What did we learn Michigan Game

[Husker in WI]

10 minutes ago, runningblind said:

First of all, we have video of every game ever for scouting.  Second, why on earth would this be a penalty? What a dumb rule.

 

The only reason to do it is to get information that's not in the video - so, signals. I also think it's being way overblown, but there is a reason it's not allowed.

[Enhance]

1 hour ago, runningblind said:

First of all, we have video of every game ever for scouting.  Second, why on earth would this be a penalty? What a dumb rule.

My understanding of the rule Michigan is accused of violating is specifically in reference to NCAA Bylaw 11.6.1, stating "Off-campus, in-person scouting of future opponents (in the same season) is prohibited." So, they effectively are accused of going above and beyond what would be considered the current normal and acceptable opponent scouting standards.

As to why this rule is in place? I found this article from the Detroit Free Press.
 

Quote

In 1994, (...) it was instituted as a cost-saving measure for programs that were paying to send assistant coaches and various staff members to future opponents’ games.

I don't know enough about the rule to really be for or against it, but my stance on these things is usually... regardless of whether a rule is "good" or "bad"... teams should follow it. That, or don't get caught breaking it.

[Savage Husker]

Smells of NCAA ego not letting go of the fact they got punk’d by Harbaugh. Kind of a conundrum really, would never want this for my program and consider this a fishing expedition but also, f#&% Michigan/Harbaugh.

[GSG]

 

[ECisGod]

16 hours ago, Red Five said:

The NFL started using coach/QB comms in 1994!!!

I'm sure it's a cost thing.  Big schools like those in the B1G can easily afford them, but the smaller schools - especially the FCS teams that FBS teams play can't afford it.

[Fru]

2 hours ago, GSG said:

 

From the article “A source told ESPN that the Wolverines have used an "elaborate" scouting system to steal signals from future opponents since at least 2021.”

 

I always thought that the leap they made in 2021 was interesting. Their 2019 team was decent but their 2020 team was abysmal. If not for their final 3 games being called “No Contests” they likely finish the season 3-6. After the 2020 season Michigan retooled Jim’s contract to lower his buyout, and he hired a bunch of new assistants. (Where have we seen that before?) and then suddenly in 2021 they’re contenders. 

I’m not sure why so many around the CFB and sports world are scoffing at these allegations. The Schiano interview shows that he clearly knew what Michigan was up to. Not to mention that Harbaugh has routinely openly accused others of violating rules. OSU 2020 and Neb 2021 come to mind. Those who live in glass houses. 

[ZRod]

12 hours ago, Savage Husker said:

Smells of NCAA ego not letting go of the fact they got punk’d by Harbaugh. Kind of a conundrum really, would never want this for my program and consider this a fishing expedition but also, f#&% Michigan/Harbaugh.

The investigation came about because two other schools reported the stealing to the NCAA. I'm curious how they figured it out though...

[Red Five]

2 hours ago, ECisGod said:

I'm sure it's a cost thing.  Big schools like those in the B1G can easily afford them, but the smaller schools - especially the FCS teams that FBS teams play can't afford it.

 

Please.  Cost may have been an issue in 1999, but not now.  I'm not saying that all levels have to use it.  Let FBS teams use it.

 

And according to the below most teams already use a headset communication system that enables coach to player communication, the only extra cost/work would be to outfit helmets with radios.

 

A bigger issue than cost according to the article is that altering the helmets for a radio would invalidate their warranty, which could be a huge liability issue.  The NFL and the Players Union collectively bargain on helmets, so its not an issue for them.

 

https://theathletic.com/3194428/2022/03/21/why-doesnt-college-football-use-helmet-communication-like-the-nfl-inside-a-new-system-that-could-change-that/

[Enhance]

36 minutes ago, ZRod said:

I'm curious how they figured it out though...

I hope they release more details after the investigation concludes. My guess is the schools became suspicious during the game based on how Michigan was lining up pre-snap and/or reacting post-snap. Might've even found some corroborating evidence after the game during film review.

Although, I do find it interesting that the Yahoo Sport's article used the phrase that the opponents "became aware" that Michigan knew their play signs. That could mean there was some kind of whistleblower.

[Lorewarn]

1 hour ago, Fru said:

I’m not sure why so many around the CFB and sports world are scoffing at these allegations. The Schiano interview shows that he clearly knew what Michigan was up to. 

 

 

The Schiano interview doesn't show anything clearly. But here's some context that does make it more clear:

 

 

https://headtopics.com/us/rutgers-greg-schiano-explains-halftime-comment-penalties-after-loss-to-michigan-45057247

 

Rutgers’ Greg Schiano explains halftime comment, penalties after loss to Michigan

 

Schiano was asked about those three penalties in his halftime interview with the Big Ten Network, and his answer was cryptic: “There is some stuff going on out there, so we just have to slow it down. There are some things going on that aren’t right as well. So we’ll talk about how to handle it.”“Just the nuances of the game,” Schiano said. “I was frustrated with a few things. headtopics.com

Down 17-7, the Scarlet Knights faced a second-and-10 were at the Michigan 35-yard line. After quarterback Gavin Wimsatt failed to connect with wide receiver Isaiah Washington, a Wolverines defensive back celebrated effusively. A nearby referee thought it was too much and threw a flag that would have gifted Rutgers a first down at the Michigan 20-yard line.

Schiano said he received an explanation for the rescission of the call, but he did not want to share it. There was plenty of that for Schiano and company at the Big House on Saturday. The Scarlet Knights felt they could compete with the two-time defending Big Ten champions, and in the first two-and-a-half minutes, they were on the right path. But then came the first penalty, a sign of self-inflicted wounds to come, and things soon began to slowly unravel for Rutgers. headtopics.com

[nic]

Connor Stalions is part of the recruiting staff and not an analyst, although it sounds like he has a high desire to be a coach someday. He did spend lots of time studying game film. He sounds pretty intense from his Instagram posts. The theory is that he hired non Michigan persons to attend and film games to get him more game film. 

 

I am most curious about who is crying about the sign stealing. Probably Ryan Day. The Rutgers camp is denying it. They say Schiano's comments were directed at the refs.

[Mavric]

2 hours ago, Enhance said:

I hope they release more details after the investigation concludes. My guess is the schools became suspicious during the game based on how Michigan was lining up pre-snap and/or reacting post-snap. Might've even found some corroborating evidence after the game during film review.

Although, I do find it interesting that the Yahoo Sport's article used the phrase that the opponents "became aware" that Michigan knew their play signs. That could mean there was some kind of whistleblower.

 

Speculating based on Schiano's comments, I was guessing Michigan was able to react to calls/anticipate plays and they could see Michigan making late changes.

[Savage Husker]

3 hours ago, ZRod said:

The investigation came about because two other schools reported the stealing to the NCAA. I'm curious how they figured it out though...

lol ahh, that’s fair. Hedges my statement but still believe the NCAA would take any dirt on  Harbaugh annd investigate until they finally “get” him. I’m not a Harbaugh guy at all, but seems like they have an axe to grind compared to other shady doings. Or maybe Harbaugh really is just a sleaze, dunno.

[Cornfed]

14 minutes ago, Savage Husker said:

lol ahh, that’s fair. Hedges my statement but still believe the NCAA would take any dirt on  Harbaugh annd investigate until they finally “get” him. I’m not a Harbaugh guy at all, but seems like they have an axe to grind compared to other shady doings. Or maybe Harbaugh really is just a sleaze, dunno.

Could very well be both. 

[nic]

 

JJ: It's called Scouting and I am a Badger.

 

RG3: Then every team should be investigated.

 

Paul Finebaum...a Harbaugh Lover

Paul Finebaum, of all people, asserted on ESPN this morning that "If this had been someone else, this investigation probably would not have gotten to this point."