brown bashers do not object to his rehiring by NU, is there all the discussion?    Either you approve of Ron Brown being employed or you do not. 

 

So what youre essentially saying is, you have no clue about why people didnt want him rehired so youre going to blame it on the fact that people are upset because hes a christian? Jesus fing christ. 

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9 hours ago, Landlord said:

 

I'd imagine Ron doesn't even know this debate is happening or in unrest. Probably has no exposure to it whatsoever and hasn't had any thought of it being an issue or something people are talking about.

 

Probably I should have been clearer.  

 

If Ron Brown truly didn't think this was an issue people would talk about then he's learned nothing and hasn't reflected on his past behavior at all.  

 

If I (Scott Frost) was adamant about hiring him, and felt strongly that he brings a benefit to my team that I can't find in any other coach, then part of the deal would be that Ron has to proactively get ahead of this.   He has to show me, my AD and the public (as well as the student athletes) that he is accepting and open to different sexual orientations.  Acknowledge that he made a mistake and show what he is doing or doing differently now.   It can't have been a surprise to the university that his rehire has created this public dialogue.

 

I would expect that in his interview with Moos he had to acknowledge the situation and explain how he was going to treat a gay player?  An atheist?  A fan who wrote an op ed in the Journal Star?  Hecklers at away games?  It just wasn't that long ago that he said he went to Liberty because he said it was a better match for him, that he felt there his beliefs and desire to share them publicly was the fit.  What changed?  His beliefs?  The size of his paycheck?  The scale of his potential to make a difference?

 

You don't hire a man to be the mentor to the young men of your team if you don't agree with his approach.  So while I was stoked with the Moos hire, and with Frost coming back, their decision here takes a lot of the sparkle off the program.  Sadly.  

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12 hours ago, lo country said:

Again, other than expressing his Christian views, I haven't seen anything derogatory as it relates to his treatment of those with differing views.  

As he selflessly proclaims, he does not treat people with differing opinions any differently i.e. if a player is gay he will still mentor that player as if he/she was any other. But, mentoring a potentially gay player on one hand, and then fighting to prevent gay people from equal protection under the law in another hand, sends some mixed signals.

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11 hours ago, 84HuskerLaw said:

Again, this is not a sports related debate but all the Ron Brown bashers are advocating discrimination against Christians is good because apparently NU ought not hire a Christian.   Discrimination against a protected class is not a good thing but it is one's right to like or dislike anybody for any reason.   However, the University may not choose to discriminate against Ron Brown's religion and his free exercise thereof without consequences.   Ron Brown has the exact same responsibility.   Those who seem to hate Christians need to get a life and do unto others as they would have done to them.   

 

You have spectacularly missed the point. 

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15 hours ago, 84HuskerLaw said:

all the Ron Brown bashers are advocating discrimination against Christians is good because apparently NU ought not hire a Christian.  

Wow, way to epically get everything in that wrong.

 

15 hours ago, ebohnart said:

I find it interesting that those who preach tolerance of everyone and acceptance of every person no matter what your views, are

often times the least tolerant and least accepting of those who don’t agree with them... 

There's no evidence in this thread of intolerance towards Ron Brown that I've seen. What I think is that it's a misunderstanding about free speech.

 

Here's the thing about free speech. It means you get to say whatever you want, but it does NOT mean you get protection from other people's free speech. Ron Brown can and should be judged on the things he says and does, especially in a public forum over our laws. There's no protection for Brown having to hear dissenting (or agreeing for that matter) viewpoints about his actions and words. Everyone one of us can and should be allowed to speak out about Brown's actions and words, and we in turn can be judged and spoken about by others.

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15 hours ago, southernoregonhusker said:

I couldn't care less.  The man is a bigot.  The man advocated for the legal firing of gays from jobs and the legal discrimiination against gay renters.  He further threatened eternal damnation to the council members.  There's no defending that.  People try to defend it with their "faith," but that faith was used to defend slavery.  I wonder what Ron Brown thinks about that.

 

I did snicker when I read "higher" in your post though.  

Dang just got off work when I typed that (thats my excuse anyway). But anyway besides that point I see where you are coming from however I do think the man deserves another shot and he should have every right to voice his opinion on the matter so long as he isn't putting memorial stadium as his address again etc. I understand he "represents the university" but that doesn't mean he should be silenced of his opinions because of it. If it isn't effecting his work and his players/colleagues aren't notifying other administration of discomfort towards him being there then there shouldn't be a problem with it. 

 

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15 minutes ago, FearAmeer said:

Dang just got off work when I typed that (thats my excuse anyway). But anyway besides that point I see where you are coming from however I do think the man deserves another shot and he should have every right to voice his opinion on the matter so long as he isn't putting memorial stadium as his address again etc. I understand he "represents the university" but that doesn't mean he should be silenced of his opinions because of it. If it isn't effecting his work and his players/colleagues aren't notifying other administration of discomfort towards him being there then there shouldn't be a problem with it. 

 

If you were an 18 year old gay man, maybe closeted maybe not would you feel like you could go to your AD or your head coach to let them know your  level discomfort with the man they've hired to mentor you?  

 

edit: or if you are a senior in high school, a good FB player and a person that has an openly gay sibling or friend - do you put Nebraska on your list or do you look elsewhere for school?  Somewhere that supports you and is not outwardly advocating against the ones you love?

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