Gun Control

[methodical]

On 4/3/2018 at 9:52 AM, Enhance said:

That said, the last time someone went after a Fox News' anchor's advertisers, it involved sexual harassment. This time it involves someone's ill-advised comments about grades. That's a fairly huge discrepancy.

 

It was an ad-hominem attack from an adult with a show on a national cable network against a high-school kid she (or her network and their sheep) disagrees with on gun control.  It should absolutely result in the backlash she got and more IMO.  I don't see celebrating advertisers pulling out of shows who's hosts show publicly that they are actually really disgusting people like Laura Ingraham any differently than celebrating sponsors dropping an athlete that publicly disgraces themselves.  It's what happens when your livelihood depends on sponsors and you decide to cross the line that embarrasses them to be associated with you.  It's not like they pulled out because they care what her political stance was, so there was no escalation, and the tweet was wrong to pretend that it's the same as going after a piece of reporting or "a side" as opposed to a right wing "celebrity."

Edited April 5, 2018 by methodical

[Enhance]

4 hours ago, methodical said:

It should absolutely result in the backlash she got and more IMO.  I don't see celebrating advertisers pulling out of shows who's hosts show publicly that they are actually really disgusting people like Laura Ingraham any differently than celebrating sponsors dropping an athlete that publicly disgraces themselves.

I agree with much of your perspective, but professional athletes often lose sponsorship dollars because of domestic assault or criminal charges. An ill-advised attack on someone's GPA, albeit deplorable in its own way, is a poor correlation.

 

As much as I would like to see someone like Ingraham off air (and all of Fox News, if I'm honest), I don't think this is a completely black and white situation.

 

But, hey - Fox News (and a lot of other 'media' outlets) have been getting away with absolutely outrageous garbage for far too long. I can't fully support Hogg's decision but I can't say I'm sad to see her scramble a bit because of it. Someone like her does need more accountability.

[Danny Bateman]

Ingraham's entire wing of the conservative media is built upon a model of saying angry, offensive statements because "Muh First Amendment" and it's the "stuff the biased liberal media won't say." It's essentially bottling and selling outrage and righteous indignation with a strong side of tribalism. Ever notice how they make needlessly inflammatory statements BUT ALWAYS also have someone to point the finger at? They're not just riling people up, they're riling people up and trying to get them angry AT someone or something.

 

I mean this is the lady for whom "shut up and dribble" is just the latest in a long line of horrible views and opinions she's espoused.

 

It's hilariously fitting when one of them loses their platform because they finally took it too far. They're playing with fire every day anyway as a function of their business model. 

All of this is consistent with my current view of the 1A: It endows us a whole lot of rights but it can't save us from ourselves in how we choose to use them.

[Nebfanatic]

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/04/04/nyregion/police-shooting-brooklyn-crown-heights.html

 

Not sure where this goes but I am so tired of seeing this. It just stems from americas gun culture. People like to blame mental health as the issue yet this is how people with mental illness are treated. An eyewitness says the police fired shots without any verbal warning and 4 of 5 officers fired 10 rounds. Is this really neccessary?? Doesn't so many bullets put civilians at risk? Why are police dealing with things in this manner? Gun control needs to happen, but what we need is to control the gun culture. This shoot now ask questions later approach by the police is getting very frustrating.

 

 

Edit: to be fair the victim of this shooting was acting in an eratic manner, but I still strongly disagree that he deserved a death sentence with police acting as judge and jury.

Edited April 6, 2018 by Nebfanatic

[Danny Bateman]

9 hours ago, Nebfanatic said:

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/04/04/nyregion/police-shooting-brooklyn-crown-heights.html

 

Not sure where this goes but I am so tired of seeing this. It just stems from americas gun culture. People like to blame mental health as the issue yet this is how people with mental illness are treated. An eyewitness says the police fired shots without any verbal warning and 4 of 5 officers fired 10 rounds. Is this really neccessary?? Doesn't so many bullets put civilians at risk? Why are police dealing with things in this manner? Gun control needs to happen, but what we need is to control the gun culture. This shoot now ask questions later approach by the police is getting very frustrating.

 

 

Edit: to be fair the victim of this shooting was acting in an eratic manner, but I still strongly disagree that he deserved a death sentence with police acting as judge and jury.

 

There is at least one LEO that strays into this part of the board at least on occasion, and I'd defer to him on how he feels on this.

 

However, I personally feel you've got a point. If we had a gun culture where guns weren't so commonplace, officers wouldn't need to feel as on edge when responding to  someone acting like this man was, right? Less guns overall means less guns for suspects as well.

 

Here's another instance of law enforcement gone wrong. This one always really disturbed me.

Cop shoots caretaker of autistic man playing in the street with toy truck

Quote

When a 23-year-old autistic man carrying a toy truck wandered from a mental health center out into the street Monday, a worker there named Charles Kinsey went to retrieve him.

 

A few minutes later the autistic man was still sitting cross-legged blocking the roadway while playing with the small, rectangular white toy. And Kinsey was prone on the ground next to him — a bullet from an assault rifle fired by a police officer having struck his leg.

 

“He throws his hands up in the air and says, ‘Don’t shoot me.’ They say lie on the ground, so he does,” Kinsey’s attorney Hilton Napoleon said Wednesday. “He’s on his back with his hands in the air trying to convince the other guy to lie down. It doesn’t make any sense.”

 

Cellphone video footage obtained by Napoleon clearly shows the heavy-set autistic man sitting and playing with his toy while Kinsey, dressed in a yellow shirt and shorts, obeys police orders to lie down on his back.

 

The video, taken before the officer fired his weapon, shows Kinsey on his back with his hands in the air telling police he didn’t have a weapon and asking them not to fire. At one point the autistic man appears to yell at Kinsey to shut up. A second brief video shows officers who are carrying rifles physically patting down Kinsey and the autistic man while they are lying on the ground.

 

In an interview with WSVN-Channel 7, Kinsey said that after he was shot, officers approached and flipped him over and handcuffed him.
 

“Sir, there’s no need for firearms,” Kinsey told the news station he said to police before he was shot. “It was so surprising. It was like a mosquito bite.”

 

Kinsey said when he asked the officer why he fired his weapon, the cop responded, “I don’t know.”

 

Edited April 7, 2018 by Clifford Franklin

[Ric Flair]

On 4/4/2018 at 8:22 PM, Landlord said:

 

 

I agree with you, but also don't care, because one is an adult who is supposedly a professional journalist, and the other is a kid in high school.

 

Once the poor little “high school kid” inserts himself into the national debate, acts like a classless douchebag, and starts demanding that other peoples’ rights be taken from them, he makes himself fair game. You can’t argue, as countless liberals have, that these kids are mature behind their years, we should take marching orders from them, they’re so wise, learned, etc. on the one hand and then any time even mild criticism is leveled at them, blow up about how they’re just poor little kids who shouldn’t be bullied. For God’s sake, at least be consistent.

 

David Hogg is a clueless, mean-spirited jerk. Laura Ingraham shouldn’t have taken a personal shot at him, but given the personal shots Hogg and his ilk have taken at others, he’s in a poor position to complain and is a complete hypocrite when he does. Ingraham rightly apologized. Hogg, being a classless jerk, refused to accept her apology and instead is trying to end her career. And Ingraham is the bad person here? 

 

PLEASE.

[HS_Coach_C]

1 hour ago, Clifford Franklin said:

 

There is at least one LEO that strays into this part of the board at least on occasion, and I'd defer to him on how he feels on this.

 

However, I personally feel you've got a point. If we had a gun culture where guns weren't so commonplace, officers wouldn't need to feel as on edge when responding to  someone acting like this man was, right? Less guns overall means less guns for suspects as well.

 

Here's another instance of law enforcement gone wrong. This one always really disturbed me.

Cop shoots caretaker of autistic man playing in the street with toy truck

 

Yeah, I feel bad for officers that are in threatening situations because many of them have families and they don't want to be the ones to leave their families behind.

 

Unfortunately a few bad cops and a few very poorly handled situations have made tensions skyrocket. I can't imagine being in a situation like many officers face each week.

[Nebfanatic]

4 hours ago, Clifford Franklin said:

 

There is at least one LEO that strays into this part of the board at least on occasion, and I'd defer to him on how he feels on this.

 

However, I personally feel you've got a point. If we had a gun culture where guns weren't so commonplace, officers wouldn't need to feel as on edge when responding to  someone acting like this man was, right? Less guns overall means less guns for suspects as well.

 

Here's another instance of law enforcement gone wrong. This one always really disturbed me.

Cop shoots caretaker of autistic man playing in the street with toy truck

 

Ultimately I do understand law enforcement have a tough job on a daily basis and most in law enforcement are trying to do the right things. That said, fatal shootings by police is a problem in my view.

 

With other first world countries fatal interactions with law enforcement usually happen at a rate of less than 50 a year. We have thousands of deaths a year. I don't necissarily blame the police, but there has to be a way we can kill less people and get them in to go through the process. If the process from there is fair or not is another discussion, but lets at least do everything we can to give people a chance to be judged by a jury of their peers and sentenced accordingly.

 

Stories like the one you linked are tough to read.

Edited April 7, 2018 by Nebfanatic

[B.B. Hemingway]

On 4/4/2018 at 10:51 AM, knapplc said:

How the rest of the world sees America's gun addiction.

 

 

 

 

 Good stuff (especially when he was giving the phone number)

 

As an American gun owner, I can admit that this "addiction" is probably unique too the United States.... I can also admit that I couldn't care less what the rest of the world thinks of me, and what I keep in my gun safe. The same could be said for most of rural America, I'm sure.

[Landlord]

On 4/6/2018 at 8:48 PM, Ric Flair said:

You can’t argue ... that these kids are mature behind their years, we should take marching orders from them, they’re so wise, learned, etc. on the one hand and then any time even mild criticism is leveled at them, blow up about how they’re just poor little kids who shouldn’t be bullied. For God’s sake, at least be consistent.

 

 

Please show me when/where I argued that. Thanks in advance.

[Ric Flair]

57 minutes ago, Landlord said:

 

 

Please show me when/where I argued that. Thanks in advance.

 

I was pointing out the liberal hypocrisy on this issue. I thought that was clear. 

[knapplc]

On 4/6/2018 at 8:48 PM, Ric Flair said:

David Hogg is a clueless, mean-spirited jerk. Laura Ingraham shouldn’t have taken a personal shot at him, but given the personal shots Hogg and his ilk have taken at others, he’s in a poor position to complain and is a complete hypocrite when he does. Ingraham rightly apologized. Hogg, being a classless jerk, refused to accept her apology and instead is trying to end her career. And Ingraham is the bad person here? 

 

I'm super interested in direct quotes from David Hogg where he's taken "personal shots" at others.  Please post direct quotes from him, not someone's opinion of what he's saying, please.

[BigRedBuster]

Can someone please explain to me why Russia cares about supporting the NRA?

 

 

[ZRod]

3 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

Can someone please explain to me why Russia cares about supporting the NRA?

 

 

Probably the same reason they donate to the British Conservative Party.

[BigRedBuster]

1 minute ago, ZRod said:

Probably the same reason they donate to the British Conservative Party.

 

The NRA isn't a political party.